The strangest aspect to M2:TW politics...

[Oriflamme]

... is the inability of diplomats to say "get out of our territory or else!" You should be able to give the invader an ultimatum to get out in one turn or you are at war and it is the other side's fault.


Also if as (say) the English player I find a French army in English ruled Aquitaine and so I attack it, *I* am the aggressor even though he in on my turf! Very odd.

[Real]

Agreed. Hope they fix such basic problems in the expansion or at least in the next TW Game (if any)...

[Marku]

yeah thats pretty annoying, i try my best to get military access so everyone's happy.

[Shaun]

Well, when you move your armies into an opponents territory, you get a 'transgression' warning, and your relationship declines. However, an option to tell them to get the **** out of your land would be nice.

[MTM1977]

I agree. sometimes the enemy army just sits next to my city/castle. It would be cool to be able to say that "run back home dogs or we are in war", but no... i just have to let them be there or start a war without warning and hurt my own reputation.

[Oriflamme]

Well, when you move your armies into an opponents territory, you get a 'transgression' warning, and your relationship declines. However, an option to tell them to get the **** out of your land would be nice.

Really? I have yet to get one of those, unless you mean an alert that notes your relations with x have gotten worse. Plus I see no indication that the AI pays any penalty for wandering around your lands.

[Yoda Twin]

I don't think theres the Transgression thing anymore. They were in RTW though.

[Xraider]

Well it is,but you dont get the transgression thing itself.All what you get is Relations Worsened and thats all... The Get the hell out of my land is a good idea

[Oriflamme]

The Get the hell out of my land is a good idea

Although I have yet to get a mod to work for me (I'd love to try the Darth Mod but it just will not cooperate), maybe some leet skillz modder could make a "political ultimatums mod" that makes the other guy the aggressor if you attack him on your territory.

(Update: Darth Mod works just fine now! Huzzah!)

[Subzeroplainzero]

It would be nice to tell them to leave your territory but the ai is probably too foolish to even know which way to go.

[Snipafist]

You can effectively offer the same ultimatum by parking an army next to the offending trespassers. At that point, the AI gets the point and will choose to either leave or attack you.

[Grand Duke Vytautas]

You can effectively offer the same ultimatum by parking an army next to the offending trespassers. At that point, the AI gets the point and will choose to either leave or attack you.

Yep I've found that too - it's probably the only 'solution' to this AI camping thing

[Dr. Croccer]

The thing I don't get is why you can't shoo allied armies of your terrain because of transgression whilst they can shoo yours off.

[Snipafist]

I'll let you guys in on a little secret - if you replace the invade_raid and invade_opportunistic options from the campaign_ai_db file, the AI sends forces into your territory much less often, and when they're there, they're going to war with you. I've been very pleased with the change, myself.

[Oriflamme]

I'll let you guys in on a little secret - if you replace the invade_raid and invade_opportunistic options from the campaign_ai_db file, the AI sends forces into your territory much less often, and when they're there, they're going to war with you. I've been very pleased with the change, myself.

Fascinating! As it happens I have finally got Darth Mod to work (<scary deep voice>most impressive</scary deep voice>) and I don't know if its my imagination but I seem to get less of the odd 'camping' behaviour on my turf by the other factions.

In fact when I took a Rebel town (as English), the Scottish army which had been glowering at me an arrows flight away for the previous few turns (I had dashed to besiege the Rebels when I saw the Scots heading for them), promptly picked up their claymores and porrage bowls and immediately moved back across the new border. Dunno if that was random or maybe Darth Mod's AI is just more sensible.

[TW_ruler]

I was threatened with excommunication if I didn’t cease hostilities with France (I am England). Then France came on my territory and I attacked them and beat the heck out of them. No retribution was taken against me for that. Another time HRE was attacking me and the excommunication thing occurred while HRE was laying siege on London I sallied and killed them the next turn HRE was excommunicated. One other time as Spain the French started moving down into my territory and they sat there for turn after turn I did nothing we were not at war when they used a ship to block my port I then attacked his army that was on my territory and pushed them back the Pope screamed excommunication “cease hostilities” but France still had my port blocked I attacked him with a bigger fleet and sank them. No retaliation against me as a mater of fact my rep with the Pope went up on that one. So you guys are saying it is working the other way around for you? If you attack someone that’s on your territory you are at fault? Maybe these three examples are different from your situations as in the first two I was already at war and the last example I didn’t attack them because I wasn’t at war yet. Once I was forced into war I retaliated and maybe that’s what is different? I don’t know, but haven’t had problems riding my territories of unwanted scum then be at fault for doing so. Very interesting, I agree we need a diplomat that can deliver a warning to unwanted visitation by factions. Primarily if I’m not at war with them I don’t really care if they want to visit everyone knows I build the best cities around and the finest brothels no wonder they like to visit me. How can you blame them for that!
Rock on my brothers …

[Wize1]

I was threatened with excommunication if I didn’t cease hostilities with France (I am England). Then France came on my territory and I attacked them and beat the heck out of them. No retribution was taken against me for that. Another time HRE was attacking me and the excommunication thing occurred while HRE was laying siege on London I sallied and killed them the next turn HRE was excommunicated. One other time as Spain the French started moving down into my territory and they sat there for turn after turn I did nothing we were not at war when they used a ship to block my port I then attacked his army that was on my territory and pushed them back the Pope screamed excommunication “cease hostilities” but France still had my port blocked I attacked him with a bigger fleet and sank them. No retaliation against me as a mater of fact my rep with the Pope went up on that one. So you guys are saying it is working the other way around for you? If you attack someone that’s on your territory you are at fault? Maybe these three examples are different from your situations as in the first two I was already at war and the last example I didn’t attack them because I wasn’t at war yet. Once I was forced into war I retaliated and maybe that’s what is different? I don’t know, but haven’t had problems riding my territories of unwanted scum then be at fault for doing so. Very interesting, I agree we need a diplomat that can deliver a warning to unwanted visitation by factions. Primarily if I’m not at war with them I don’t really care if they want to visit everyone knows I build the best cities around and the finest brothels no wonder they like to visit me. How can you blame them for that!
Rock on my brothers …

Wow, that made me laugh so hard.

[HaveFallen]

I hate it when an Army stack is sitting right next to your city/castle, I wish there was a way to change that...

[Snipafist]

What they're saying is that you get the diplomatic hit for starting a war when you're engaging an enemy in your own turf, which seems a little unfair. When the Pope tells you to stop hostilities, you've still got the right to defend yourself - he'll only get upset at you if you attack an enemy outside your territory or an enemy fleet that isn't blockading your port. These two are similar, but different, circumstances.

[Gary88]

... is the inability of diplomats to say "get out of our territory or else!" You should be able to give the invader an ultimatum to get out in one turn or you are at war and it is the other side's fault.

QFT

but the most annoying part is

"why sire we are overjoyed to accept your offer of aliance but in 6 turns we shal lay siege to your most undefended township...MWAHAHAHAH"
"sorry what was that last but?"
"oh er nothing