Page 1 of 8 12345678 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 151

Thread: Ultimate Battle AI 1.2 *UPDATE*

  1. #1
    GrandViZ's Avatar Domesticus
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,026

    Default Ultimate Battle AI 1.2 *UPDATE*

    Ultimate Battle AI by GrandViZ
    Version 1.2 (requires Official Patch 1.2)

    *** NEW UPDATED VERSION ***

    Thanks to all the users for their valuable feedback, that helped to improve this version!

    Download
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/downl...o=file&id=1602



    Description


    Fixed issues

    - Passive AI, that does not attack, although it is outgunned in regard to ranged units
    - Responsiveness of units to move and formation changes orders: decreased the delay significantly
    - Siege AI will no longer line up its forces in front of a settlement

    Open field battles
    - Skirmish behavior of ranged units is more tolerant against nearby enemy units, resulting in less back and forth movement and more effective shooting time
    - Reduced requirements for outflanking movements, so AI cavalry will flank more
    - Better formation cohesion *NEW*

    Siege battles
    - AI will defend wall positions longer, before retreating to the center
    - Reduced the threat level of siege engines, and at the same time increased the threat level of enemy units
    - Idle AI units should be less frequent
    - Improved assault AI

    Other
    - New projectile values for ranged and artillery units
    - Mass values for different artillery projectiles have been balanced according to available historical sources, however it was necessary to introduce some abstraction in regard to game balance
    - New differentiated arrow model by Point Blank *NEW*
    - Improved projectile effects by Point Blank *NEW*
    - Gates, walls and towers get more hitpoints with every upgrade level: higher level castles will require heavy siege equipment

    AI Formations
    - New AI formations for settlement assault and defense
    - Six new AI formations for open field battles



    Recommended EDU.txt
    - Includes latest EDU.txt from the Real Combat Mod by Point Blank
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=115939

    Installation
    The files belong in the ../M2TW/ultimateAI/data folder, or respectively in the data folder of your favourite mod.

    If you want to use the files with the vanilla game, you have to put the files into the M2TW/data folder and start the game with the
    -io.file_first option.

    Herefore open your medieval2.preference.cfg and add the lines
    [io]
    file_first = true

    Note also, that not all mods support the included EDU.txt, in this case use only the other files.

    Permission of Use
    This mod is for personal use only. An integration into other mods requires my explicit permission.
    Last edited by GrandViZ; September 12, 2007 at 05:11 AM.
    Creator of the Ultimate AI
    Co-Author of Broken Crescent

    Under the Patronage of Trajan

  2. #2
    Average British Student
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    England
    Posts
    2,908

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Congratulations on your work on your Ultimate Battle AI Mod. I hopefully be able to test it out tomorrow and post feedback so you can improve your mod

    wipeout

  3. #3

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Congrat GrandViz!

    Another masterpiece from the man himself! Can I test it with the current UAI 1.5. Can the 2 mods combine together?

    Thanks

  4. #4
    GrandViZ's Avatar Domesticus
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,026

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Yes, but do not overwrite the EDU.txt if you use the King's Banner mod for UAI, as it will overwrite the banner changes.

    And UAI 1.6 will include the new battle AI of course!
    Creator of the Ultimate AI
    Co-Author of Broken Crescent

    Under the Patronage of Trajan

  5. #5

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Looks good, thank you.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Quote Originally Posted by GrandViZ View Post
    Yes, but do not overwrite the EDU.txt if you use the King's Banner mod for UAI, as it will overwrite the banner changes.

    And UAI 1.6 will include the new battle AI of course!
    And when could we expect 1.6?

  7. #7

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    @GrandViZ
    Could you provide more info as to what changes to projectile.txt were made?

  8. #8

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    So far i have playtested it in 6 battles and 2 sieges and want to give a little feedback, although it is only a first impression, of course. I am using RC 1.2 right now.

    The AI behaviour in pitched battles is excellent. No longer will the enemy wait untill half his army is peltered with arrows, then turn back and run for the battlefield´s edge, but change to an aggressive stance. I have even seen a unit of Halberdiers trying to "chase" my horse archers. Senseless, true, but what other choice did they have?

    The units change their formation faster than before, an important point, especially for cavalry and polearm-units.

    Concerning the sieges i tried, there seems to be a problem. I tried to storm a wooden wall with scaling ladders and siege towers. On the walls were mostly mercenary crossbowmen. The AI positioned its units either on the wall or near the gate, obviously preparing to defend the town´s perimeter, as you indicated they should. My units (in both cases armoured sergeants and imperial knights) reached the walls with their siege equipment and started to climb the tower/the ladders. As soon as they reached the battlements, they turned tail and feld, from where they came. In the case of siege towers, they weren´t even half way up the walls. A unit of imperial knights scaled a part of the wall, which was not defended, ran for the next wall section, where some town militia was loitering about and as soon as the first knight came into close combat range the unit fled. Therefore i assume, that this behaviour has to do with the increased threat level of units, although that is just a wild guess. To this point my attacking units had not sufferd many casaulties by ranged weapons (about 10-15 each) and the generals were not too bad. (2 and 4 stars respecttively, no morale-reducing traits.) As soon as the cowards brought a little distance between them and the enemy they all easily rallied.

    I only played two sieges though, so these might be exceptions. I will give more feedback tomorrow.

    In general though: Thumbs up!

    PS: Adding a short note about where to install those files might be helpful to avoid confusion for some people.
    Last edited by Konstantin Alexander; June 15, 2007 at 09:01 PM.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Yes GrandViz! some info. as to where do I install these new battle AI file would be much helpful to us.

    Thanks.

  10. #10
    GrandViZ's Avatar Domesticus
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,026

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    OK some easy installation instructions have been added to the first post.

    In regard to projectiles, I changed the projectile size, mass, accuracy, damage, damage area, velocity, and the angle it can be fired. Compare the values with the vanilla file, if you want to know exactly.

    @Konstantin Alexander
    AI Units tend to fall back on small sized settlements faster, because of the proximity to the settlement plaza. You may want to test, a siege with a medium sized settlement or castle.
    Creator of the Ultimate AI
    Co-Author of Broken Crescent

    Under the Patronage of Trajan

  11. #11

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    I'm still playing around with the field battles, but i've got a few comments for the AI when it is attacking a settlement.

    The Good:
    AI stretched my forces by using its ladders and towers across the width of my walls distances apart.
    AI recollected ladders and a ram to attack the second level of walls.
    AI used missile troops to help storm the gate once they were unable to make an input with their ranged weapons.

    The Bad:
    Pathfinding was not brilliant, when ordering some archers to enter the second level of walls, some archers just ran against the walls and failed to enter.
    The AI did not target weak areas of my defence, two portions of my wall were defended by spear militia, they could have been overrun if an extra set of ladders had been devoted to that section of wall.
    One AI unit became idle once it had forced its way onto the walls, this would not have been so bad, but the wall was being defended, and the AI unit was therefore quickly destroyed.
    The AI stormed the gate (defended by pikes) with cavalry, including its General.
    The attack on the second set of walls was not properly organized, the AI did not use all its seige equipment together and did not target undefended walls or the undefended gate. I did find that this aspect was improved over Vanilla however, as some units did arrive at the walls together.

    Overall it was more challenging than Vanilla and more fun but i have some suggestions. In order to prevent the AI from resorting to sending in cavalry in a gate defense you could reduce the time taken to ram the gate. By the time the AI broke through the gate most of its troops had already been committed to the walls, unless you can get the AI to reserve troops for the gate attack, i think you will find that the AI will simply concentrate on the walls. You might also want to reduce the tendency of cavalry to charge pikes, and (this is more for RC) reduce the number of men in the Generals Bodyguard so that it is valued less as an offensive unit. If there is another way to stop the General being used offensively i suggest you look at that also. I recognize that the seige AI is particularly hard to optimize but i found that the AI was not very "inventive" or dynamic in finding the weak areas of my defense and seemed to chose its targets arbitrarily.

    Good job, a new reason to use Real Combat and UAI!
    Popular superstition is still superstition.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    After another day of playtesting, the problem, which i described above did not reoccur. It seems these two sieges were isolated cases and might have something to do with the fact that i just continued a campaign, which i started without UAI-battles. I tested wooden walls, castles with one and two walls and cities with the best possible walls.

    I can confirm, though, what onefistedboxer says about the enemy´s cavalry attacking the broken gate. Two or three pike units can really mess up the enemy´s cavalry attack and often the enemy´s general is participating in these hopeless attacks and gets himself killed. It would be a huge improvement, if you could make the AI to keep some infantry in reserve for the gate attack (preferably axemen and swordsmen) and the generals´ bodyguard to stay away from pike and halberdier-units. So far the AI is really concentrating on the walls and all what is left for attacking a broken gate is cavalry.

    Despite of all this (i hope constructive) critizism i have to say, that battles are really more challenging than before. Once again you did a great job in improving the game.
    Ist dir wirklich gut gelungen, dank dir für die Mühe, die du in dieses Spiel steckst.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Also, if you happen to have Longbows or any unit with the special pre-battle ability to set pikes the A.I. still rushes in with cavarly and seems not to 'understand' that all cavalry units will get shredded.
    Basically you place your longbow unit just before the gate, use the deploy pikes ability & when battle start relocate the unit to the wall so it can use arrows.
    The A.I. rushes the pikes with cavalry usually being first.
    This happens with vanilla as well.

    Also I have not seen the A.I. employ that special ability.

    But overall I think it is definitely better than vanilla.

  14. #14
    GrandViZ's Avatar Domesticus
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,026

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Thank you all for your feedback. I noted many of you wrote feedback on settlement assault, but if you read the description, you would have noticed a TODO, that says settlement assault.

    However, I am not sure, if settlement assault can be improved at all, as the number of available modding parameters is very limited, but I'll investigate this aspect for the next update.

    Quote Originally Posted by onefistedboxer
    Pathfinding was not brilliant, when ordering some archers to enter the second level of walls, some archers just ran against the walls and failed to enter.
    This is not a pathfinding, but a clipping issue. When some units get stuck because of bad collision detection, the whole formation will stop.

    Basically you place your longbow unit just before the gate, use the deploy pikes ability & when battle start relocate the unit to the wall so it can use arrows.
    I would consider this as an exploit, as the AI is unable to recognize the pikes ability in a siege battle. It also has no possibility to outflank a gate, that is protected in such a way.

    Despite of all this (i hope constructive) critizism i have to say, that battles are really more challenging than before. Once again you did a great job in improving the game.
    Constructive critizism is the modders best help!

    Regards
    GrandViZ
    Creator of the Ultimate AI
    Co-Author of Broken Crescent

    Under the Patronage of Trajan

  15. #15
    DrBeast's Avatar Biarchus
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Somewhere Out In Space
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Field battle reports (only tested one siege battle with me being the attacker):

    1 vs. 1 Dismounted Longbowmen vs. Feudal Knights:
    Enemy cavalry ACTIVELY tries to avoid stakes, countering my archers moves accordingly. WOW! However, after their first attempt and one pretty devastating charge, which wiped out half my archers, they move away a bit (to recharge), but magically transform from a wrecking ball to sitting ducks and get shot to pieces. Looks like their brain fried from the initial attampt

    Generic 1 vs. 1 infantry:
    Units always start out as streched out as possible, enemy AI reforms "on the march" to deeper lines. I have to reform my units manually, of course. I like to keep my infantry 3 (shock troops), 4 (sword+shield inf), 5 (spearmen), or 8 (pikemen) lines deep, as I have them in my EDU.
    Enemy units sometimes keep "charging" even after initial impact, resulting in sword+shield units slaughtering shock troops who were counter-charging. Rate of occurence (with regards to troop type): shock troops vs. shock troops > sword+shield troops vs. shock troops > sword+shield vs. sword+shield. In almost all the cases, AI troops prolong their charge more often than mine.

    That's all I can remember. I'll report back if I spot anything else worth mentioning. All in all, a very good first stab GrandViz!

    I should mention that I use the latest RC beta (attack and defense values, unit mass) with some modifications (Darth's older formations with minor tweaking with regards to lines formed, and my personal touch on some units I felt were way over- or underpowered)...but you already know that, don't you?

  16. #16
    GrandViZ's Avatar Domesticus
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,026

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Quote Originally Posted by DrBeast View Post
    I should mention that I use the latest RC beta (attack and defense values, unit mass) with some modifications (Darth's older formations with minor tweaking with regards to lines formed, and my personal touch on some units I felt were way over- or underpowered)...but you already know that, don't you?
    I am not sure, what you are talking about?
    Creator of the Ultimate AI
    Co-Author of Broken Crescent

    Under the Patronage of Trajan

  17. #17
    DrBeast's Avatar Biarchus
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Somewhere Out In Space
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Heh...never mind, I just see that you're posting over at the RC thread as well, and I've mentioned time and again the modifications I've made to the RC EDU.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    I recently played a custom battle as a defender on prof's castle map with myself defending from the castle side. This map probably comes under the catagory of river crossing, due to all the bridges, so i thought you'd be interested in AI behavior as you've listed crossings as a future target. Not much to report unfortunately as the AI just lined up in no particular order and did not move, for the duration of the battle. In a second battle the AI was able to deploy on the bridge side, it ignored their strategic value however and deployed nearest to me (the AI was not set to defend for the second battle however).
    Popular superstition is still superstition.

  19. #19
    DrBeast's Avatar Biarchus
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Somewhere Out In Space
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    More on the "prolonged charge" issue.
    I think I've found what's causing it: unit cohesion. When charging a tightly packed unit, the charge will go on and on and on until the unit being charged loses cohesion. I did some battles vs. pike units, and it was crystal clear. Mainly, I attacked a unit of Noble Pikemen with 1 unit of Sudanese Tribesmen and 1 unit of Tabardariyya. The Pikemen had formed a spearwall, and I charged them from the front with the Tribesmen, while manouevering the axemen to charge from the rear. It took 3 rear charges from the axemen to dissolve the pikemen's formation enough for the Tribesmen to finally finish their initial charge. In my EDU the pikemen are super-tightly packed (formation set at 0, 0 for tight formation).

    Btw, is there a quick way to have the units start with their initial formation, with regards to deepness? After yesterday's tests (see my post in the RC thread), I got sick and tired of having to rearrange my units at the start of EVERY battle!

  20. #20
    GrandViZ's Avatar Domesticus
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Posts
    2,026

    Default Re: Ultimate Battle AI 1.0

    Quote Originally Posted by DrBeast View Post
    More on the "prolonged charge" issue.
    I think I've found what's causing it: unit cohesion. When charging a tightly packed unit, the charge will go on and on and on until the unit being charged loses cohesion.
    When I get you right, you say the issue is caused by the changed formation values in RC? I'll try tight formation values.

    Btw, is there a quick way to have the units start with their initial formation, with regards to deepness? After yesterday's tests (see my post in the RC thread), I got sick and tired of having to rearrange my units at the start of EVERY battle!
    I haven't touched formations for the human player, but it seems the AI file has an effect on the starting formation here as well. I'll investigate.

    Why do you dislike deep formations?
    Creator of the Ultimate AI
    Co-Author of Broken Crescent

    Under the Patronage of Trajan

Page 1 of 8 12345678 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •