sociopaths, psychopaths

[Chaigidel]

would it be ethical to exterminate these people if we could find a way to certainly identify them--- 1 they will most likely be criminals

2 they will most likely be violent
3 they will most likely be dangerous

so the ethical thing to do for the entire society is to exterminate these sorts of people whenever they are found. ---

like people who enjoy killing, or enjoy torturing animals--- this is psychopathic behavior

thoughts on how we should handle the defective and dangerous members of society

[LegionnaireX]

I'd think it would be better to try and find a way to help and change these people first before we just go off and execute people. It's a rather tough call here though. To change people prewired to be sociopaths is a little too Clockwork Orangish.

[Chaigidel]

but its agreed these sorts of people once discovered must be monitored and carefully cared for execution notwithstanding ?

[LegionnaireX]

but its agreed these sorts of people once discovered must be monitored and carefully cared for execution notwithstanding ?

Yes, they should be monitered or institutionalized. I don't think you can necessarily go and executed them before they commit a crime. That would be unfair and a little too Minority Report-ish for my tastes.

[Zephrelial]

I'm wondering about a certain thing.What exactly is the difference between sociapaths and psychopaths?

[Chaigidel]

I think a sociopath is incapable of empathy---or incapable of understanding anyone elses point of view , and feels as if all things are owed to him, so to speak its a self-centered universe --- what I want when I want it however I want it , then I have the right to take it =--- thats a sociopath

a psychopath is like a sociopath except he truly enjoys causing harm and cruelty to all things, cruelty in his relationships and anyone he is in contact with unlike the sociopath who simply has no emotion when it comes to other people.

[Zephrelial]

I think a sociopath is incapable of empathy---or incapable of understanding anyone elses point of view , and feels as if all things are owed to him, so to speak its a self-centered universe --- what I want when I want it however I want it , then I have the right to take it =--- thats a sociopath

a psychopath is like a sociopath except he truly enjoys causing harm and cruelty to all things, cruelty in his relationships and anyone he is in contact with unlike the sociopath who simply has no emotion when it comes to other people.

Ah now I get it,you explained very well.Thank you.

[DisgruntledGoat]

There is no difference between sociopath and psychopath. They are just two terms for the same condition. However some believe they are two different things, I think, but not as you described them. I guess I should check wikipedia but I'm too lazy.

[Chaigidel]

but the question remains should these people be dealt with or are they acceptable to the society as a whole?

[Garbarsardar]

would it be ethical to exterminate these people if we could find a way to certainly identify them--- 1 they will most likely be criminals

2 they will most likely be violent
3 they will most likely be dangerous

so the ethical thing to do for the entire society is to exterminate these sorts of people whenever they are found. ---

like people who enjoy killing, or enjoy torturing animals--- this is psychopathic behavior

thoughts on how we should handle the defective and dangerous members of society

Bring me one published, peer reviewed study that demonstrates that "psychopaths" and "sociopaths" are more likely to commit a crime that the general population is.

Also keep in mind that both diagnoses are usually produced after someone commits a crime.

But I see where the OP comes from. It is very convenient to label criminals as psychopaths and vice-versum. It actually help us forget that the large majority of criminals are people like us and that the most horrendous crimes in the history of mankind were committed by people that had at least the approval of their peers.

Sensational and grossly inaccurate and incomplete media reports have conjured up stereotypical portrayals of the mentally ill as crazed and violent lunatics, dangerous to others as well as themselves. The truth is that the vast majority of people with mental illness are not violent. The great majority of crimes of violence are not committed by persons who are mentally ill, in any generally acceptable sense of the term. In the relatively few instances where mentally ill people do become violent, the incident typically results from the same reasons as with the general public, such as feelings of being threatened, or excessive use of drugs and/or alcohol.http://mentalhealthlibrary.info/libr...n/morrison.htm

It's funny that the first people that Hitler exterminated were mentally ill.

And anyway all the claims presented have zero scientific credibility.

Prove me wrong.

[DisgruntledGoat]

Dealt with by murdering them. Of course not. Even if we can identify sociopaths early, which really doesn't make sense since its social and environmental conditions that create the condition, there would be no way to know they will kill someone until they do. Sure they may show some signs but it would be absurd to condemn someone to death with that. As it stands now I think we do are best with people like this, if they are identified they are monitored and receive treatment. Beyond that there really isn't anything one can do.

Anyways, this whole thread is just as absurd as your genocide thread.

[enoch]

sociopathology is a distinct advantage
think about the most successful people you know

a sociopath (and most actual sociopaths are intelligent) is adaptable to anything, and able to conform to any belief they choose, and abandon said belief without baggage

it is really just natural openmindedness, lack of inhibition
which they can learn and enforce upon themselves

I find that most of the people I have come across who are successful on pure talent, had a lot of the sociopath in them.

I know I do.
It is not what one would think, and there is a range, as always.

and all survivors are sociopaths when push comes to shove
every ******* one

[Garbarsardar]

I'm sorry for my tone here but as part of my profession I have to deal with this rubbish for the best part of my life. The OP has better to produce one friggin study. One!

Murders committed by mentally ill people are not on the increase, despite popular belief, psychiatrists have claimed. People who have drunk too much or taken drugs are more likely to kill someone, they said.

The finding comes in a study by the Royal College of Psychiatrists (RCPsych), which found a steady decline in the proportion of murders committed by people with mental disorders between 1957 and 1995.

It concludes that people are more likely to win the National Lottery jackpot than to die at the hand of a stranger with a mental illness.

It also says the finding proves that the care in the community scheme is not a "dangerous experiment" and should not be reversed.

However, high-profile murder cases involving schizophrenic patients in community care have led the public to fear attacks from mentally ill people and the government to review the scheme.

http://www.namiscc.org/newsletters/D...statistics.htm

[Chaigidel]

yes genocide is totally absurd and so is being able to find someone and single them out for almost anything--- but it all exists in our beautiful world

anyway I would contend that there are people who enjoy cruelty and that these people would be more than likely the ones who would be willing to do harm to others for profit or joy, hence criminals --- I am in the ethos because Im not here to cite papers gab, that would be a for a scientific discussion on the validity of the term sociopath

intuitively speaking if we could find people who would murder, rape, and generally cause harm to others or some way to identify them then would we or wouldnt we be obligated to at least imprison them? or keep them for observation for a period of time.

[Garbarsardar]

anyway I would contend that there are people who enjoy cruelty and that these people would be more than likely the ones who would be willing to do harm to others for profit or joy, hence criminals --- I am in the ethos because Im not here to cite papers gab, that would be a for a scientific discussion on the validity of the term sociopath

You besmirch and propose "solutions" for a number of people without producing any evidence. I do not care where you are, what you say is plain nonsense, there is not one shred of evidence in your favour and you try to say that you don't need evidence because you are in a part of a forum where evidence is not needed?

[enoch]

ongoing study





some of us should really consider this

[Chaigidel]

I am just saying im totally operating on opinion, I wont offer any evidence because I wont go looking for it I fully accept any evidence you offer at your choosing

this is all opinion and no im not obligated to base an opinion on any sort of a fact( it may be foolish but I am in no way limited in that respect)

as you can see i reposed the question to be a philosophical one, I dont claim any knowledge of psychology and my use of the term sociopath was based on heresay so to speak

now simply think about the question rather than being caught up in the details, again this is not about facts its about each persons , intuitive feelings on the subject of criminal types and those that would do us harm among our own species

and how you would deal with them if you could find them --- all of this being hypothetical

[Garbarsardar]

I am just saying im totally operating on opinion, I wont offer any evidence because I wont go looking for it I fully accept any evidence you offer at your choosing

Then your opinion is baseless, unfounded, erroneous and unscientific.

this is all opinion and no im not obligated to base an opinion on any sort of a fact( it may be foolish but I am in no way limited in that respect)

Of course. Please let no facts stand in your way.

as you can see i reposed the question to be a philosophical one, I dont claim any knowledge of psychology and my use of the term sociopath was based on heresay so to speak

Yes, a philosophical question based on two false premises. That criminals are mentally ill and mentally ill are more likely to be criminals. Based on hearsay I can retort that people that post such threads have the sole intend of provoking others into violent reaction. So I hear.

now simply think about the question rather than being caught up in the details, again this is not about facts its about each persons , intuitive feelings on the subject of criminal types and those that would do us harm among our own species

Ah, yes. Details. Like the fact that you cannot use any of the terms you used because you don't know what those mean and that intuitive feelings, hair rising at the back of your neck, little angels or devils whispering at your ear and monkeys on your back are not a good basis for a discussion.

and how you would deal with them if you could find them --- all of this being hypothetical

Hypothetically speaking, if you could find something that do not exist, in a situation that does not happen, in a context that is absent, then, you could deal with it in a number of hypothetical ways.

[Chaigidel]

you mentioned this issue being personal to you gab can you explain please

your above points are all correct save one--- this is not to provoke anyone other than to consider the ethics of singliing people out so to speak on a genetic or scientific basis--- I freely admit I was just going by the way I understood things never having studied the subject--- but I wasnt aware I needed to fully understand things to ask about them and to develop dialouge(sp) about them, in fact I think thats how people learn--- so thanks for clarifying

but please without the use of an article can you explain what if anything sociopath/psychopath terms mean?

and please tell me how you are connected with such things (at your will of course)

forgive me for angering you in this matter, I did not intend to anger I intended to cause thought.

[DisgruntledGoat]

your above points are all correct save one--- this is not to provoke anyone other than to consider the ethics of singliing people out so to speak on a genetic or scientific basis---.

Based on your previous threads and the above post would it be fair to say you openly accept eugenics and would implement murder of people based solely on what their genetic make-up is?