Removal of Senate = 66/67bc Crash?

[Candelarius]

Lusted,

In the RTRPE mod, we have been plagued with reports of the dreaded year 66/67bc crash, the cause of which Marcus Camillus thinks is the fact that the Senate faction was completely erased in the mod. The theory is that when the year 66/67bc occurs, the game "checks" for the other Roman factions to start the hard-coded civil war, and, when the Senate faction is not present, the game immediately does a CTD.

I noticed in your mod you have also erased the Senate complete from descr_strat. Have you experienced a 66/67bc CTD? Or has any other TE fan reported such a problem? Has anyone played your TE mod through to completion without a CTD playing as the Romans?

I ask for personal reasons because I am playing your mod and also to help Marcus out with the problems reported with the RTRPE mod.

Thanks,
Candelarius

[Lusted]

Not sure how much help i can be, i never played that far into a campaign. There were various rare end of turn ctd bugs that happened but they seem to be random as the year always varied.

[dvk901]

You might want to ask EB as well, because they have erased the Senate. I have done the same thing in Roma Surrectum, but it isn't released yet.

[Candelarius]

Hmmm. Thanks anyway. I'm just curious if anybody has ever played a Rome campaign through without a single CTD. I played several RTR Gold 1.2 campaigns through to completion without a single CTD, but, since we (modders) starting removing the Senate, and since RTRPE starting having numerous CTD reported issues, I've been wondering if the deletion of the Senate from descr_strat is the culpret for such random CTDs.

I'll ask EB. Thanks!

[Teleklos Archelaou]

I don't know if we remember actually - it has been a long time ago that we made this change and we have had some turnover in the folks that dealt with that stuff.

I am almost certain that many people have played EB past that date though. I can't say 100%, but I would be incredibly shocked if the problem exists but no one has ever run into it or posted on it.

I think that we got the information on how to do it from RTR though. I might be wrong, but I believe they helped us out on that.

[Candelarius]

Thanks Teleklos, I was just curious. I know that people who play RTRPE were complaining about it (and the RTRPE team wasn't even sure if it was a coincidence or a "real issue") so I was trying to figure out if the other mods that feature the removel of the Senate had any knowledge of the matter. Thanks again anyway!

[irishron]

It's been a long time since I saw anything on removing the Senate, maybe somebody can correct me if I'm wrong or point us to the old thread that handled this, you have to remove all traces of the Senate. This includes descr_strat, descr_region, sm_factions, EDB, and hard teliing where else including scripts. From my understanding, if the hardcode even thinks anything says Senate, crash.

[Candelarius]

So is the crash caused by a left-behind reference to the Senate somewhere or from the fact the Senate was removed at all?

What's most amusing is nobody, apparently, ever plays a campaign far enough along to even know! Yet people insist on 4typr mods!

[florin80]

Yet people insist on 4typr mods!

But that is actually the answer to the problem. With 4tpy you`ll die of old age before you get to the CTD year.

[Candelarius]

But that is actually the answer to the problem. With 4tpy you`ll die of old age before you get to the CTD year.

So true!

[Cyrus the Virus]

Yet people insist on 4typr mods!

Guess that one was pointed to me

[dvk901]

Did you replace the senate with another faction, or just eliminate it?

[irishron]

Replacing the Senate with another faction = ctd.

[Candelarius]

Guess that one was pointed to me

No, really it wasn't. The vast majority of the modding community is in love with 4tpy scripts. I personally don't like them because I find it impossible to finish a campaign then in a reasonable amount of time.

Replacing the Senate with another faction = ctd.

Did TE replace the Senate or remove it?

[florin80]

Did TE replace the Senate or remove it?

Well..... Lusted?

[dvk901]

Well..... Lusted?

As far as I know, TE simply makes the Senate unplayable, and removes it only from descr_strat.txt so as to unify Rome.

[irishron]

@candelarius,
The Senate is all over the folders in RTW. Looks like the only thing Lusted did was take out the "supfaction" line so he could use Brutii and Scipii slots for Epirus and Bactria respectively. Unless Lusted proves me wrong, the Senate is alive and well in the background and waiting to make life hard.

[dvk901]

I wonder, would there be a way to write script entry that, at year 69BC, when you end turn, sets the date to 65BC...thereby skipping the troublesome dates. If you can't beat 'em, FOOL 'em?

[irishron]

From what I understand, the problem is not a certain date or a range of dates, it is when the Republic of Rome gets its first imperial palace and the Marian reforms kick in. That part is hardcoded. Find a way to fool the hardcode and you are home.

[cherryfunk]

From what I understand, the problem is not a certain date or a range of dates, it is when the Republic of Rome gets its first imperial palace and the Marian reforms kick in. That part is hardcoded. Find a way to fool the hardcode and you are home.

But don't both RTR and EB replace the Senate with a playable faction? And haven't thousands of players triggered the Reforms in those mods without a CTD? I don't see how the Reforms could be the problem...