AI (enemy)Units Not Acting Cohesively

Recently dived back into RS3 as I want to fight out a diadochi war, I've had this problem on a previous install and have posted before about it but didn't get an answer to solve the porblem

Playing on Steam - ALX.
RS3 patched to RS3.1.
1 Turn (Seleuicids and Rome)
I've copied the Alex formation AI from the 'Important Stuff' folder.
I've chosen Sinuhet formations and tried Athenogras as well.
I've tried subbing in and out units stats form RS2.6 and RS3 original.
M/M

Examples

Battle of Raphia;
I (Seleucids) attack Ptolemy. I advance. Ptolemy general charges my phalanes leaving his entire army behind him. His phalanx run forward, break formation and run back. Ptolemy dies. The enemy send one phalanx at a time forward. I destroy them one by one.

Battle of Lake trasimene;
Hannibal attacks.
Hannibal charges ahead of his army. His numidian cavalry charge head on into my polybian cohorts and don't flank. They lose head to head. Infantry stays behind, but one unit at a time advances allowing me to deal with them one by one. Hannibal stays fighting allowing me to surround and kill him as he's isolated.

This seems to be the case no matter what battle Ai formation I choose and I have subbed in and out the old RS2.6 units stats and new RS3 unit stats.

We're all downloading the same RS3 files aren't we? Is this not a common problem and if so how have you fixed it? Please help

@Agrippa on Medium difficulty I have found seems to play favorably into the hands of the player, have you tried stepping up to Hard difficulty. I am currently playing as The Seleucids in my Let's Play (H/VH, sinuhet AI battle formation), have a look if you like https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...CVtnl-K_27igVB

Playing as Seleucids with the standard BAI, I never had those problems. In Raphia the Ptolemies did an excellent job and gave me a run for the money.

There are single Units charging my line, but most times it is a problem for me, because those are pining my whole phalanx and therefore disrupting my attack, and I therefore have to flank around some troops to deals with those units, which again exposes those flankers to the Enemy main line.... can lead to some very problematic situations, especially if those are high defense Units like Armenian Heavies...

Sounds like RTW AI to me ;)

Also, single phalanx units charging you seems better than when it has 2 lines of phalanx and it just sends them into your center making one big messy blob.

Seems like it's just me then. I'm beginning to think its maybe something to with steam or windows 10 but I don't have this problem with other mods, it's specific to RS3. Ive been playing roma on and off since 2012 and I've noticed a huge change in AI battlefield behaviour in a game breaking fashion since this update but I just don't understand why it's only me?

Just to be clear I don't mind this as in I don't like how it performs, I mean it an a way that it's unplayable as the enemy exhausts itself reshuffling its lines and units don't respond appropriately to my actions, whereas before and on other rtw mods they do. I just don't get it as this is my favourite mod I just want to get the battles to work as they used to for me.

Update: so after swapping out more files I tried out the 'higher lethality' stats combined with Sinuhet formations and I've noticed a significant improvement.

This is on Alex engine on steam, just found it strange that all the other files lead to such manic behaviour. It's been reported before but I think development on the mod has slowed down so it wasn't picked up on sadly.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Agrippa19

Update: so after swapping out more files I tried out the 'higher lethality' stats combined with Sinuhet formations and I've noticed a significant improvement.

This is on Alex engine on steam, just found it strange that all the other files lead to such manic behaviour. It's been reported before but I think development on the mod has slowed down so it wasn't picked up on sadly.

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Both RS 2.6 and RS 3.1 edu files are completely broken imho ,
take edu , battle movement modifiers and desc strat from rs2.5 and copy to 3.1 for starters for a better experience altogether , {fix cataphract elephants though and remove thrace from roman generals}
Then fix the script to your liking ...hey presto ..its like night and day.;)

Thanks for the response Granto, does anybody happen to have a RS2.5 stats file on their pc for Rome 1-turn they could upload? Or all 1-turn campaigns would be great please. I've looked in the EDU changes files on my rs3.1 install but it seems a copy of the 2.5 stats are not included. The battle lines worked perfectly for me in that version (other than the bugs granto mentioned regarding elephants).

Update: For anyone if it helps.

So I installed RS2.5 into a temporary file outside my main RS3 install location.

-I copied the export_descr_unit stats from the Rome 1-turn in the RS2.5 file and pasted into my RS3 Rome 1 turn file.
-I fixed the elephant cataphract stats and removed thrace from Roman general in that export_descr_unit file.
-When loading I got a CTD saying "Script error in play_rome_one_turn/data/export_descr_buildings.txt (bla bla bla) -unknown unit type specified: allied germanic cavalry.
-I opened export_descr_buildings (notepad) and went to all lines that specified allied germanic cavalry and DELETED their entries. (Hard pill to swallow as I like that unit and don't believe I can use them in the campaign now).
-This fixed the CTD and I can play the campaign.

However I've noticed a very competent battle ai now. It's so vastly improved. The enemy army is acting in unison, the phalanx move in a line and they don't send units forward one at a time to be picked apart. The generals also behave rationally and don't charge ahead by themselves. Sometimes they reshuffle their lines, however this sporadic and not to the point of exhaustion. BUT the one problem I'm having is that the budget seems to be completely unable to predict my finances at end of turn. It's fine and after 15 turns or so it became more accurate but especially in the early turns it was always predicting I'd be in the red when after end turn I wasn't? This is grand and all and I suspect it's as unit prices are unbalanced between RS2.5 export_descr_unit and RS3 export_descr_buildings but fixing that is too big a job for me :laughter: in the meantime though this has fixed my battle ai for a small price of a strange ledger and losing the allied germanic cavalry unit.

Okay so resurrecting this thread as after reviewing the export_descr_unit files for the Rome 1 turn folder its evident a lot of changes were made.


The armour and shield rating were doubled across the board for nearly every unit from RS2.5. (stat_prim_armour) There was also an immense amount increase in range for slinger units. I also found a lot of bugs (what I think were bugs) when looking at javelin units in stat_prim. The primary missile weapon appeared to have its range included before the comma and then the range added in again afterwards. Strangely this wasn't resulting in CTD's. The Allied germanic cav unit wasn't in the RS2.5 folder so that caused CTD's when swapping it into RS3.


So I've essentially just took the good from RS2.5 and RS3 and combined them into 1 folder and cut out the bugs/ overpowered armour stats and the battles seem to be sweet again, economically balanced and without the annoying 'allied germanic cavalry' error when swapping in R2.5 stats. I kept elephants as they are (in RS2.5 they were overpowered) and removed Thrace as recruitable from Roman generals as advised by Granto in this thread. I still need to finish a few things but if anybody would like this 'export_descr_unit' let me know and I'll pm it. If any mod leader wants to have a look to compare I'd be happy to share too. It's all stats that the RS3 team formed, I just combined them to have what I think is the best RS3 experience.


I've a question though, can I just copy this export_descr_unit from the the Rome 1 turn folder into the general 1 turn folder for other factions? Its a few hours work so don't fancy doing it again soon.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Agrippa19

Okay so resurrecting this thread as after reviewing the export_descr_unit files for the Rome 1 turn folder its evident a lot of changes were made.


The armour and shield rating were doubled across the board for nearly every unit from RS2.5. (stat_prim_armour) There was also an immense amount increase in range for slinger units. I also found a lot of bugs (what I think were bugs) when looking at javelin units in stat_prim. The primary missile weapon appeared to have its range included before the comma and then the range added in again afterwards. Strangely this wasn't resulting in CTD's. The Allied germanic cav unit wasn't in the RS2.5 folder so that caused CTD's when swapping it into RS3.


So I've essentially just took the good from RS2.5 and RS3 and combined them into 1 folder and cut out the bugs/ overpowered armour stats and the battles seem to be sweet again, economically balanced and without the annoying 'allied germanic cavalry' error when swapping in R2.5 stats. I kept elephants as they are (in RS2.5 they were overpowered) and removed Thrace as recruitable from Roman generals as advised by Granto in this thread. I still need to finish a few things but if anybody would like this 'export_descr_unit' let me know and I'll pm it. If any mod leader wants to have a look to compare I'd be happy to share too. It's all stats that the RS3 team formed, I just combined them to have what I think is the best RS3 experience.


I've a question though, can I just copy this export_descr_unit from the the Rome 1 turn folder into the general 1 turn folder for other factions? Its a few hours work so don't fancy doing it again soon.

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Can you pm the file,rs3 ai is broken beyond playable no matter which .exe i use its not that,the vanilla ai act much more cohesively to keep formation in both 1.5 and 1.9.
The question you asked as far as i know romans have buffed stats when your vs them only but not sure.

Hi so I can't actually see an attach button in my pms so I'll just drop it here for you to try or anyone else.

Its just the Roman 1 turn export_descr_unit file. I've basically inserted all unit stats for v2.5 except for the elephant units and roman generals but kept the economic costs as they were in v3.1. I've noticed a big improvement but let me know what you think please. It's very important in the campaign to upgrade your units at a foundry as missiles effect them a lot more with less armour stats. There is still the odd reshuffle and enemy spearmen can go into guard mode and stand diagonally to the frontline, but its definitely better than what it was, I actually couldn't play before the AI was so erratic.

Don't forget to make a backup copy first and then copy and paste this into your play_rome_one_turn folder. And remember to delete map.rwm in the launcher before playing.

This looks good but can anyone else weigh in on it, experience with it or anything ?

I'm starting a new Rome H/H 0 turn campaign, this wouldn't work for it would it ?

Thanks !

Nope Rome 1 turn only

I'm aware that a lot of work was done on the EDU by someone else after we released 2.5. With the original version I ended up automating quite a lot of the EDU production using Excel functions which allowed us to make small changes to multiple elements in the file (e.g. attack, defence, unit cost, etc based on various base values and unit worth calculations and adjustments) as we got nearer release and were running loads of test campaigns and test battles. Interestingly I've not experienced massive issues with RS3 behaviour as far as I'm aware.

https://www.twcenter.net/forums/show...4#post16015294

I'm having the same problem with regards to enemy general's units, mostly cavalry, suicide charging my line.

Rome 0 Turn H/H, Steam Windows 10, Sinuhet Formations is what I've been using the entire time.

Any idea if this is just the base game AI or if there's anything I can do ?

Thanks.

Of course you are having the same problem, You made also the other post xD. You have the same problem of yourself, what a surprise !
Anyway, general suiciding is a standard RTW 1 AI tactic, even though with basic Alexander engine I didn't remember it happening that often.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sharkeyyyy

https://www.twcenter.net/forums/show...4#post16015294

I'm having the same problem with regards to enemy general's units, mostly cavalry, suicide charging my line.

Rome 0 Turn H/H, Steam Windows 10, Sinuhet Formations is what I've been using the entire time.

Any idea if this is just the base game AI or if there's anything I can do ?

Thanks.

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I too use Sinuhets AI battle formation along with the ALX.exe and I don't seem to have that happen as a frequent issue. I am presently Let's Playing RS III as The Seleucid Empire(1-turn) if you want to have a look through some of the battles to see for yourself https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...CVtnl-K_27igVB