Game Discussion

For discussing any game-related stuff.

Are cities generating prestige anymore? The rules say they're not, but I can't remember what most people's opinions on that proposal were. BTW I vote that they don't, as it seems they were built mainly for prestige farming in EW7. Building one gives prestige, but it doesn't generate it continuously.

They are. In the rules it says that they generate +1 prestige every turn. Is there a difference between 'city' and 'important city'?

There's isn't. I assume that when we're talking about any sort of city it's one that's been built that has a guild and gives bonuses.

I suggest that cities don't generate prestige. Here's my reason from the previous rules thread: Prestige should only be awarded when your faction achieves a one off great accomplishment, such as winning great battles, building a magnificent < fleet Sure, building a city and the others. It's also clear that lots of you are building them mainly for the prestige, that's natural, I'd do it too. Cities shouldn't be a method to farm prestige. Therefore the prestige winning limit should be set to 150, or different suitable number.

Sorry if that language sounds uh, formal, but that was during the 7th.

Greetings! I was thinking about starting this game in the near future:

Rome Total War Forum Map Game

Rules of the Game

Please abide by the TOS when playing this game. If you do not, you will be kicked out. Turns and Rolls Every turn is 24 hours long. Players post their moves during this time. There are 3 Domains that you can do moves in. They are: Military, Economy, and Agents. Military Domain: moves in this domain include recruiting armies/fleets, moving armies/fleets, and invading a region. Economy Domain: moves in this domain include developing a region into military, economic, or fortified regions. Agents Domain: moves in this domain include recruiting and moving agents as well as having them perform missions. How many moves you can do in each domain is determined by the amount of Denarii in your treasury. Every faction starts with 100 Denarii. 100 – 2500 = 1 move per domain. 2600 – 7500 = 2 moves per domain. 7600 – 10000 = 3 moves per domain. 10100 – 10500 = 4 moves per domain. Denarii are generated by economic regions, crushing victories, or certain trade agreements. Denarii can be lost by losing your capital region, crushing defeats, or breaking certain treaties. The Game Master (GM) will use rolz.org to roll virtual dice to determine if the moves succeed or not. A 1, 2, or 3 means a fail. A 4, 5, or 6 means a success. The GM will provide a link to the dice log at every Turn End. Every turn is 1 year in-game for role-play purposes. The game begins in 270 BCE. Factions and Victory There are 18 pre-set factions that players can claim to play as: Confederation of Britannia – Light Blue Confederation of Germania – Burgundy Confederation of Gaul – Dark Green Confederation of Iberia – Dark Orange Kingdom of Numidia – Light Brown Republic of Carthage – Dark Purple Roman House of Julii – Dark Red Roman House of Scipii – Dark Blue Roman House of Brutii – Light Green Greek City-states – Gold Kingdom of Macedon – Dark Grey Confederation of Dacia – Dark Brown Confederation of Scythia – Light Orange Kingdom of Pontus – Turquoise Ptolemaic Kingdom – Yellow Seleucid Empire – Light Grey Kingdom of Armenia – Swamp Green Kingdom of Parthia – Pink There is 1 pre-set faction that cannot be claimed to play as: Republic of Rome (SPQR) – Light Purple It is just to suppose to stay in Latium and do nothing except give out missions/rewards/penalties to the 3 playable Roman factions. See “Special Rules for Romans” sections for more details on this. The 3 playable Roman factions must be claimed before the game can start. Every playable faction starts with 2 land regions (capital region is developed as a Military Region), a Regular Army, a Diplomat Agent, and 100 Denarii. To win the game you must conquer and hold 50 land regions, including Latium region. If you are playing a Roman faction you must make sure you are the only Roman faction when you have Rome and 50 land regions. Regions and Development A land region is a white area of 25 or more pixels surrounded by a black border. Every land region is defended by a Rebel Militia of 4 units. A sea region is a blue area of 50 or more pixels surrounded by a black border. Land regions can be developed to devote their resources to a certain focus. The 3 types of development you can do are: Military, Economic, or Fortified. There is a special development that can be built in any land region, even in regions with a main development present: Roads. Military Region: allows you to recruit an Army or Fleet. It is marked on the map with the Barracks Icon. Economic Region: generates 100 Denarii per turn and allows you to recruit an Agent. It is marked on the map with the Temple Icon. Fortified Region: gives a -1 penalty to all attack rolls on armies invading this region. It is marked on the map with the Wall Icon. Roads: gives your armies increased range of movement. It is marked on the map with criss-cross lines. It takes a move in your Economy Domain to develop a region. A player marks which region on the map he/she wishes to be developed and announces what type of development it is. It takes 12 production points to finish a development. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine how many production points are generated. A roll of 5 will generate 5 production points for example. You can also spend Denarii to hurry production; 1 production point can be purchased for every 100 Denarii. You cannot overspend. Developed regions can be re-developed to a different type with a move in your Economy Domain, and it only takes 6 production points to do that. When a developed region is conquered by an invading army it is damaged and cannot be utilized by the conqueror until it is repaired. It only takes 6 production points to repair. Roads do not get damaged. Capital Region: this is where your government and treasury reside. It is marked on the map with the Star Icon. It can be developed into a Military, Economic, or Fortified region. You can change your Capital Region with a move in your Economy Domain that the GM will roll for (1–3 fail; 4–6 success). If you lose your capital to an enemy faction, you lose 1000 Denarii from your treasury and have a -1 penalty on all your moves the next turn. You receive a free move that automatically succeeds to appoint a new capital when that happens. Armies and Marching A player uses a move in his/her Military Domain and marks which Military Region he/she wishes to recruit an Army in. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine if the recruitment succeeds or not and also to determine the army’s quality. [0]: Recruitment fails. You are unable to recruit an army this turn. [1]: Recruitment fails. -1 penalty if you attempt to recruit an army again. [2]: Recruitment fails. [3]: Recruitment fails. +1 bonus if you attempt to recruit an army again. [4]: Recruitment succeeds. You get a Regular Army. [5]: Recruitment succeeds. You get a Regular Army. [6]: Recruitment succeeds. You get a Veteran Army. [7]: Recruitment succeeds. You get a Veteran Army. Regular Armies are marked on the map with the Short Sword Icon. Veteran Armies are marked on the map with the Long Sword Icon. There can only be 3 armies at maximum in 1 land region. Every army has 6 units. Veteran Armies have a +1 bonus on all their attack/defense rolls. See “Invasions and Battles” section for more details on this. Regular Armies can march 1 region per move. Veteran Armies can march 2 regions per move. This range of movement is increased by 1 if the army moves from a region with roads. A player uses a move in his/her Military Domain to march an army to a certain region or fleet. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine if the march was a success or not. If your army is marching to a region that one of your spies is in, it will have a +1 bonus. [0]: Marching fails. Ambush! You are unable to march an army this turn. [1]: Marching fails. Ambush! -1 penalty if you attempt to march this army again. [2]: Marching fails. [3]: Marching fails. +1 bonus if you attempt to march this army again. [4]: Marching succeeds. Your army enters the region. [5]: Marching succeeds. Your army enters the region. [6]: Marching succeeds. Your army enters the region. [7]: Marching succeeds. Your army enters the region. Ambushes: The GM will roll again when an army is caught in an ambush to determine if it survives or not. A 1, 2, or 3 means the Regular Army is destroyed, while a 4, 5, or 6 means the Regular Army escapes with 2 units. A 1 or 2 means the Veteran Army is destroyed, while a 3 or greater means the Veteran Army escapes with 3 units. If you station a spy in the region you are marching an army to, that army has a +1 bonus when marching. Fleets and Sailing A player uses a move in his/her Military Domain and marks which sea region bordering the Military Region he/she wishes to construct a fleet in. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine if the recruitment succeeds or not and also to determine the fleet’s quality. [0]: Recruitment fails. You are unable to recruit a fleet this turn. [1]: Recruitment fails. -1 penalty if you attempt to recruit a fleet again. [2]: Recruitment fails. [3]: Recruitment fails. +1 bonus if you attempt to recruit a fleet again. [4]: Recruitment succeeds. You get a Regular Fleet. [5]: Recruitment succeeds. You get a Regular Fleet. [6]: Recruitment succeeds. You get a Veteran Fleet. [7]: Recruitment succeeds. You get a Veteran Fleet. Regular Fleets are marked on the map with the Small Galley Icon. Veteran Fleets are marked on the map with the Large Galley Icon. You can only have 3 of your fleets in 1 sea region. Every fleet has 6 ships. Veteran Fleets have a +1 bonus on all their attack/defense rolls. See “Invasions and Battles” section for more details on this. Regular Fleets can sail 1 sea region per move. Veteran Fleets can sail 2 sea regions per move. A player uses a move in his/her Military Domain to sail a fleet to a certain sea region or to intercept an enemy fleet. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine if the sailing was a success or not. [0]: Sailing fails. Pirates! You are unable to sail a fleet this turn. [1]: Sailing fails. Pirates! -1 penalty if you attempt to sail this fleet again. [2]: Sailing fails. [3]: Sailing fails. +1 bonus if you attempt to sail this fleet again. [4]: Sailing succeeds. Your fleet enters the region. [5]: Sailing succeeds. Your fleet enters the region. [6]: Sailing succeeds. Your fleet enters the region. [7]: Sailing succeeds. Your fleet enters the region. Pirates: The GM will roll again when a fleet is caught by a pirate attack to determine if it survives or not. A 1, 2, or 3 means the Regular Fleet is destroyed, while a 4, 5, or 6 means the Regular Fleet escapes with 2 ships. A 1 or 2 means the Veteran Fleet is destroyed, while a 3 or greater means the Veteran Fleet escapes with 3 ships. Transportation: Any fleet can transport any army. Only 1 army can be on 1 fleet. It takes a move in your Military Domain to board the army onto the fleet, or to disembark an army from a fleet. Invasions and Battles An invasion occurs when your army marches into an enemy region. A land battle occurs if the enemy region has a Rebel Militia or an Enemy Army/Militia in it. A sea battle occurs if your fleet successfully intercepted an Enemy Fleet. The GM will roll virtual dice in 4 battle phases to determine the victor. The rolls of the attacking force (attack rolls) will be subtracted from the rolls of the defending force (defense rolls). Here is an example battle: Julii regular army (6 units) VS Rebel militia (4 units): [2]-[3]=-1. One Julii unit is destroyed. [5]-[5]=0. No losses on either side. [6]-[2]=4. The rebel scum are destroyed! The Julii regular army (5 units) wins a clear victory! If after 4 rounds neither force is destroyed, the force with the least units retreats to the nearest friendly region. The victorious force then seizes the undefended region. Fortified Regions give a -1 penalty to all attack rolls on an army that invades it. Veteran Armies have a +1 bonus to all their attack/defense rolls, though. To replenish a depleted force you must march the army to a friendly Military Region or sail the fleet to a sea region that borders a friendly Military Region. Every turn that it is stationary there it will regenerate 1 unit/ship. If you win a battle with no units/ships lost, you will sack the region or coasts and gain 200 Denarii. If you lose a battle and didn’t inflict any damage on the enemy force, you lose 500 Denarii. Agents and Missions There are 4 types of Agents that you can recruit: Spy, Assassin, Insurgent, and Diplomat. They are marked on the map with the letters S, A, I, and D respectively. You can recruit 1 type of Agent if you have at least 1 Economic Region. If you have 4 Economic Regions then you can recruit all 4 Agents. It takes a move in a player’s Agents Domain to recruit an agent. The player marks the Economic Region on the map and says what type of agent that region will recruit. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine if the recruitment succeeds or not. [0]: Recruitment fails. You are unable to recruit an agent this turn. [1]: Recruitment fails. -1 penalty if you attempt to recruit an agent again. [2]: Recruitment fails. [3]: Recruitment fails. +1 bonus if you attempt to recruit an agent again. [4]: Recruitment succeeds. You get the agent. [5]: Recruitment succeeds. You get the agent. [6]: Recruitment succeeds. You get the agent. [7]: Recruitment succeeds. You get the agent. A player uses a move in their Agents Domain to move their agent or have him/her perform a Mission. An Agent can travel 4 regions per move. Agents can move through sea regions without a fleet, but they cannot end their move in a sea region. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine if the travelling was a success or not. [0]: Travelling fails. Bandits! You are unable to move an agent this turn. [1]: Travelling fails. Bandits! -1 penalty if you attempt to move this agent again. [2]: Travelling fails. [3]: Travelling fails. +1 bonus if you attempt to move this agent again. [4]: Travelling succeeds. Your agent enters the region. [5]: Travelling succeeds. Your agent enters the region. [6]: Travelling succeeds. Your agent enters the region. [7]: Travelling succeeds. Your agent enters the region. Bandits: The GM will roll again when an agent is caught by bandits to determine if he/she survives or not. A 1, 2, or 3 means the agent is killed, while a 4, 5, or 6 means the agent escaped and returns to where it started. Spies and Spying If you move a spy into the same region that you are invading, a spying mission occurs. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine if the spy succeeds or not. [1]: Mission fails. The spy is tortured and killed. -1 penalty to your army’s attack rolls. [2]: Mission fails. The spy is killed. [3]: Mission fails. [4]: Mission succeeds. +1 bonus to your army’s attack rolls. [5]: Mission succeeds. +1 bonus to your army’s attack rolls. [6]: Mission succeeds. +1 bonus to your army’s attack rolls. If you station a spy in the region you are marching an army to, that army has a +1 bonus when marching. Assassins and Assassinations If you move an assassin into the same region as an enemy agent, you can choose to kill him/her. Or if you move an assassin into the capital region of an enemy faction, you can choose to kill the enemy faction-leader. When a faction loses its faction-leader to an assassin’s blade it will have a -1 penalty on all its rolls that turn. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine if the assassin succeeds or not. [1]: Mission fails. The assassin is tortured and killed. -1 penalty if you try killing this character again. [2]: Mission fails. The assassin is killed. [3]: Mission fails. [4]: Mission succeeds. The target is killed. [5]: Mission succeeds. The target is killed. [6]: Mission succeeds. The target is killed. Insurgents and Rebellions If you move an insurgent into an enemy region, you can attempt to incite a rebellion there. If successful the enemy armies in the region will retreat to the nearest friendly place they can and the region goes back to rebel control. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine if the insurgent succeeds or not. [1]: Mission fails. The insurgent is tortured and killed. -1 penalty if you try inciting a rebellion in this region again. [2]: Mission fails. The insurgent is killed. [3]: Mission fails. [4]: Mission succeeds. The region rebels. [5]: Mission succeeds. The region rebels. [6]: Mission succeeds. The region rebels. Diplomats and Diplomacy If you move a diplomat into any region owned by another faction, you can engage in diplomacy and make treaties with that faction. There are 5 different treaties you can make: Trade Treaty (all Roman factions start with this with each other) – If the two factions that sign this share a border, they will each make 200 Denarii per turn. If one of the factions breaks the treaty and declares war on their ex-trading partner on the same turn it must pay 500 Denarii. Gifts Treaty – A faction can offer up to 3 regions, agents, armies, or fleets to another faction once every 5 turns. If one of the factions attacks the other before 5 turns have passed after the signing of this treaty, it will lose 1000 Denarii. Alliance Treaty (all Roman factions start with this with each other) – The factions that sign this treaty can march through, or station armies in, each other’s regions. You can also replenish your armies in each other’s military regions. If a faction attacks an enemy of their ally it will receive 300 Denarii. If a faction breaks this treaty and attacks their ex-ally on the same turn, it will lose 2500 Denarii. Cease-fire Treaty – A faction can propose a certain amount of turns to a faction they’re at war to cease hostilities. If one of the factions resumes hostilities before the treaty expires, it will lose 1000 Denarii. Peace Treaty – To end a war and resume neutral stances, this treaty can be signed. If one of the factions attacks the other before 10 turns have passed after signing this treaty, it will lose 2500 Denarii. Special Rules for Romans The 3 playable Roman factions are ranked in their popularity with the Patricians and Plebeians on a scale of 1 to 12 for each. These 3 factions start with 11 popularity with the Patricians and 1 popularity with the Plebeians. As your popularity for one goes down, your popularity with the other goes up. To increase your popularity with the Plebeians you need to conquer regions and get elected to pro-plebeian positions in the Senate. To increase your popularity with the Patricians you need to complete assignments given to you and get elected to pro-patrician positions in the Senate. Conquering 2 regions will give you +1 popularity with the Plebeians. Conversely, losing 2 regions will give you -1 popularity with the Plebeians. Elections: Every 5 turns (years) there are elections for the 6 most important positions in the Roman Republican Government. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine which of the 4 Roman factions will get which positions. The position goes to the faction that got the highest roll for it. For example: Office of Consul Julii: [1] Brutii: [6] Scipii: [2] SPQR: [5] The Roman House of Brutii receives the Office of Consul. +2 popularity with the Patricians per turn. The positions, in order of greatest to least important, are: Pontifex Maximus – pro-patrician. +3 popularity with Patricians per turn. Censor – pro-plebeian. +3 popularity with Plebeians per turn. Consul – pro-patrician. +2 popularity with Patricians per turn. Praetor – pro-patrician. +1 popularity with Patricians per turn. Aedile – pro-plebeian. +2 popularity with Plebeians per turn. Quaestor – pro-plebeian. +1 popularity with Plebeians per turn. A Roman player may spend Denarii to give them a bonus. A +1 bonus on an election roll costs 100 Denarii. So if, for example, you really wanted the Office of Aedile you could spend 500 Denarii to get a +5 bonus on your roll for it. Assignments: The patrician-dominated Senate will give out an Assignment to each of the 3 playable Roman factions every 5 turns. The time to complete the Assignment is 5 turns. The GM will roll virtual dice to determine what Assignment is given to each faction. They are: [1]: Send a diplomat to the closest neutral faction. [2]: Recruit 2 armies at any military region. [3]: March an army to an undefended border region. [4]: Recruit 2 fleets at any sea zone bordering a military region. [5]: Send an assassin or insurgent to the closest enemy faction. [6]: Develop any undeveloped region to either military, economic, or fortified. If you complete an Assignment you will gain: +3 popularity with the Patricians and +500 Denarii. Failing to complete an Assignment will get you: -3 popularity with the Patricians and -500 Denarii. Roman Civil War: For 1 of the playable Roman factions to initiate the Civil War it must have 25 regions and 12 points of popularity with the Plebeians on the turn it invades Latium region with an army. If the SPQR faction is not destroyed it will command the other 2 factions to work together to destroy the faction that started the War by threatening a -2500 Denarii penalty if they don’t. If the SPQR faction is destroyed then the Roman Houses are free to do what they want.

Map of the Game

This was inspired by Kirila the Kitten btw. Give him rep for the idea, not me.

If European Wars VIII unfortunately dies, would anyone be interested in this ^ game? Or would you all like a substitute game master to fill in for NobleWoman until she returns? I could be that substitute if you like. Cheers! Cats

Lord of Cats, I would like you to be GM to EWVIII if it unfortunately dies. You were the best EW GM I've met.

Also, about the Rome game. Again, you must simplify some of the rules. For example the army system...
I might try to revive JAM too if I get the time but most of its players are no longer here.

Does anyone know how long NobleWoman will be gone for? If it's more than a week, then we should get a substitute GM. Infact, we could split the load; each GM might do half the players each so that way they too will still be able to play. The GMs will have to organise who will be posting the end of turn reports; the other will send what they've done, and the first GM will compile both reports together, update the lists and map.

Brilliant idea Ikaroqx!

NobleWoman is busy with school and family things. I don't know when she will be back online. Hence why I've stepped in as GM for now.

@Kirila: what is so freakin complicated about the rules? They seem really simple to me. "For example the army system..." what? What about it? Your vagueness never ceases to annoy me. Can you please explain why it's supposedly complicated?

It just... doesn't seem like the classic RTDs we all enjoy.

The Special Rules for Romans seem inappropiate after all. They can easily get Denari whereas other factions cannot.
That's not complicated but it's a point.
If you keep the rules for Romans we should add some more for the other nations.

Wait a second? What about the perks? Romans will not get any because of their Senate and stuff while the other factions should get a special bonus like:

Germans: +2 for attacking an enemy region for the first roll. (Element of Surprise)
Gauls: +1 when defending against an enemy for the first 2 rolls. (Guerilla Warfare)
Britons: Call of Duty: Can attack 2 regions once every 5 turns. -1 bonuses are negated. (if you get a -2 (slightly impossible) you will only get a -1)
Iberians: Cultural Trade: +(reasonable amount of) Denari every 5 turns.
Carthage(which should have its colour changed, that purple is just... not working): Sons of Baal:After being at war with an enemy for 5 turns, they get -1 on all actions against them for 3 turns. (definitely not enough for you to destroy them though)

etc etc

You should get a small amount of Denari (50?) for a normal victory too.
Some factions can really fall behind with this mechanic.

NobleWoman is busy with school and family things.

Are you sure that that's what is happening?

You question his sources, Antonis?

Yeah, don't question my sources. Kirila, I'm sure, will be more than happy to explain -- with some random BS -- how I know.

Originally Posted by Kirila the Kitten

The Special Rules for Romans seem inappropriate after all. They can easily get Denarii whereas other factions cannot. That's not complicated but it's a point. If you keep the rules for Romans we should add some more for the other nations.

This game, like Rome Total War, is heavily biased towards the Roman factions. I'm glad you realized that, because that is the point. But I have changed the map a bit so every non-Roman faction starts with 3 instead of 2 regions to help them out.

Originally Posted by Kirila the Kitten

Wait a second? What about the perks? Romans will not get any because of their Senate and stuff while the other factions should get a special bonus like...

Because that would make it very complicated indeed. The poor GM would have to keep track of which factions have which bonuses. Hence why I got rid of all the bonuses in order to simplify the game. There's just no pleasing you, is there?

Originally Posted by Kirila the Kitten

You should get a small amount of Denarii (50?) for a normal victory too.
Some factions can really fall behind with this mechanic.

Hmm... I'll consider that. Especially since I'm thinking about including this: spending Denarii for bonuses on many of the rolls, not just Senate election rolls. Spending 100 Denarii = +1 bonus. Denarii then would have to be more easily obtained perhaps, though with enough economic regions one should have a steady income... hmm, decisions, decisions...

Rome Total War, is heavily biased towards the Roman factions

Is this why Rome TW(the PC game) has 4 Roman factions,instead of 1,which is the correct?I have never understood the point of having 4 factions representing the Roman Empire.Historically,Roman Empire was a united state,and not a collection of houses struggling for the control of Italy(unless this was the case)...

I already explained what happened to NobleWoman, BS included.

Ok, LoC, do what you want. Cause a you're a pirate.
"

A CAT PIRATE!

I really need to know the BS. By whomsoever.

This game is not going to die. Even if I disappear coz of real life issues, I will be back to continue it till it ends. I finish whatever I start, so you guys dont have to worry on that count.

At the most we might require substitute GMs if I am gone long, like now, but that's it. I will be back to take over.

It's important that we decide on whether cities generate prestige or not, so we can make adjustments to the winning conditions if necessary with plenty of time before the game ends. I've given my reasons as to why they shouldn't generate it, so what do you guys think?

If we agree that they will, then the winning prestige is 250

If they won't then the winning prestige should be lowered (perhaps 200)

Its part of the rules, thats why I am adding them. The prestige for victory is 200.

We can have a vote on this.

I already have 34 prestige. That means I actually have a chance at winning o.o