Since our internal forum is down...

Khelvan · Khelvan

I figured I would post this here, since I'm half asleep and will not remember it tomorrow. Assuming this is true, our chances of moving EB to BI are slim to none. The mounts file is an integral part of our mod, as we've changed every horse and elephant model, added a diversity of horses, and new chariots and such. Without the ability to mod descr_mounts.txt, we will almost certainly never see a BI port of EB.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=33972

Solar · Solar

Bad news, really. All the stuff in BI (religions, loyalty, etc) could really enrich gameplay in EB. But is the problem also in RTW 1.3? if so, it'd be a pity, since that update also corrects the save/load bug...

Lesten · Lesten

Really bad news indeed. Hopefully someone will figure out how to fix this or at least how to convert some of BIs features to the original game.

Edit: Are you saying you are giving up all BI features because you can't use different horses, elephants and chariots?

Malrubius · Malrubius

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solar

Bad news, really. All the stuff in BI (religions, loyalty, etc) could really enrich gameplay in EB. But is the problem also in RTW 1.3? if so, it'd be a pity, since that update also corrects the save/load bug...

I don't know if BI has enough religions to fully represent the different religious beliefs of our factions. We have our own plans in this area, however.

I did like the idea of disloyal generals rebelling, however.

Urnamma · Urnamma

It looks like they solved the mounts problem. CA just made everything even more of a pain in the ass though.

Big_John · Big_John

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urnamma

It looks like they solved the mounts problem. CA just made everything even more of a pain in the ass though.

well, that's better at least!

also, i have good news. i just saved a bunch of money on my car insurance by switching to geico!

no wait, that's not right.. what i meant to ask is, does the info in this thread sound like potential good news for EB in anyway? (i speaking mostly about signiferone's post #13)

Lesten · Lesten

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malrubius

I did like the idea of disloyal generals rebelling, however.

Have you played BI yet? Personally, I don't think the rebelling general feature is as exciting as it may sound. It can only happen to romans and when it does it creates a new roman rebel faction (like Western Empire rebels) (takes up one faction slot too, I think).

While adding more depth to the game it uses faction slots that perhaps could be used for some other faction (otherwise it would be awesome if new factions spawned every now and then). It would be better, at least for a mod with many factions, to let the rebelling settlements and generals join the slave/rebel faction, if possible.

However, it is cool when the portrait of the family member is grayed out and the text says he deserted in year X.

Night fights, religion and the ability to train new generals are good features though and it would be cool to see them in EB. (The rebelling general feature is actually a good one too... but like I said, it limits the number of other factions, though I could be wrong... )

lt1956 · lt1956

Khelvan I was wrong the BI animations cant be used with RTW :-( not unless edited as normal. I really thought they would corss reference them. Also I havent noticed any major changes with AI behavior with BI, it does has some nice features but maybe not enough to warrent EB porting. also the legion naming is kind of a problem as you can only get different numerals if they are recruited from the same province. My SPQR 4.4 patch uses the resource method to assign legion names. I think its better than BIs unless BI makes the game track all 1st cohorts instead of just from the province.

Lt

Stallion M · Stallion M

Like I said in the past... If this nor RTR moves to BI then BI's not worth my money.

**Simetrical** · **Simetrical**

It's far too soon to figure out whether the change would be worth it. I'd say we have to wait at least a month to figure this stuff out.

def · def

I've had the chance to play BI for a few hours when it came out on the first day. I must say I was impressed with what CA has done with the AI, the interface, modding aspects, and the overall new engine features. The BI version 1.4 of the game is what really RTW was meant to be. It is definitely worth spending resources to port mods to BI. I know we are looking into it at the moment.

Pent uP Rage · Pent uP Rage

So, does this mean I need to keep a fresh unpatched 1.2 to continue to play the mods? Sure glad I saved one.

Kushan · Kushan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pent uP Rage

So, does this mean I need to keep a fresh unpatched 1.2 to continue to play the mods? Sure glad I saved one.

Probably not, we'll probably switch over to the RTW v1.3 patch when it is released.

Honestly I think it is to soon to know whether to switch to BI or not. I bought it yesterday, but have been to sick to test it out. Lets not be to quick to judge BI, it has only been out for a day.

But as Khelvan has said before, the first version of EB will be for RTW v1.2/1.3.

Kushan

Stallion M · Stallion M

BI has the problem with the mount files + some of their units look completly ugly and half arsed. I'm sure either EB, or RTR could do a better job of skinning with their eyes closed, and one hand tied behind their back, and some really annoying song playing over and over in the backround. Oh and then theres the sparkles, bubbles and super SEGA beserkers of course... *SIGH*...

PS - I also heard it has performance issues.

Solar · Solar

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stallion M

Oh and then theres the sparkles, bubbles and super SEGA beserkers of course... *SIGH*...

the sparkles and bubbles made it to the final version? ugh.

Leatherpenguin · Leatherpenguin

Horrible news, the long awaited EB, the saviour, will not take advantage of the improved AI.. You guys have done such a wonderful job with the limited resources available, but I don't think it really can measure with the changes CA themselves can make to the hardcoded areas. Please reconsider, if anyone can do this, it would be the mega talented EB team!

Meneldil · Meneldil

Agreed.

Although I dislike many of BI features, or think they aren't worth the money, the better AI is really a positive aspect

Stallion M · Stallion M

How is the AI better? Do they finally slaughter themselves too save me the trouble of wasting 10 men?

Kushan · Kushan

Biggest problem in my opinion is the emergent factions.

Hopefully the v1.3 patch will include alot of the improvements to the AI, and etc.

Kushan

Khelvan · Khelvan

As yet, no one has actually detailed improvements to the AI. So as far as we are concerned, there is nothing there yet to take advantage of.

Khelvan	September 30, 2005, 04:05 AM / Since our internal forum is down...	#1
Artifex Posts: 1,539	I figured I would post this here, since I'm half asleep and will not remember it tomorrow. Assuming this is true, our chances of moving EB to BI are slim to none. The mounts file is an integral part of our mod, as we've changed every horse and elephant model, added a diversity of horses, and new chariots and such. Without the ability to mod descr_mounts.txt, we will almost certainly never see a BI port of EB. http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=33972 Ignoranti, quem portum petat, nullus suus ventus est. - Seneca

Solar	September 30, 2005, 06:26 AM	#2
Civitate Posts: 919	Bad news, really. All the stuff in BI (religions, loyalty, etc) could really enrich gameplay in EB. But is the problem also in RTW 1.3? if so, it'd be a pity, since that update also corrects the save/load bug... believe in nothing.

Lesten	September 30, 2005, 06:48 AM	#3
Chosen Man Posts: 216	Really bad news indeed. Hopefully someone will figure out how to fix this or at least how to convert some of BIs features to the original game. Edit: Are you saying you are giving up all BI features because you can't use different horses, elephants and chariots? Visit the Gathering Storm forums! The Gathering Storm Project Co-director Last edited by Lesten; September 30, 2005 at 07:11 AM.

Urnamma	September 30, 2005, 08:58 AM	#5
Corporal Posts: 225	It looks like they solved the mounts problem. CA just made everything even more of a pain in the ass though.

lt1956	September 30, 2005, 09:28 AM	#8
Creator of SPQR:TW Mod Posts: 6,119 Total Awards: 2	Khelvan I was wrong the BI animations cant be used with RTW :-( not unless edited as normal. I really thought they would corss reference them. Also I havent noticed any major changes with AI behavior with BI, it does has some nice features but maybe not enough to warrent EB porting. also the legion naming is kind of a problem as you can only get different numerals if they are recruited from the same province. My SPQR 4.4 patch uses the resource method to assign legion names. I think its better than BIs unless BI makes the game track all 1st cohorts instead of just from the province. Lt Lt_1956 Creator of SPQR mod

Stallion M	September 30, 2005, 11:32 AM	#9
Drummer and Fifer Posts: 128	Like I said in the past... If this nor RTR moves to BI then BI's not worth my money.

Simetrical	September 30, 2005, 05:14 PM	#10
Chief Technician Technical Staff • Citizen Posts: 17,437 Total Awards: 6	It's far too soon to figure out whether the change would be worth it. I'd say we have to wait at least a month to figure this stuff out. MediaWiki developer, TWC Chief Technician NetHack player (nao info) Risen from Prey

def	September 30, 2005, 08:59 PM	#11
Grenadier Posts: 56	I've had the chance to play BI for a few hours when it came out on the first day. I must say I was impressed with what CA has done with the AI, the interface, modding aspects, and the overall new engine features. The BI version 1.4 of the game is what really RTW was meant to be. It is definitely worth spending resources to port mods to BI. I know we are looking into it at the moment. Core Developer Rome Total Realism http://www.rometotalrealism.org - http://forums.rometotalrealism.org - http://rometotalrealism.org/gallery/

Pent uP Rage	September 30, 2005, 09:03 PM	#12
Tech Moderator Posts: 1,841	So, does this mean I need to keep a fresh unpatched 1.2 to continue to play the mods? Sure glad I saved one. under the patronage of Emperor Dimitricus, son of the Black Prince Before you post, see if your question has already been answered here

Stallion M	October 01, 2005, 02:13 PM	#14
Drummer and Fifer Posts: 128	BI has the problem with the mount files + some of their units look completly ugly and half arsed. I'm sure either EB, or RTR could do a better job of skinning with their eyes closed, and one hand tied behind their back, and some really annoying song playing over and over in the backround. Oh and then theres the sparkles, bubbles and super SEGA beserkers of course... SIGH... PS - I also heard it has performance issues.

Leatherpenguin	October 01, 2005, 03:41 PM	#16
Drummer and Fifer Posts: 128	Horrible news, the long awaited EB, the saviour, will not take advantage of the improved AI.. You guys have done such a wonderful job with the limited resources available, but I don't think it really can measure with the changes CA themselves can make to the hardcoded areas. Please reconsider, if anyone can do this, it would be the mega talented EB team!

Meneldil	October 01, 2005, 04:19 PM	#17
Corporal Posts: 252	Agreed. Although I dislike many of BI features, or think they aren't worth the money, the better AI is really a positive aspect

Stallion M	October 01, 2005, 09:31 PM	#18
Drummer and Fifer Posts: 128	How is the AI better? Do they finally slaughter themselves too save me the trouble of wasting 10 men?

Kushan	October 01, 2005, 11:04 PM	#19
Artifex Posts: 716	Biggest problem in my opinion is the emergent factions. Hopefully the v1.3 patch will include alot of the improvements to the AI, and etc. Kushan "May god stand between you and harm, in all the dark places you must walk." - Ancient Egyptian Proverb Under the Patronage of Silver Guard

Khelvan	October 02, 2005, 01:38 AM	#20
Artifex Posts: 1,539	As yet, no one has actually detailed improvements to the AI. So as far as we are concerned, there is nothing there yet to take advantage of. Ignoranti, quem portum petat, nullus suus ventus est. - Seneca

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