FACTION: The Mongol Empire

[firekiller]

well having mongols reskinned would be great i would download that mini mod straight away wenn it is out

[cossacks368]

In the history , Genghis Khan had managed his Mongols amry in the following part :

蒙古步兵 Mongolian infantry

蒙古弓骑兵Mongolian light Archer cavalry

蒙古重型枪骑兵 Mongolian heavy spear cavalry

蒙古神火飞鸦弓兵 Mongolian Flying Fire Crow soldiers

蒙古抛弹兵 Mongols Grenader

蒙古八鲁营敢死军 BALU Suicide Company（Every Mongolian man got the serious crime can choose death or join the BALU Suicide Company for Fight on the first frontline，when thier kill more than 100 Enemies ，their are free）

蒙古塔塔尔突击骑兵 Tatars assault cavalry （they are the surrenders of the Jin Dynasty）

蒙古怯薛军精锐骑兵 keig cavalry (the Banners of khan ，Elite of amry and Gendarmes of Mongols amry，only the Noble descent can join)

蒙古那克尔骑兵 Nakeer cavalry (the Mongols Nobles cavalry)

The information is from Chinese history website :

http://baike.baidu.com/view/930703.html

http://bbs.tiexue.net/post2_2046808_1.html

[mastaace]

this suicide commando sounds like an interesting unit...

maybe high attack and low defence?

[Miraj]

The suicide squads sound so bloody amazingly terrifying. Its that little dangling of hope (kill 100 men and you're free) that really makes it all the more chilling and creative. Mongols mongols, never cease to amaze me.

[The Mongol]

Never cease to amaze indeed. Interesting stuff cossacks +rep. That suicide squad is really something else. Just wow.

I really need to read more Chinese accounts of the Mongolians. I've read many more European/Mid-East accounts. It goes to show they really differed in each theater of war. They may have been terrifying but you have to respect their amazing ability to adapt. What I want to know is what is this "Flying Fire Crow", they sure made some interesting uses for gunpowder in Asia. (Assuming it has something to do with gunpowder)

But those Vietnamese still have a tendency to not get their asses kicked. +rep to them too

[Kalos]

Huzzah!

[The Mongol]

So far so good Kalos, the faces are definitely an improvement.


I just thought, that BALU Suicide Squad would make a badass unit, the Forlorn's Hope of the Mongols

[cossacks368]

What I want to know is what is this "Flying Fire Crow", they sure made some interesting uses for gunpowder in Asia. (Assuming it has something to do with gunpowder)

Its is a modified rockets.The production method is used bamboo and paper into a projectile, installed on both ends of wings, in order to increase its stability in the air, like the overall shape of a flying crow. Within its belly filled with explosives strapped to the abdomen under four rockets, rocket launchers and explosives to primers FireWire linked. After the rocket ignited, the raven in the sky, fly to the enemy. Medicinal make rocket launchers, automatic ignition of explosives will be bombed or invaded challenger, amphibious. If the rocket propellant loading of larger, can fly to a distance of 300 meters away.

[The Mongol]

Oh my god! That is one badass weapon.

Thanks a bunch for the info cossack, I'm sure everyone else will appreciate it too

Too bad I just repped you or else I would again.

[cossacks368]

Mongolian totem is blue wolf and white deer .

Mongolians believe that Chinggis Khan was descended from a blue wolf and a white deer. The wolf tail is a sacred totem of the Mongols .



That pic found in Mongolia's National Museum，and the photo is show their Myth symbol of faith in Mongolian capital.

[Kalos]

Mongolian totem is blue wolf and white deer .

Mongolians believe that Chinggis Khan was descended from a blue wolf and a white deer. The wolf tail is a sacred totem of the Mongols .



That pic found in Mongolia's National Museum，and the photo is show their Myth symbol of faith in Mongolian capital.

That's gonna be useful doing Mongol banners or the general, thanks.

[cossacks368]

I suggest Balu Suicide Company and keig banners are necessary in the mod.

Their history is found in Mongols history.The real main blood of the Monglos army .

keig banners 怯薛军 ，the words in Mongolian is keig(Turkish “kezik”)

Balu Suicide Company 八鲁营敢死军

成吉思汗攻金
蒙古成吉思汗六年二月，成吉思汗自 龙驹河(今蒙古克鲁伦河)誓师伐金，越过沙漠，袭击金朝边地。同年秋，兵分两路，以钳形攻势大举攻金。成吉思汗亲率东路军（怯薛），袭取乌月营、乌沙堡(今河北兴 和西北)，迫使金军弃抚州(今河北张北县)，退屯宣平(今河北万全)。八月，金将完颜承裕率军30万，列阵野狐岭(今河北万全西北)以北迎战。成吉思汗命万户木华黎率八鲁敢死士在前冲杀，自率主力跟进。金军溃败，退至会河(今河北怀安之洋河)，大部被歼，蒙古军遂拔宣德(今河北宣化)。九月，蒙古军进抵中都 (今北京)，因城垣坚固，金屯有重兵，蒙古军攻城失利，被迫撤围。与此同时，西路蒙古军由成吉思汗之子术赤、察合台、窝阔台率领，破云内(今内蒙古呼和浩特西南)、东胜(今托克托)、武(今山西五寨北)、朔(今属山西)等州。金西京(今山西大同)守将纥石烈胡沙虎闻讯弃城逃跑。两路蒙古军掳掠大批人畜和财物后撤兵(参见边堡寨之战)。

Genghis Khan’s Invasion of Jin

In February 1212, Genghis Khan began his campaign against Jin and raided the borders of Jin. In Autumn 1212, he divided his forces into 2 and began to attack Jin from two sides. Genghis Khan personally led his keig forces to attack Wuyueying and Wushabao (today’s Hubei province northwest of Xinghe) and forced the Jin to abandon Huzhou and retreat to Xuanpin. In August 1212, the Jin general Wanyan Chengyu led 300,000 forces in formation at Yehuling (today’s Hebei Province Northwest of Wanquan) to fight against the Mongol. Genghis Khan ordered Muhuali to dispatch a Balu suicide squad to confront the Jin while he led the main force to follow. The Jin army was defeated and was forced to retreat to Hui river (today’s Hebei province Huaian river). The bulk of Jin army was destroyed. By September 1212, the Mongols reached Zhongdu (Beijing). Because the walls of the city was heavily fortified with Jin army, the Mongols failed to lay siege to the city and was forced to retreat.

The websites in chinese wiki and sohu.com:

http://www.wiki.cn/wiki/%E6%80%AF%E8%96%9B
http://club.mil.news.sohu.com/read_a...2849&NoCache=1

[baiyaan]

In the history , Genghis Khan had managed his Mongols amry in the following part :

蒙古步兵 Mongolian infantry

蒙古弓骑兵Mongolian light Archer cavalry

蒙古重型枪骑兵 Mongolian heavy spear cavalry

蒙古神火飞鸦弓兵 Mongolian Flying Fire Crow soldiers

蒙古抛弹兵 Mongols Grenader

蒙古八鲁营敢死军 BALU Suicide Company（Every Mongolian man got the serious crime can choose death or join the BALU Suicide Company for Fight on the first frontline，when thier kill more than 100 Enemies ，their are free）

蒙古塔塔尔突击骑兵 Tatars assault cavalry （they are the surrenders of the Jin Dynasty）

蒙古怯薛军精锐骑兵 QieXue cavalry (the Banners of khan ，Elite of amry and Gendarmes of Mongols amry，only the Noble descent can join)

蒙古那克尔骑兵 Nakeer cavalry (the Mongols Nobles cavalry)

The information is from Chinese history website :

http://baike.baidu.com/view/930703.html

http://bbs.tiexue.net/post2_2046808_1.html

I don't understand. What do Mongols have to do with Chinese?
You might just go to a Russian site and get the info on the Mongols.
All of the above appear to be a wild imagination of some Chinese guys.

[baiyaan]

I suggest Balu Suicide Company and keig banners is necessary in the mod.

Their history is found in Mongols history.The real main blood of the Monglos army .

keig banners 怯薛军 ，the words in Mongolian is keig(Turkish “kezik”)

Curious since Mongols did not write on their banners in Chinese characters.
I am not trying to discourage your worthwhile effort but I just don't want to see a mod that has the likes of "Ling Fang Fung" "Lin Chin Chin" as the names of Mongol generals. (this actually happened in MTW and STW MI)

[cossacks368]

I just want to help to rich the mod. I just post the info about the Chinese war between Mongol and Jin . And I did not just go to a Russian site . You can go to Mongolia official history website to see some information and I think it would be better ~ ~(If you can read those Mongolian words)

I think wikipedia is a good website to find that info ~

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Mongolia

Genghis Khan’s Invasion of Jin ,conquered Jin.

Genghis Khan and his descendents politically used the slogan of ‘resisting oppression’ to motivate the Mongols’ fighting spirit. In terms of strategy, they made use of the feud and contradictions between Jin, Song, Xia and conquered each of them. What is most noteworthy is to make use of the route in Song and ally with Song to attack Jin. In terms of tactics, the Mongols make use of the tactics of “saying to attack east but attacking west instead”, a combined maneuver to attack, surprise attack. They also learnt much of the technology from China and improve upon their weaponry in order to improve their firing power. As for Jin rulers, the dynasty is too corrupt and had too many enemies. Their tactics were impractical and morale was low, leading to their extermination. The Mongols paved way for the unification of China.

[cossacks368]

Curious since Mongols did not write on their banners in Chinese characters.
I am not trying to discourage your worthwhile effort but I just don't want to see a mod that has the likes of "Ling Fang Fung" "Lin Chin Chin" as the names of Mongol generals. (this actually happened in MTW and STW MI)

I don't like the names of Mongol generals in Chinese characters too . Mongolian never use in Chinese characters.

but Mongols did write their banners in Yuan Dynasty . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuan_Dynasty

you can find some real Mongolian name and post it ,it will be much helpful~

[teh.frickin.pope]

Genghis Khan and his descendents politically used the slogan of ‘resisting oppression’ to motivate the Mongols’ fighting spirit.

Some things never change, eh?

[baiyaan]

...but Mongols did write their banners in Yuan Dynasty . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuan_Dynasty
...

The link you provided says nothing as such.

"Han (Han Chinese in northern China, Manchus, and Jurchens) " from that site is very telling. They don't know what they are talking about.

Mongols like their predecessors maintained a biparteid system and the Chinese character they adopted(Yuan) for their dynasty was to seek legitimacy among the Han chinese subjects. They never regarded themselves a part of China. "Reunification of China" was never in their mind.

Their competition with Ming was in regard to the legitimacy among Han Chinese. They never considered the Mongol nation itself a part of this political game.

Moreover the Mongols in this mod appear to be from the outside of Yuan and they certainly had nothing whatsoever to do with Chinese or Chinese characters.

Also you seem to exaggerate the importance of Chinese in their military campaigns. I see a single Chinese sounding name among the Mongol generals but his origin is uncertain. But the idea that there were a Chinese office corps is pretty silly given that how much they were despised.

When Chinese surrendered their officers and generals were often allowed to lead their own Chinese soldiers but even here their activities were mostly restricted to China. One exception would be the southern expeditionary force in the 2nd invasion of Japan but I don't think that will be covered here not to mention that the whole endeavor was a joke.

And Jin was not Chinese. Jin's ruling class was largely Jurchen and their imperial house had Korean roots. Like thier predecessors in "5 barbarian and 16 states Era", they employed a biparteid system and most of their miliarty elites were Jurchens, not Chinese.

There were also very few ,if any, Koreans. Mongols did not manage to subjugate them till 1260 or so and even when it happened it took a form of "peace treaty", not direct conquest, where the Koreans agreed to become a "son in law" nation, accepting Mongol princesses as their queens. Even after that they were allowed to maintain nominal independence in the southern 2/3 of the peninsulla.

Koreans provided most of the sailors and the archers in the 2 invasions of Japan but once again that will not be covered in this game. And other than that, Koreans were never part of any Mongol campaigns.(except in a Mongol succession war in which a Korean king supported his Mongol cousin for the throne etc and suppressing Chinese rebels.)

In short, I think Koreans and Chinese should be left out of this game unless you want to cover the conquests of Jin and Sung. For the foreign troops in the Mongol forces I suggest Turks. Turks made up most of the Mongol forces in their western campaigns. up to 90 percent according to some estimate. Most units typical of various turkic factions should be made avaliable to the mongols as well.

[baiyaan]

... They also learnt much of the technology from China and improve upon their weaponry in order to improve their firing power. ...

This is silly. What firing power? Their primary shooting weapons were recurved composite bows which had nothing to do with China.

They did adopt gunpowder weapons but whether they were Chinese in origin has not been proven.(even though at least some of them probably were)

As I said Jin was not Chinese. In fact Mongols tried to play up and encourage the internal discord and ethnic tension in Jin.

[AlphaDelta]

In short, I think Koreans and Chinese should be left out of this game

I'm happy to hear that.