Help Me Euros!!!!

**NaptownKnight** · February 23, 2007, 10:24 PM

I need help understanding how european football works, I mean the league formast and all of that. I hear all the time about the champions league, and I know that my favorite player, Thiereu (IDK how to spell his name) Henry plays in it, but thats about it. I know all the rules of the actual game, infact I ref soccer for a local church league, I just don't know how the euros run it since international soccer gets so few airtime over on this side of the pond. I was wondering though what you Euros think of Freddy Adu ( the teenage sensation), and how good he is compared to some of the players over there.

**Sidus Preclarum** · February 24, 2007, 05:28 AM

It is rather complex. I'll mostly use the exemple of France to illustrate that.
Each country has a football federation , which holds yearly tournaments (leagues) held by level divisions (and, for the lowest level, regionnal divisions) Each federation decides how those are organized, ie how many teams are in each divisions, how many spots can make you go up or down one division at the end of the season, &c. THe federation also usually organizes a cup, ie a competition between every team in the association. Of course, not all team participate from the start in the competition, there would be no interest in seeing 6th division team meeting a 1st division one in its firts round, for either team: teams enter the cup graduatedly, the better they are the later they get in.
Now, teams in the top leagues are professional. How many of the leagues are professional depends on the size of the country. For exemple, in France; Ligue 1 & 2 are professional, while "nationale" (3rd Div) has 2 professional teams while the remaining 18 are semi-pros. the four regional level below (CFA1A-D) are a mix of amateur clubs and reserve teams of 1st division clubs . In France, the professional clubs are united in their own syndicate, or "league", which also organizes its own cup.
NOw how do all these people enter European competitions?
Well, for starters, the UEFA ranks each national federations according to size and quality, and give slots in the main 2 UEFA competitions (Champion's league: 3 preliminary knowck out stages, one group stage_8 groups of four_, then knock out stages, and UEFA cup: which has a similar pattern ) accordingly.Association ranks also determine the stage at which the qualified teams will enter the competition. Ie, a strong and big country will secure several CL group spots with a few CL qualifying rounds and UEFA cup slots to boot , while small federations will have to be content with a single CL preliminaries rounds spot and a few UEFA cup preliminaries spot... see here.
The national federation spreads the spots as reward to their own competitions: For exemple, in France, finishing 1st and 2nd in the 1st league will grant you access to the Champion's league, ending up 3rd will give you a CL preliminary groups slots, Ending 4rth an UEFA cup slot, Wining the CUp or the league Cup an UEFA slot (so that, technically, an amateur club can get into the UEFA cup) . Besides, runner ups of all federations leagues and cups (numbers depending on UEFA rankings again) enter UEFA tournaments called Intertoto. There are 11 of them, each having a winner, which is granted a spot in the UEFA cup preliminary rounds. Also, teams eliminated in the Champion's league 3rd qualifying knockout stage are sent in the UEFA cup , and the teams finishing 3rd of their group in the group stage are sent in the UEFA cup round of 32. Furthemore, 3 slots can be grabed in the UEFA cup through a fair-play based ranking . I won't even mention the adjustement caused by the need of the defending CL champion to be present in the competition, even if he failed to secure a qualifying spot ...
So, as you can see, it's pretty complicated. I wish there was an diagram of this somewhere, covering all the UEFA competitions and means to qualify in them, it should be a pretty funny document...

**NaptownKnight** · February 24, 2007, 08:32 AM

Wow that is pretty complex. Have you ever noticed how we organize the MLS over here? It is more on the lines of american football or basketball. Pretty organized and simple. Have you ever wished for Euro leagues to be organized like that? BTW how far do you think the U.S. team can get in the next World Cup, especially after our beatdown of mexico?

**Arakorn** · February 24, 2007, 09:04 AM

I won't bother reading the uber-long post (

) and I'll assume that everything's well explained there, but I'd like to put my input on Addu.

I saw him live (I think...) when the U-17 (Under 17's) World Cup in football was played here in Finland. He was only 14 years old then, and he was a really good player back then (even though he was 2-3 years older than most other players). Since that I haven't heard of him at all really, so I guess it was just another promising young talent that never blossomed...

EDIT: still decided to reply to your second post. :wink:

The difference is that the Champions League isn't really a league, it's more of a cup, where you determine the best Club in Europe. So there's no way it's ever gonna become that "organized and simple" :wink:.

**NaptownKnight** · February 24, 2007, 09:12 AM

Originally Posted by Arakorn-eir

I won't bother reading the uber-long post (

) and I'll assume that everything's well explained there, but I'd like to put my input on Addu.

I saw him live (I think...) when the U-17 (Under 17's) World Cup in football was played here in Finland. He was only 14 years old then, and he was a really good player back then (even though he was 2-3 years older than most other players). Since that I haven't heard of him at all really, so I guess it was just another promising young talent that never blossomed...

He is amazing when you watch him, but I too havent heard much from him lately (he got traded last I heard) He was supposed to be the next Pelle. He was the highest paid soccer (I use this term so no one gets confused, because hes not the highest paid football player in america, peyton manning is) player in america, at age 14. EDIT So a semi pro team could win the cup? Because when I was at summer camp a few years ago my camp councilor was a semi-pro player from estonia, and maybe he could win the cup lol.

**Arakorn** · February 24, 2007, 09:28 AM

Well to get into the Champions League, you have to be in at least top-4 in your Country's national league. This applies only for the bigger countries of course (Spian, England, Italy etc). From these, the 3 best advances straightly into CL (Champions League), while the third has to qualify. From smaller countries they don't get as many teams, or, as in the case with Finland, maybe not a single one!

In Finland, the champion of last year has to qualify to enter the CL. (Has only happened once, when HJK from Helsinki qualifyed). All other years the Finnish teams haven't qualifyed.

Then there are other cups, such as the UEFA cup, and even smaller ones such as the Intertoto cup (don't really know much about this...)

**jankren** · February 24, 2007, 12:17 PM

First of all Freddy Adu sucks big time if compared to European young stars. His decision to play as professional in MLS when he was still really young instead of going to Europe and trained with major clubs which he does now would probably kill his promising prospect. Second, it drives me nuts trying to understand how MLS works!! Especially the transfer system.

By the way, Thierry Henry is my favorite star too. He is like the best player ever.

**Libertine** · February 24, 2007, 07:07 PM

Freddy Adu could have been good but if he couldnt m,ake it into Man U's under 18's then he just won't make it in the prem...

Best Player in the world? Steven Gerrard no question, best Young player? Probably Ronaldo as much as I hate him, best young English player? Aaron Lennon the wonderkid

Fav team is Tottenham Hotspur the Mighty Yid Army! The Lillywhites!! COYS

All we need is to sign someone like Van der vaart and the team we have will be sorted

COYS

**danzig** · February 25, 2007, 02:33 PM

Originally Posted by NaptownKnight

Wow that is pretty complex. Have you ever noticed how we organize the MLS over here? It is more on the lines of american football or basketball. Pretty organized and simple. Have you ever wished for Euro leagues to be organized like that? BTW how far do you think the U.S. team can get in the next World Cup, especially after our beatdown of mexico?

FYI the US/MLS is involved in CONCACAF Champions' Cup similiar to European version of Champion's League as well as SuperLiga which starts up this year and will be an annual competition if successful.

And sorry Adu isnt 'amazing', he is overrated as evidenced by how silly Essien made him look during the DC United/Chelsea friendly last year...he *may* develop as some point since he is still young but he does have an attitude problem here is to hoping RSL can make him live up to his natural ability. Problem with Adu is he started to believe the hype, that he was second coming of Pele without actually performing so he goes out there and talks about how he wants to play for European teams. He hasnt earned that, unlike Dempsey who DID earn it by busting his ass out on pitch to make a European team give him his chance, Adu expects to just be swooped up by Chelsea or Man Utd. Marvell Wynne and Josmer Altidore are far better examples of young American talent then Adu imo. Oh and obviously Im not a Euro just major soccer fan (go Man Utd!) of European and American flavor

**Libertine** · February 25, 2007, 08:09 PM

Nik Besagno is quite good as well, very promising centre back...

just had a look at Josmer Altidore's 25/30 yard strike against Columbus - he reminds me of a young german player called Adil Chihi - very promising indeed.

**jankren** · February 25, 2007, 09:35 PM

Is Altidore really 16?

**danzig** · February 25, 2007, 09:55 PM

just had a look at Josmer Altidore's 25/30 yard strike against Columbus - he reminds me of a young german player called Adil Chihi - very promising indeed.

As impressive as that goal was his goal vs Chicago was alot bigger in terms of the team. He seems to have all the tools, just hope MLS doesnt try and turn him into second coming of Christ like with Adu and screw with his head and development.

Originally Posted by jankren

Is Altidore really 16?

17 now was born November 6, 1989.

**NaptownKnight** · February 25, 2007, 11:08 PM

Originally Posted by danzig

As impressive as that goal was his goal vs Chicago was alot bigger in terms of the team. He seems to have all the tools, just hope MLS doesnt try and turn him into second coming of Christ like with Adu and screw with his head and development.

17 now was born November 6, 1989.

The MLS may have ruined Freddy I guess. The fact is, although it's popularity is growing, soccer is not all that popular around the U.S. (Although many children, like myself, grew up playing in church leagues). The MLS needed a Michael Jordan to explode their game all over the U.S., just like Michael revitalized the NBA. By pushing so much hype about Freddy around, it may have caused Freddy to believe he was the stuff, something most athletes that young tend to believe. A prime example of young players Fredd's age being over hyped and making bad descisions would be all of those kids who were going to the NBA from high school. I believe Freddy will get better, especially since Mr. B was outragously overpaid to come play in the MLS and Freddy has now been eclipsed.

**Eastern Red** · February 26, 2007, 12:02 AM

Originally Posted by NaptownKnight

The MLS may have ruined Freddy I guess. The fact is, although it's popularity is growing, soccer is not all that popular around the U.S. (Although many children, like myself, grew up playing in church leagues). The MLS needed a Michael Jordan to explode their game all over the U.S., just like Michael revitalized the NBA. By pushing so much hype about Freddy around, it may have caused Freddy to believe he was the stuff, something most athletes that young tend to believe. A prime example of young players Fredd's age being over hyped and making bad descisions would be all of those kids who were going to the NBA from high school. I believe Freddy will get better, especially since Mr. B was outragously overpaid to come play in the MLS and Freddy has now been eclipsed.

Freddy Adu may become a big fish in a small pond at MLS but if he decides to go to Europe later than sooner, he'll end up as a small fry in the ocean.
BTW, I agree with GrimSta's players picks except that Theo Walcott(spelling?) may outshine Lennon after this season. That kid is a real gem and how on earth that Rafa's willing to drop his choice because of transfer fee.
YNWA.

**jankren** · February 26, 2007, 12:21 AM

If you are talking about wonderkids, you should definitely be talking about the best team in the world, Arsenal! There is Theo Walcott, Denilson, Justin Hoyte, Gael Clichy, Cesc Fabregas, Johan Djourou and more others. The Gunners all the way!!

**Eastern Red** · February 26, 2007, 02:07 AM

Originally Posted by jankren

If you are talking about wonderkids, you should definitely be talking about the best team in the world, Arsenal! There is Theo Walcott, Denilson, Justin Hoyte, Gael Clichy, Cesc Fabregas, Johan Djourou and more others. The Gunners all the way!!

You really made laugh. I'm not poking fun at you infact I admire your die-hard support. Seriously, of the young players I think only Walcott and Fabregas are wonderkids as for the rest only time will tell and they may just end up as wonderless, lol. Good one anyway.
YNWA.

**Libertine** · February 26, 2007, 03:51 AM

Gooner tube :laughing:

Come to the lane with Thierry and we will see who's laughing! Berby coudl shred the Goon defence!!

Scimitar Berbatov ftw!

COYS