The American Empire Is the Sick Man of the 21st Century

[swabian]

I'm actually rather indifferent to the state of the US; curiously, it would seem that the decline of the US is consistent with its failure to uphold the values of its Founding Fathers: free speech, honour, integrity etc

What US-Americans do in their own country is one thing. What the US provides for the West is something else. I don't live in the US, so i of course will care little about their domestics (my care is not 0, though; mind you!).

This is a common trope advocated by those who fear the loss of their own power, namely the 1% of the United States/Washington Consensus. If anything, growing Russian-Chinese power acts as an inhibitor to the excesses of the United States.

I'm doing ok for myself, i'm not a 1%er (yet lol), but this is not the issue here. Your view on the ethics on Chinese and Russian foreign policies is, i'm sorry, obviously naive. They are both much more ruthless and reckless (yes, reckless!) than the US would ever be under the current circumstances. The US is clearly the lesser "evil"! I for one am kinda thankful that the US exist, even though i would never admit it. Oops lol.

[Exarch]

What US-Americans do in their own country is one thing. What the US provides for the West is something else. I don't live in the US, so i of course will care little about their domestics (my care is not 0, though; mind you!).



I'm doing ok for myself, i'm not a 1%er (yet lol), but this is not the issue here. Your view on the ethics on Chinese and Russian foreign policies is, i'm sorry, obviously naive. They are both much more ruthless and reckless (yes, reckless!) than the US would ever be under the current circumstances. The US is clearly the lesser "evil"! I for one am kinda thankful that the US exist, even though i would never admit it. Oops lol.

Sentimentality aside, how is the US objectively different to those 'evil' nations to which you are comparing them to and arriving at the conclusion that they are 'the lesser evil'?

Although, a case can be made that the decline of the United States is due to the moral corruption of its political elite.

[swabian]

If you can't see the general difference, then you're lacking so much knowledge that it's not worth discussing with you. The specific difference is of course that it benefits Germany to side with the Yanks. Who would have thought i "sentimentally" lean towards that option.

[Exarch]

If you can't see the general difference, then you're lacking so much knowledge that it's not worth discussing with you. The specific difference is of course that it benefits Germany to side with the Yanks. Who would have thought i "sentimentally" lean towards that option.

How does it benefit Germany to side with the Yanks?

[swabian]

That's not really a question at all, because the Chinese fortunately want to stick to themselves without touching Western countries. For everyone else it means a slow and painful process of absorption into the Chinese empire. They abolish democracy, human rights and individualism everywhere they can get a hold on. They are the big threat in the future.

What eventually protects us from them is the US nuclear arsenal.

[Exarch]

That's not really a question at all, because the Chinese fortunately want to stick to themselves without touching Western countries. For everyone else it means a slow and painful process of absorption into the Chinese empire. They abolish democracy, human rights and individualism everywhere they can get a hold on. They are the big threat in the future.

What eventually protects us from them is the US nuclear arsenal.

All this is very revealing of a someone who thinks they're american, but there is so far no proof that europe is going to be absorbed in this 'Chinese empire' nor that China expresses a wish to absorb these nations.

That aside, the fact remains that your very own nation of Deutschland has decided to finally find its own cojones and use them, saying nein to america and forming a more united EU defence force that threatens the existence of NATO.

[swabian]

Huh? Are you talking about Germany and/or Europe? No they aren't American. But they also have lots of trade treaties and decades, if not centuries old, ties to the US (not to mention ancestry and cultural closeness). Why the hell would anyone in Europe cut that all off and turn to China (which probably means Russia as a moderator, which is run by a psychopath) like a ? What the hell are you suggesting that should be done? The world should be turned upside down and all those unimaginative lackeys should suck up to eastern dictatorships? Sorry, i guess Europeans don't usually take it up the ass.

[Exarch]

Huh? Are you talking about Germany and/or Europe? No they aren't American. But they also have lots of trade treaties and decades, if not centuries old, ties to the US (not to mention ancestry and cultural closeness). Why the hell would anyone in Europe cut that all off and turn to China (which probably means Russia as a moderator, which is run by a psychopath) like a ? What the hell are you suggesting that should be done? The world should be turned upside down and all those unimaginative lackeys should suck up to eastern dictatorships? Sorry, i guess Europeans don't usually take it up the ass.

Sounds like Europeans enjoy taking things up the ass from your POV, what with all these european countries signing onto China's Belt and Road Initiative and signing contracts with Huawei's 5G. Or maybe they're sick of inferior american products to take 'up the ass' and have opted for superior Chinese products?
Looks like pan huwhite supremacy doesn't count for jack when it comes down to the nuts and bolts of it.

European nations are opting for a more independant voice away from Anglo American domination, and that's the trend for the future. The inevitable result is a dilution of Anglo American power.

[conon394]

Not to mention, your argument is out of date; manufacturing jobs will never return to the US because they'll already be taken over by robots....in China.

Yes I'm well aware of the trends in Robot use. But my point a generalized shift to the Yuan would benefit the US and harm China which is why they still manipulate their currency.

Need i remind you that the US trails the Chinese when it comes to AI tech? Surely the US would not be beaten by anybody if it was still supreme ala the 90s?

Its not clear to me they are (leading AI). The government has goals and its blowing money the overwhelming. The bulk of credible published researchers are for example in the US. One is reminded of the alarmist reports about how many engineers China produces that then fail to note that number is based on Chinese data and includes a vast pool people who have just an degrees and would never credibly be called engineers in the US. Similarly I would note comparative low utilization rates on China's super computers. The Government is good at spending money on stuff not so good at making stuff do stuff.

y'know what's better than the US dollar as a common currency? Not having that exorbitant privilege being abused, which we're now seeing with Russia amassing gold and the Chinese turning BRI into a massive Yuan recycling scheme, as well as Venezuela no longer opting for the petrodollar system.

Good for Venezuela I really don't care how they trade their oil - neither does the Fed. Russia kinda has to do gold. Facing US and EU sanctions it needs to reduce the uncertainly of using Securities of either of them for reserves. Being the 3rd largest producer of gold makes in natural option. I suspect if It was the world leader silver production with low cost it would using that instead. You got me on the last one care to elaborate.

And on that note, the impotence of the current american state is highlighted when it is unable to influence nations in its very own backyard. Cuba and Venezuela tells the US to get bent and Russia's stationed long range bombers in Venezuela- something which would have been unheard of in the apex of american power in the 90s. Bombers equipped with Kinzhal nuclear tipped missiles could weave their way through NORAD and taken out huwhite majority population areas. That should be of concern to the political class.

Yes I'm sure if the Czar says they are great they must but that means all the pentagon toys are too and everything China builds and certainly France and the UK as well. Maybe its a slide from apex power or maybe its more adult. Neither the US or Russia is going to start a nuclear war and certainly not with 2 bombers. If Russia want's to give a few pilots a sunny vacation who cares. If Russia was serious it would flooding the place with equipment, technical experts and grants (not loans Venezuela can't pay) to get its refining capacity and drilling capacity back where it should be. But I am rather sure the Czar would not like to see that oil on the market. Sometimes you don't need to go all Cuban missile crises mode for a obvious PR provocation.

'huwhite' What?

You don't waste a tiny first strike on population centers.

All this is very revealing of a someone who thinks they're american, but there is so far no proof that europe is going to be absorbed in this 'Chinese empire' nor that China expresses a wish to absorb these nations.

Ask the Greeks about the Piraeus... sure nifty port , with expensive loans to pay off and huge influx of Chinese goods avoiding Greek/EU taxes.

[Exarch]

Yes I'm well aware of the trends in Robot use. But my point a generalized shift to the Yuan would benefit the US and harm China which is why they still manipulate their currency.

You're assuming China would follow the exact same playbook as the US petrodollar.

If anything, the Chinese are getting the best of both worlds, having the Yuan traded for oil (Russia and Saudis and Venezuela are keen proponents for this) as well as exempting the Yuan from being convertible via capital controls and hence immune to American Financial speculative attacks.

The last time US hedge funds tried to attack the Yuan, they couldn't even get their money out of China, to say nothing of Soros who tried and failed to give China the UK Pound treatment and ended up getting his ass handed to him.

Its not clear to me they are (leading AI). The government has goals and its blowing money the overwhelming. The bulk of credible published researchers are for example in the US. One is reminded of the alarmist reports about how many engineers China produces that then fail to note that number is based on Chinese data and includes a vast pool people who have just an degrees and would never credibly be called engineers in the US. Similarly I would note comparative low utilization rates on China's super computers. The Government is good at spending money on stuff not so good at making stuff do stuff.

Your views are at least a decade out of date and given the rapidity of China's development, this is understandably a shock to you.

Unfortunately for you and the US, China leads in AI research and has for some time and this lead is led not by government but by private firms, including traitor huwhite americans:
https://supchina.com/2019/04/19/chin...ernment-edict/

Good for Venezuela I really don't care how they trade their oil - neither does the Fed.

Not true, the political elite in America care enough about Venezuela to try to regime change/politically interfere the sitting elected government.
Not to mention the strange pattern of oil producing nations getting invaded/regime changed once they decide to shift transactions in oil away from the petrodollar system.

Russia kinda has to do gold. Facing US and EU sanctions it needs to reduce the uncertainly of using Securities of either of them for reserves. Being the 3rd largest producer of gold makes in natural option. I suspect if It was the world leader silver production with low cost it would using that instead. You got me on the last one care to elaborate.

in late 2017, Venezuela shifted to trading oil in euros:

Venezuela Stops Accepting Dollars for Oil Payments Following U.S. Sanctions

Oil traders have begun converting their invoices to euros

https://www.wsj.com/articles/venezue...ons-1505343161

In the year since then, we can only imagine political negotiations/threats taking place over 2018 because only recently this year of 2019 did have the whole regime change nonsense and Venezuelan response of hosting Russian nuclear capable bombers and bases in the nation.

Naturally, this is to be expected of someone as incompetent as Pompeo as your current SECSTATE, after his stint as CIA Director.

Ask the Greeks about the Piraeus... sure nifty port , with expensive loans to pay off and huge influx of Chinese goods avoiding Greek/EU taxes.

Got a source on China avoiding Greek/EU taxes?

If anything, Piraeus was so successful, the Italians used it as a model to for their own ports in Genoa and Trieste in joining BRI, and as former Greek finance minister Varoufakis said of the Chinese, 'China is the real deal':


Varoufakis also said of the EU that they tried their best to enslave Greece and China saved them, whilst America just stood by and let it happen.

Call it karma, but the current decline in American power and european disobedience is due entirely to the moral corruption of the political elite of America; your leaders have lost their way, have embraced tyranny and slavery and rejected freedom and enlightenment.

[Exarch]

Another great article i meant to post up earlier:

This Time Is Different

Why U.S. Foreign Policy Will Never Recover

Political polarization has eroded the notion that presidents need to govern from the center. Trump has eviscerated that idea. The odds are decent that a left-wing populist will replace the current president, and then an archconservative will replace that president. The weak constraints on the executive branch will only make things worse.

For the past two years, the number of international students who have enrolled in U.S. university degree programs has fallen as nativism has grown louder. It will take a while to convince foreigners that this was a temporary spasm. After the Trump administration withdrew from the Iran nuclear deal, it forced SWIFT, the private-sector network that facilitates international financial transactions, to comply with unilateral U.S. sanctions against Iran, spurring China, France, Germany, Russia, and the United Kingdom to create an alternative payment system. That means little right now, but in the long run, both U.S. allies and U.S. rivals will learn to avoid relying on the dollar.

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/artic...time-different

[Exarch]

The truth is starting to seep out, despite the protestations of those who believe the world is unchanged from 2007.

America Isn’t as Powerful as It Thinks It Is

The era of unilateralism is over—and Washington is the last to realize it.

Source: https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/04/26...-thinks-it-is/

[hellheaven1987]

The real problem is not America is sick man, but there is no healthy state currently able to replace its global role...

[NorseThing]

The truth is starting to seep out, despite the protestations of those who believe the world is unchanged from 2007.

Source: https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/04/26...-thinks-it-is/

Sorry but I cannot get by the pay to read gate. What litle I did read seemed to be more of the usual anti Trump garbage though. Mocking MAGA and Bolton more than addressing the issue. In any case, I doubt even Trump believes this to be a world with one superpower that all should fall in line with. Seems like a bad supposition before writing the opinion article.

From the Huffpost: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-u...b081da6ad0064f

THE UNITED STATES WILL BE THE WORLD’S LONE SUPERPOWER FOR DECADES TO COME

The United States has been the sole global superpower ever since the demise of the Soviet Union in 1991.But, in recent years many feel that American dominance worldwide is fading. Russia, and especially China, with an 11 trillion dollar growing economy, seem to be challenging for the lead.

Russia has regained former Soviet Abkhazia and Southern Ossetia in Georgia (2008), Crimea (2014) and parts of Left-Bank Ukraine (2014-2016). It is winning in Syria. China is building airstrips on parts of the East China Sea.

But, these visible symbols of rising power are clouded by weaknesses that will hamper Russia and China. The United States has strong allies in Europe (England, France, Germany, Italy), the Middle East (Israel, Jordan, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, UAE) and Asia (Japan, South Korea,Taiwan, Australia).

By contrast, Russia has a few quasi-allies in Europe (Hungary, Bulgaria, Romania and some far right parties) and India and North Korea in Asia. Russia has developed relations in the Middle East by arming Syria, selling weapons to Egypt, working well with Israel and talking of selling nuclear reactors to Saudi Arabia and Jordan.

China, which closed all its embassies (save Egypt) during the Maoist Cultural Revolution (1966-1976), has no real allies in Europe or the Middle East. In Asia it has allies in North Korea and the Philippines.

The military gap between the United States and Russia and China is huge. The United States spends over 600 billion dollars a year on the military compared to 100-150 billion dollars by China and 80 billion dollars (and declining) by Russia. The United States is protected from attack by two vast oceans and friendly neighbors in Canada and Mexico. Its navy, with 11 aircraft carriers, has numerous American ports and over 100 bases and ports abroad.

By contrast, Russia, with no warm water ports or defensible borders, has been invaded by the Mongols, Crimean Tatars, Poles, Swedes, French and Germans over the centuries. It has a weak navy with one aircraft carrier and less than a dozen overseas ports. China, which has fought wars with Mongols, England, France and Japan before 1949, also has a weak navy with one aircraft carrier and few overseas ports. It has fought wars with South Korea and the United States (1950-1953), India (1958, 1961), Russia (1960s) and Vietnam (1979). It has a weak navy and one aircraft carrier.


The United States has the world’s leading Silicon Valley. Russia has only one building in Skolkovo in the suburbs of Moscow and China’s large Silicon Valley is not a world leader.

Democracy, capitalism and the rule of law are the keys to American success. Russia and China remain politically authoritarian, state run economies with minimal rule of law. Massive corruption is the norm in Russia and China.

The last sentences are the real key here. Read the full article at the link.

[Coughdrop addict]

Agreed on that. Nations can recover from disasters, civil wars, and invasions. But corruption and authoritarianism will, in the long run, often do more to stop growth and undermine the nation from within. Russia is a case study. It should be thriving, perfectly positioned between China and the EU on a huge stockpile of natural resources. Instead it's economy is eclipsed by Italy's, most people die in their 60's, and things are only getting worse.

And that is the heart of why many of us on the left dislike Trump and assume the worst of him. We could stand his abysmal personality. But his authoritarian leanings and shady dealings will cause a lot of damage to this country.

[Heathen Hammer]

Agreed on that. Nations can recover from disasters, civil wars, and invasions. But corruption and authoritarianism will, in the long run, often do more to stop growth and undermine the nation from within. Russia is a case study. It should be thriving, perfectly positioned between China and the EU on a huge stockpile of natural resources. Instead it's economy is eclipsed by Italy's, most people die in their 60's, and things are only getting worse.

And that is the heart of why many of us on the left dislike Trump and assume the worst of him. We could stand his abysmal personality. But his authoritarian leanings and shady dealings will cause a lot of damage to this country.

But he is neither more corrupt nor more authoritarian then his predecessors are.

[conon394]

But he is neither more corrupt nor more authoritarian then his predecessors are.

No he is perhaps the worst since either Andrew Jackson or Andrew Johnson - I'll give Nixon a pass since I think I would rather have him as president - I can't trust a man who does not drink. I would rather have drunk who at least appoints competent people and runs the government effectively even if I disagree with his foreign policy choices.

[Coughdrop addict]

I would rather have drunk who at least appoints competent people and runs the government effectively even if I disagree with his foreign policy choices.

It would almost be a step up if this administration was like Nixon's. It would give some hope that Trump's economic and foreign policy might be getting some actual thought behind the scenes.

But instead he bumps into walls everyone else can see. If trump can't yell at a problem and call it funny names on Twitter it's just a total frustrating mystery to him and apparently everyone around him.

[Heathen Hammer]

No he is perhaps the worst since either Andrew Jackson or Andrew Johnson - I'll give Nixon a pass since I think I would rather have him as president - I can't trust a man who does not drink. I would rather have drunk who at least appoints competent people and runs the government effectively even if I disagree with his foreign policy choices.

Based on...what? He is not as warhawkish as his predecessors were and we don't see him engaging in identity politics or initiating programs to spy on his citizens. As for corruption, maybe you should show us some evidence that he is more corrupt then Obama or Bush.

[NorseThing]

I am not certain how discussions of a man (Trump) re tied to the USA being the sock man of the 21st century. So I will be tempted to this a pass.

But Coughdrop addict stated this with how some dislike Trump. Presidents by their position as the only elected official that matters for the executive branch are pretty much authoritarian. This is the nature of things. Democracy exists in the US House and to a much less degree in the US Senate. This is the dynamic nature of our government. In 4 or perhaps 8 years we elect a new 'authoritarian' to the executive branch. Even Pres. Erdogan has a 5 year term renewable. (Well we are using the 'sick man' euphemism) He is also being accused of being an authoritarian. It seems to go with most Presidential versus Parliamentary processes. But how does this mean anything related to the 'sick man' analogy?