Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 31

Thread: Why corruption is legal in USA?

  1. #1
    Papay's Avatar Primicerius
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Planet Nirn
    Posts
    3,992

    Default Why corruption is legal in USA?

    In US politicians take huge amounts of money by corporations before elections and the result is a type of "legal corruption". The result of this "legal bribing" is this

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/noahkir.../#502889fd3cf8

    An astonishing report by Forbes claims that 3 people in US have more wealth than the bottom half of the American people. Should this vicious cycle of corruption stop? How can this happen when US politicians care only for the corporations?

  2. #2

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
    -Neil deGrasse Tyson

    Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    You make it sound really easy to end corruption.
    CA acquires rights to make Warhammer Fantasy games, cue fanboy and moaning over lack of realism.

    “There are no true knights, no more than there are gods. If you can't protect yourself, die and get out of the way of those who can. Sharp steel and strong arms rule this world, don't ever believe any different." Sandor Clegane

    "Kill the Titans, block the cannon, move the boulder, lift the spoon!"
    I have Steam cards and other stuff! I am selling/trading them.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Papay View Post
    An astonishing report by Forbes claims that 3 people in US have more wealth than the bottom half of the American people. Should this vicious cycle of corruption stop? How can this happen when US politicians care only for the corporations?
    That wealth is tied up in stocks and real estate and other illiquid assets. A billionaire doesn't have a bank account with billions of dollars sitting in it. He might have some cash on hand, a few million dollars, and that's more than enough to pay for everything he wants.

    I congratulate Bill Gates, Warren Buffett and Jeff Bezos on succeeding in the free market. That's what America is all about. A country of liberty and opportunity, not resentment and collectivism. If you want to be wealthy like these billionaires, then start the next Microsoft or Amazon, and you'll be rewarded for it. It's easier today than at any other point in history.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hazzard View Post
    You make it sound really easy to end corruption.
    He's asking why it's legal. It's not.

    If he's got a way to get rid of the donation schemes I'm all ears after SCOTUS's ruling specifically making money a form of speech. What that has to do with his Forbes article, I'm not sure. The US is not exactly unique in where the money stacks. Makes for a very interesting statistical fallacy though.

    It also makes his entire thread thesis a deceptive little lie. I'm just not sure whether he's lying on purpose or just doesn't know what he's talking about yet.
    One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
    -Neil deGrasse Tyson

    Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.

  6. #6
    Papay's Avatar Primicerius
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Planet Nirn
    Posts
    3,992

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Prodromos View Post
    That wealth is tied up in stocks and real estate and other illiquid assets. A billionaire doesn't have a bank account with billions of dollars sitting in it. He might have some cash on hand, a few million dollars, and that's more than enough to pay for everything he wants.

    I congratulate Bill Gates, Warren Buffett and Jeff Bezos on succeeding in the free market. That's what America is all about. A country of liberty and opportunity, not resentment and collectivism. If you want to be wealthy like these billionaires, then start the next Microsoft or Amazon, and you'll be rewarded for it. It's easier today than at any other point in history.
    Bribing politicians to sign up laws that favor your corporation is not "free market"

  7. #7

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Papay View Post
    Bribing politicians to sign up laws that favor your corporation is not "free market"
    Something tells me your favored solution to government corruption is to give government even more power.

  8. #8
    Mayer's Avatar Domesticus
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Germanic since 500BC, Arabic since 2015
    Posts
    2,235

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Because it's a plutocracy which doesn't set any restrictions to the influence of Big Money in politics.
    Solidarity with the yellow vests,
    Solidarité avec les gilet jaunes


  9. #9
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Colfax WA, neat I have a barn and 49 acres - I have 2 horses, 15 chickens - but no more pigs
    Posts
    12,190

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayer View Post
    Because it's a plutocracy which doesn't set any restrictions to the influence of Big Money in politics.
    More or less yes we are slow walking ourselves into oligarchy.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  10. #10
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
    Citizen

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    10,241

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Ocasio-Cortez's full hearing on U.S. campaign finance laws, corruption, PACs, and why America's system is fundamentally broken.

    "Let's play a lightning round game.I'm going to be the bad gay"



    Simply amazing.
    Last edited by Ludicus; February 09, 2019 at 04:35 PM.
    Il y a quelque chose de pire que d'avoir une âme perverse. C’est d'avoir une âme habituée
    Charles Péguy

  11. #11
    Big War Bird's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    South Carolina, USA
    Posts
    12,094

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    An astonishing report by Forbes claims that 3 people in US have more wealth than the bottom half of the American people. Should this vicious cycle of corruption stop? How can this happen when US politicians care only for the corporations?
    You have asserted that these individuals wealth has come to them through some sort of corruption. Please explain. As far as I can all of these individuals have earned their wealth through fair means. Bill Gates by developing much of the software that operates our computers and electronic devices that have improved the lives of billions of people, Buffett through management expertise that improved the operational efficiency of countless organizations, Bezos who has built a service that has simplified and reduced the cost of retail purchases for millions of everyday items for billions of people.

    I'm pretty sure that all three of those individuals opposed the coronation election of the God Emperor, Donald Trump. It was Hilary Clinton that had the balance of political power, money and celebrity behind her. It is a very weak corruption scheme you are describing if those three all powerful people can't control who holds the highest office in the land. Not only do they not control the God Emperor Trump, Trump seems to have it in for Bezos in particular, so much so that there is a whiff unlawful action against him.
    Last edited by Big War Bird; February 10, 2019 at 11:04 AM.
    As a teenager, I was taken to various houses and flats above takeaways in the north of England, to be beaten, tortured and raped over 100 times. I was called a “white slag” and “white ****” as they beat me.

    -Ella Hill

  12. #12
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Colfax WA, neat I have a barn and 49 acres - I have 2 horses, 15 chickens - but no more pigs
    Posts
    12,190

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Big War Bird View Post
    You have asserted that these individuals wealth has come to them through some sort of corruption. Please explain. As far as I can all of these individuals have earned their wealth through fair means. Bill Gates by developing much of the software that operates our computers and electronic devices that have improved the lives of billions of people, Buffett through management expertise that improved the operational efficiency of countless organizations, Bezos who has built a service that has simplified and reduced the cost of retail purchases for millions of everyday items for billions of people.

    I'm pretty sure that all three of those individuals opposed the coronation election of the God Emperor, Donald Trump. It was Hilary Clinton that had the balance of political power, money and celebrity behind her. It is a very weak corruption scheme you are describing if those three all powerful people can't control who holds the highest office in the land. Not only do they not control the God Emperor Trump, Trump seems to have it in for Bezos in particular, so much so that there is a whiff unlawful action against him.
    Its not so much much that the individuals are corrupt in my view but that by making money = speech and corporations citizens the SCOTUS (and also banned limits on donations) the US has moved toward oligarchy. We might have one man one vote. But Bill gates free dollar speech is fantastically larger than mine. His ability to mobilize his wealth in all possible ways to influence the political system is profoundly more than an average voter via money. The OP is wrong its not corruption because its legal its just a legal walk to a plutocracy.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  13. #13
    Big War Bird's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    South Carolina, USA
    Posts
    12,094

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by conon394 View Post
    Its not so much much that the individuals are corrupt in my view but that by making money = speech and corporations citizens the SCOTUS (and also banned limits on donations) the US has moved toward oligarchy. We might have one man one vote. But Bill gates free dollar speech is fantastically larger than mine. His ability to mobilize his wealth in all possible ways to influence the political system is profoundly more than an average voter via money. The OP is wrong its not corruption because its legal its just a legal walk to a plutocracy.
    Quick question to you Conon. If you and I are neighbors concerned about our local school board elections, should we be able to pool out money to put up a billboard in support of a candidate who promises to carry out reforms we both think are necessary?
    As a teenager, I was taken to various houses and flats above takeaways in the north of England, to be beaten, tortured and raped over 100 times. I was called a “white slag” and “white ****” as they beat me.

    -Ella Hill

  14. #14
    Harley_Quinn's Avatar Senator
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Belle Reve
    Posts
    1,343

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by conon394 View Post
    Its not so much much that the individuals are corrupt in my view but that by making money = speech and corporations citizens the SCOTUS (and also banned limits on donations) the US has moved toward oligarchy. We might have one man one vote. But Bill gates free dollar speech is fantastically larger than mine. His ability to mobilize his wealth in all possible ways to influence the political system is profoundly more than an average voter via money. The OP is wrong its not corruption because its legal its just a legal walk to a plutocracy.
    If you look at the past and present influence of the Koch brothers on the GOP i tend to agree.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politi..._Koch_brothers

  15. #15
    Big War Bird's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    South Carolina, USA
    Posts
    12,094

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    I like how so many people criticize "money in politics." The implication is that the person doing the criticizing is endowed with special knowledge and an exemplary ethical compass and therefore immune to the "corrosive" effect of money in politics while everyone else is an inferior dolt that cant help but to be hypnotized by the last thing he heard.
    As a teenager, I was taken to various houses and flats above takeaways in the north of England, to be beaten, tortured and raped over 100 times. I was called a “white slag” and “white ****” as they beat me.

    -Ella Hill

  16. #16
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Colfax WA, neat I have a barn and 49 acres - I have 2 horses, 15 chickens - but no more pigs
    Posts
    12,190

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quick question to you Conon. If you and I are neighbors concerned about our local school board elections, should we be able to pool out money to put up a billboard in support of a candidate who promises to carry out reforms we both think are necessary?
    Yes up to a point but not the black hole we have now in where you and I likely never have the money to spend like Bill Gates or the Koch Brothers (or the money and staying power of corporations that are now deathless citizens) on our pet issues by any number of means.
    Last edited by conon394; February 12, 2019 at 12:51 PM.
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

    'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'

    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  17. #17
    Big War Bird's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    South Carolina, USA
    Posts
    12,094

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    When you and I joined forces on the school board, we in essence formed a political action committee, much like Citizens United was and, I think, still is. the Citizen's United was about their (and our) right to to produce and distribute persuasive material around election time, that had recently restricted by the McCain-Feingold act. Imagine you and I in our nascent PAC not being able to put up our billboard in order to persuade our neighbors at just the moment they are making up their minds on how to vote. Do you think that is fair or just? I certainly do not.

    Yes up to a point
    I think if you search your thoughts, your "certain point" is somewhere really close to your own limit on what you are willing to invest in persuading your fellow citizens. For my part I am quite reluctant to place a limit on what my fellow citizens can do persuade others.
    As a teenager, I was taken to various houses and flats above takeaways in the north of England, to be beaten, tortured and raped over 100 times. I was called a “white slag” and “white ****” as they beat me.

    -Ella Hill

  18. #18

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Congress could at least pass a law where names can’t ever be hidden for any amount of time. As opposed to this 5 year anonymous black hole we currently have.
    One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
    -Neil deGrasse Tyson

    Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.

  19. #19
    irontaino's Avatar Deadass B
    Citizen

    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    NY
    Posts
    3,683

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ludicus View Post
    Ocasio-Cortez's full hearing on U.S. campaign finance laws, corruption, PACs, and why America's system is fundamentally broken.

    "Let's play a lightning round game.I'm going to be the bad gay"



    Simply amazing.
    Someone who actually wants to drain the swamp
    Fact:Apples taste good, and you can throw them at people if you're being attacked
    Under the patronage of big daddy Elfdude



  20. #20
    Praepositus
    Citizen

    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    5,836

    Default Re: Why corruption is legal in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Big War Bird View Post
    You have asserted that these individuals wealth has come to them through some sort of corruption. Please explain. As far as I can all of these individuals have earned their wealth through fair means. Bill Gates by developing much of the software that operates our computers and electronic devices that have improved the lives of billions of people, Buffett through management expertise that improved the operational efficiency of countless organizations, Bezos who has built a service that has simplified and reduced the cost of retail purchases for millions of everyday items for billions of people.

    I'm pretty sure that all three of those individuals opposed the coronation election of the God Emperor, Donald Trump. It was Hilary Clinton that had the balance of political power, money and celebrity behind her. It is a very weak corruption scheme you are describing if those three all powerful people can't control who holds the highest office in the land. Not only do they not control the God Emperor Trump, Trump seems to have it in for Bezos in particular, so much so that there is a whiff unlawful action against him.
    She certainly had the whip hand until he bent the knee to the Kochs (after castigating the other candidates for doing so). No one gets elected with the billionaires, you just don't need all of them.
    Jatte lambastes Calico Rat

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •