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Thread: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

  1. #441
    NorseThing's Avatar Moderator
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    Pretty much the Monroe Doctrine is whatever the current sitting President and administration state it to be. In general, the Org. of American States cooperates on opposing outside interference. This is why Venezuela wants to withdraw (still in), but that does not change the OAS opposition to European states such as Russia injecting into the affairs. The OAS is a creature of the USA and other states and thus by extension it is an operational forum for the Monroe Doctrine.

  2. #442

    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    Russian troop presence is not significant. Most likely specialized personnel and advisors. I'm expecting Russians to send more aid in an attempt to stabilize the regime. I doubt that any serious military presence will ever make it to South America. Not only does Russia lack the logistical capability for a large operation in South America, but they are trying to recover their financial exposure, they aren't trying to create more of it. I don't know how much Venezuela owes Russia, but the amount is likely in the billions.

  3. #443
    NorseThing's Avatar Moderator
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    Agreed that this is simply Russia using uniforms to assist in their distribution of their aid. If this was serious, they would not be obvious.

  4. #444
    swabian's Avatar igni ferroque
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    Quote Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer View Post
    I don't see any evidence that would support such assertions. On the other hand we have rather positive track record of legalization in Europe. The notion of "substance-abuse epidemic" happening is mostly just propaganda, backed by the same groups and lobbies that make so much profits from so-called "war on drugs".
    HAHAHA. You clearly have no clue what you're talking about. Its acutely hilarious how you of all posters here adopts irresponsibly naive, liberal hippie-views when a heavy-handed approach is clearly necessary. I don't know where you got that BS from. Don't listen to junkies, if that's the problem - they are the most delusional of them all for obvious reasons. I know how they can come accross all savvy and street-wise with seemingly rational and realistic views on substance abuse, but in reality they are the worst bullcrappers who will show off with their dramatic anecdotes but eventually come back to rationalizing substance abuse and relativizing addiction. They can't help it. Their brains have been programmed over time to themselves over and they probably have dismal judgment in general, which is why they got addicted in the first place.

    However TF this unexplicable liberal spasm took a hold of you: forget it. The world is filled with drug-swamped places that prove beyond any doubt how destructive liberal drug policies are. One rather dramatic example is Seattle: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpAi70WWBlw

  5. #445
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    @ Sukyama
    She wasn't lying. Modern liberals and especially neoliberals don't believe in sphere of influence
    As she puts it,
    And when NATO and the Western values won out and the Soviet Union collapsed peacefully one December night in 1991, there were a lot of people who questioned whether NATO would even survive. After all, the Warsaw Pact was gone. After all, the Soviet Union was gone. What was the purpose for NATO?The Alliance is also different because it is taking on new challenges...
    Sure, new challenges...
    We didn't go to Iraq to bring democracy to Iraq, we went to Iraq to overthrow Saddam Hussein
    John Kerry in 2013, declared that "the era of the Monroe Doctrine is over, you don't in the twenty-first century behave in nineteenth century fashion by invading a neighbor"
    Sure...
    -----
    @ NorseThing
    Pretty much the Monroe Doctrine is whatever the current sitting President and administration state it to be
    Precisely.
    ---
    Without comments,
    1986 - Nicaragua - Cour internationale de Justice
    2009- UN court judge quits The Hague citing political interference | Law | The ...
    ... John Bolton, the national security adviser to the US president, held a speech last September in which he wished death on the international criminal court,” he said.
    “If these judges ever interfere in the domestic concerns of the US or investigate an American citizen, he said the American government would do all it could to ensure that these judges would no longer be allowed to travel to the United States – and that they would perhaps even be criminally prosecuted.

    “The American security adviser held his speech at a time when The Hague was planning preliminary investigations into American soldiers who had been accused of torturing people in Afghanistan. The American threats against international judges clearly show the new political climate. It is shocking. I had never heard such a threat.”
    Flügge said the judges on the court had been “stunned” that “the US would roll out such heavy artillery”.
    “It is consistent with the new American line: ‘We are No 1 and we stand above the law,’” he said.
    Il y a quelque chose de pire que d'avoir une âme perverse. C’est d'avoir une âme habituée
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  6. #446
    Exarch's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    i just think it's hilarious that the US is powerless to do anything about blatant soviet presence in latin america. That could be

  7. #447
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    I can't edit, so...Post 445. Where is "As she puts it", I was quoting the ex-State Secretary Condoleezza Rice.
    --
    Finally...Venezuela: Red Cross brokers Maduro-Guaidó deal to allow aid delivery

    Today’s Red Cross development is clear evidence that independent shuttle diplomacy and separate negotiations with Maduro and the opposition can pay off in Venezuela,” tweeted Geoff Ramsey, a Venezuela analyst at the Washington Office on Latin America. Rocca stressed that the delivery of aid must remain "independent, neutral, impartial and unhindered”.
    As we know ( from a previous post) last month Red Cross refused to send help and slammed USAID help.Christoph Harnisch, Colombia’s International Red Cross (ICRC) spokesperson, stated "We will not be participating in what is, for us, not humanitarian aid"
    Humanitarian Aid Stalls..The New York Times


    Caritas, the charitable arm of the Catholic Church, and the International Committee of the Red Cross have declined to participate, saying they must remain politically neutral.
    Also, according to the UN spokesman Stephane Dujarric, "the Humanitarian action needs to be independent of political, military or other objectives"
    Il y a quelque chose de pire que d'avoir une âme perverse. C’est d'avoir une âme habituée
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  8. #448
    Vanoi's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    That kind of logic was used in Syria too. It helped lead to the deaths of thousands.

  9. #449
    Ludicus's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    Ah, Syria. Latin Americans fear precedent set by legal justification for Syria ...



    Latin American states say that one of the most important questions in international law – when is it permissible to wage war on another country’s territory – is being settled by stealth, by a small group of military powers, with no global debate.
    ... the little-known “West Point group” hammered out a set of principles, including the “unwilling or unable” standard... it gives the US and others the leeway to just consistently flag Article 51 and bomb away.”
    Il y a quelque chose de pire que d'avoir une âme perverse. C’est d'avoir une âme habituée
    Charles Péguy

  10. #450
    Aexodus's Avatar Persuasion>Coercion
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    Actually Latin America mostly recognises Guaido as President.
    Patronised by Pontifex Maximus
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    Gammon is a state of mind

  11. #451
    conon394's Avatar hoi polloi
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    i just think it's hilarious that the US is powerless to do anything about blatant soviet presence in latin america. That could be
    Ain't no Soviets anymore dude. Last time the US overreacted the results were not exactly fun and chuckles. Anyway Exarch want to dig that old super computer thread you like so much?
    IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites

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    But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.

    Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.

  12. #452
    Vanoi's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: Deteriorating Situation in Venezuela

    Aexodus makes a fair point. Being politically neutral in regards to aid doesn't help anyone. Just like when the Syrian government would not allow international aid to areas they were war-siegeing. But we have to cooperate with the Syrian government right?

    Not all of us are content to deny people aid under the guise of being neutral.

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