You have literally no idea what you're talking about.Originally Posted by Pontifex Maximus
Comes Rei Militaris
Re: US Government Shutdown
You have literally no idea what you're talking about.
One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
hoi polloi
Re: US Government Shutdown
How much has congress spent toppling governments in Central America over the last 10 decades for US business interests resulting in the current non functioning states?How much is Congress giving away to central/south America for "infrastructure development" this year which has been proven over the course of 30 years to not actually produce any results in decreasing illegal immigration, promoting development in these countries, or otherwise serving as any net positive for the US? I just want this year's figures, not the cumulative figures for the past 30 years. I'll wait.
As soon as you advocate for a guest worker program one that does not victimize the guest workers and accept higher prices across the board for various goods and services, I will believe there is a problem. Otherwise there is simply demand in the US for inexpensive effective farm labor and easily underpaid labor in sectors like meat packing and hotel staff etc.decreasing illegal immigration
Gaidin is right you have no ideal what you are talking about. GM hires lots of non essential personal all the time - when they furlough a plant for demand reasons who comes to work just the security guards and anyone who needs to gracefully shut down stuff. You really have no ideal of all the work the government does do you?And since I haven't seen the point raised yet, I couldn't care less about the number of NON ESSENTIAL FEDERAL EMPLOYEES who aren't drawing a tax payer paycheck. Repeat that slowly several times if it hasn't sunk in. I wonder how many "NON ESSENTIAL EMPLOYEES" Apple or Google or General Motors hired last year.
You seem offended by that why. You Think Elon MUsk is going to magically do weather forecasting for no profit? Monsanto is going to basic agriculture research for nothing. Pfizer is is going to do basic research for nothing and if they do, not going to patent it and in the US at least you will not be paying for at extremely high levels of dollars for until you die.a tax payer paycheck
Last edited by conon394; January 01, 2019 at 09:52 AM.
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
Comes Rei Militaris
Re: US Government Shutdown
Worth noting. Life without non-essential employees: https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brief...ithout-rangers
It is generally illegal for the government to have its workers on the clock if it can't pay them unless they are considered essential for the bare minimum of functionality. So right now, in the national parks, about the only people working are the Superintendents. And they're working for free. There are no park rangers. There are no patrols. The national parks are sort of in an open-closed state. They're a mess. And if you get injured, nobody's gonna be around to help you.
Best part that people aren't really considering. If the bears get used to the human food, they may no longer leave humans alone in the future. That will make things...interesting.
This is just the national parks. I could go for days about agencies like the FDA(already stopped two lettuce infestations with the help of the CDC), the DOJ(remember, Mueller is unaffected, other criminal prosecutions are on pause, so this isn't worth it to the conspiracy theorists), the DEA, the IRS(that's right, tax season is coming up, who wants their returns on time?).
Last edited by Abdülmecid I; January 01, 2019 at 10:56 AM. Reason: Personal.
One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
hoi polloi
Re: US Government Shutdown
Its an interesting phenomenon. On the one hand legally you cannot work when there is a shut down (unless you are deemed essential at the moment) - but also buried in the fine print is while under contract the US government it can also decide when you are necessary and more or less compel you to do anything. Thus if a new round of bad lettuce pops up everyone locked out now would join the essential crowd. Ebola in in Africa gets worse than CDC is going for free. Sure your private employer can fire you but the Feds can fire you and prosecute you.it is generally illegal for the government to have its workers on the clock if it can't pay them unless they are considered essential for the bare minimum of functionality
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
Comes Rei Militaris
Re: US Government Shutdown
Yea, the contracts are fun. Depending on how the pay to the corporations work, my old boss would either kick us out the door or drag us in. If the government was lazy in its writing and we'd(the corporation) already been paid we were dragged in during the shutdown, thus the workers of the corporation would get paid by the corporation as well. If it was a sort of pay as you go writing, he sort of had this evil smirk and go "What? It's a shutdown." to our corporate overlord and she'd walk out grumbling who was a lot more careful about the wording in the next go-around.
Of course, ironically, in that phenomenon, we were getting paid. Where the supervising government employee was looking over our shoulders for free, grumbling all the while. I mean, it's not like it really changed a thing for them though, because pretty much the way the agency was structured, every building had a government employee just sitting there minding things as the "essential employee". Some they were literally sitting their alone. That employee normally was on the other side of the floor from us and my god they would've been bored out of their mind and spent the month hanging out with us.
Last edited by Gaidin; January 01, 2019 at 10:35 AM.
One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
Re: US Government Shutdown
The first national parks are calling for help, since people are putting their trash into the unguarded area... What kind of human does such things?
Comes Rei Militaris
Re: US Government Shutdown
They can wait.
One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
Re: US Government Shutdown
Ah, I have no idea what I'm talking about so bad you can't even refute the point.
Comes Rei Militaris
Re: US Government Shutdown
You have no idea what you’re talking about so badly you can’t tell I’ve refuted your point three times.
And that’s just me.
One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
Re: US Government Shutdown
What is Trump's anti-immigration policy?
Do you mean Trump's anti-illegal immigration policy?
Comes Rei Militaris
Re: US Government Shutdown
Even border patrol agencies want a “wall” that they can see through and know what is on the other side. Concrete is out.
Trump’s politics loses.
One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
hoi polloi
Re: US Government Shutdown
So that is the best you manage is grade school level nonsensical taunting? Not even answering say the question of what furloughed or non being paid worked and job you feel is good to be getting for free or not done?Debates are hard. I accept you capitulation.
Last edited by conon394; January 02, 2019 at 08:24 PM.
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
Comes Rei Militaris
Re: US Government Shutdown
Like I said. He doesn’t know what he’s talking about. Me and you? Our families have worked this. We and our families do expensive things on the cheap so the public can take advantage of it for free. Him? He doesn’t know what he’s talking about.
Last edited by Gaidin; January 02, 2019 at 08:25 PM.
One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
hoi polloi
Re: US Government Shutdown
Well I was kinda hoping for something like my first draft posts - you know just seeing what you think you typed and realize later you left out too many words to make it a reasonable post. But I guess after 3 posts in the nihilist direction I should not be surprised
Last edited by conon394; January 02, 2019 at 08:30 PM.
IN PATROCINIVM SVB Dromikaites
'One day when I fly with my hands - up down the sky, like a bird'
But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, when all those legs and arms and heads, chopped off in battle, shall join together at the latter day and cry all 'We died at such a place; some swearing, some crying for surgeon, some upon their wives left poor behind them, some upon the debts they owe, some upon their children rawly left.
Hyperides of Athens: We know, replied he, that Antipater is good, but we (the Demos of Athens) have no need of a master at present, even a good one.
Quae est infernum es
Re: US Government Shutdown
I wasn't even aware of the following. This is Trump's shutdown according to his own words and deeds:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...8%E2%80%932019On December 11, Trump held a televised meeting with Speaker-designee Nancy Pelosi and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer in which he asked them to support $5 billion in funding for a border wall. They refused Trump's demands and an argument followed in which Trump said: "I am proud to shut down the government for border security ... I will be the one to shut [the government] down. I'm not going to blame you for it ... I will take the mantle. I will be the one to shut it down." Schumer said, "We shouldn't shut down the government over a dispute."[7]
Three days later, Politico reported that Trump was willing to sign a bill with no funding for a border wall that delayed a government shutdown into 2019 and the new Congress.[8] On December 18, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell met with Trump and announced that the government would not shut down on December 22 and that the President was "flexible" over funding for a border wall. Senate Appropriations Committee Chairman Richard Shelby commented that the most likely resolution was a bill that funded the government until early February. Schumer added that his caucus would "very seriously" consider such a bill and Senate Majority Whip John Cornyn said "I don't know anybody on the Hill that wants a shutdown, and I think all the president's advisers are telling him this would not be good."[9]
The next day, the Senate unanimously passed a second continuing resolution, the Further Additional Continuing Appropriations Act, 2019 (H.R. 695), lasting until February 8, 2019. Pelosi announced that House Democrats would support such a measure, meaning it would pass the House even in the wake of opposition from conservative Republicans.[10] After increasing criticism from conservative media, pundits and political figures,[11][12] Trump reversed his position and declared that he would not sign any funding bill that did not include border wall funding. The House then passed a version of the continuing resolution on December 20 that added $5 billion for the wall and $8 billion in disaster aid.[13] Negotiations in the Senate did not lead to agreement on passage of a continuing resolution that day.[14] Trump's changing position caused consternation among Senate Republicans. When asked by reporters what the way forward was, retiring Tennessee Senator Bob Corker laughed: "I don't know. Y'all have fun. I'm getting ready to drive to Chattanooga... You can’t make this stuff up."[11][15]
The shutdown started December 22[14] and President Trump announced that he would cancel his planned trip to Mar-a-Lago for Christmas and stay in Washington, D.C.[16] The meaning of the term "wall" was expected to be an aspect of the negotiations.[17]
"I pray Heaven to bestow the best of blessings on this house and all that shall hereafter inhabit it. May none but honest and wise men ever rule under this roof."
- John Adams, on the White House, in a letter to Abigail Adams (2 November 1800)
Comes Rei Militaris
Re: US Government Shutdown
You didn't see that interview? Or, I should say, ****show of a negotiation? It was priceless. It's what is letting the Democrats pass the budget they want in the House right now.
One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
Quae est infernum es
Re: US Government Shutdown
I caught a clip of it but there's only so much of Trump's 'best words' I can listen to - love or him hate him, the man speaks like a genuine moron - but I didn't realise he had outright said he would shut down the government and wouldn't blame Democrats.
Well apparently the budget Democrats are suggesting is identical to the one passed by Congress in December that Trump changed his mind on after getting flak from the right-wing media. So it's literally just him now blocking the reopening the government (well McConnell too, but he's just following Trump's lead).
"I pray Heaven to bestow the best of blessings on this house and all that shall hereafter inhabit it. May none but honest and wise men ever rule under this roof."
- John Adams, on the White House, in a letter to Abigail Adams (2 November 1800)
Protector Domesticus
Re: US Government Shutdown
Basically just an expensive temper tantrum from the toddler-in-chief
Fact:Apples taste good, and you can throw them at people if you're being attacked
Under the patronage of big daddy Elfdude
A.B.A.P.
Primicerius
Re: US Government Shutdown
I remember the government shutdown of 2013. It was a glorious time to be off work because the weather was beautiful, which was just as well because I couldn't leave town in case of an emergency (I remained on call). It gave me time to think about retirement. If it hadn't been for that shutdown I'd probably still be working. Anyway, it took me another year to sort things out so I could retire, but I'm glad I did.
BTW, when the shutdown was over I got back pay so it turned out to be extra vacation time. Not bad.
Comes Rei Militaris
Re: US Government Shutdown
I remember that one. I had three workdays of vacation playing Total War straight and then someone somewhere blinked and reopened the DoD so fast everyone watching would get whiplash but left the rest shut down. I was like, well...damn.
One thing is for certain: the more profoundly baffled you have been in your life, the more open your mind becomes to new ideas.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
Let's think the unthinkable, let's do the undoable. Let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not eff it after all.
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