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Thread: Non-Cavalry Tactics

  1. #21

    Default Re: Non-Cavalry Tactics

    Quote Originally Posted by Mamlaz View Post
    But that is not true...like, at all?

    Most of their victories were won by good use of terrain and proper launching of counter attacks.

    Dudes like Publius Bassus, Caesar etc. never got even close to encircling the enemy, hell, Caesar even got encircled himself twice lol
    The quote could at best pass as a generalization of ancient tactics. But concerning Romans in particular, I agree.

  2. #22

    Default Re: Non-Cavalry Tactics

    I hate this encircling argument. It is so easy to do it on total war but on the field it was not easy. Communication problems, visibility limits and huge distance to cross to perform it. Accept the fact: Total War is just a game and is not even close to 10% of realism.

  3. #23

    Default Re: Non-Cavalry Tactics

    Quote Originally Posted by Genava View Post
    I hate this encircling argument. It is so easy to do it on total war but on the field it was not easy. Communication problems, visibility limits and huge distance to cross to perform it. Accept the fact: Total War is just a game and is not even close to 10% of realism.
    Well Genava, the point of the discussion isn't to complain that TW and EB2 are not realistic enough, I fully accept that it's a game. But, many of us playing the game like to set our own house rules and roleplay limitations to make the game more fun for ourselves, and really this thread is asking what kind of house rules people set for themselves. And there's nothing wrong about trying to figure out ways to make the game more enjoyable.

    You do have a point though, the instant tactical decision making and omniscience of any TW player (the AI too) would make any force like cavalry probably quite overpowered in real life too, but they didn't have that luxury.

  4. #24

    Default Re: Non-Cavalry Tactics

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryoshakespeare View Post
    Well Genava, the point of the discussion isn't to complain that TW and EB2 are not realistic enough, I fully accept that it's a game. But, many of us playing the game like to set our own house rules and roleplay limitations to make the game more fun for ourselves, and really this thread is asking what kind of house rules people set for themselves. And there's nothing wrong about trying to figure out ways to make the game more enjoyable.

    You do have a point though, the instant tactical decision making and omniscience of any TW player (the AI too) would make any force like cavalry probably quite overpowered in real life too, but they didn't have that luxury.
    I didn't complain because for me it is not a problem. I like arcade game, I don't want to lose all my free time just for a game. I only want to highlight that the engine is far too limited to even think you can have a true roleplay. There is countless examples of battle where the troops got crazy because they think that their general died or because they thought the enemy has taken their camp with all their belongings. Because lack of information was the most common problem at this time. There are too much things that are missing from the engine to permit a roleplay experience. Even the fact that the field camp is missing from the battle is killing the possibility to reproduce the outcomes of a lot of ancient battles.

  5. #25

    Default Re: Non-Cavalry Tactics

    Geneva is righht.

    I too had this problem as OP, and i did Limit myself a lot in EB 1 because of it. But ya know what, I find myself still having fun, If you really are tired of winning a lot, use the create_unit command create some badass AI armies, and create a crappy army for yourself. OR what i find myself doing, Once i send a unit into battle, they stay there. If my infantry gets in a fight they stay in that small area,

    As you already stated, Dont send your cavalry on their flanks, pretend you have no idea what the heck is on either side, Pretend you dont even know the area (if your invading) and when your defendinng you can do thhe usual and just pretend it was your general hiding his loyal cavalry in the forest and having thhem wait for his runner to show up in order to flank . The create_unit cheat is really a blessing, as it allows you to create some really good enemy armies to fight, If you play on H or VH and create a good army withh MAX XP vs your army with max XP you can actually still lose, even with superior tactics. If you find yourself winning too much create an army you can lose, and create a strong enemy army that you will have to fight a lot. Realistically a lot of units cant even be used the way they were suppose to be used.

    Catranan for instance, and other Skrimishers if the game allowed should be able to sneak and hide everywhere! and that way you can sneak move into the forest or thhe sides and throw javelins. and so could the enemy engine wont allow this, so we just have to make due with using them as front line skirmishers who throw their javs and run behind the other infantry.

  6. #26
    Jurand of Cracow's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Non-Cavalry Tactics

    Quote Originally Posted by moisesjns View Post
    Geneva is righht.

    I too had this problem as OP, and i did Limit myself a lot in EB 1 because of it. But ya know what, I find myself still having fun, If you really are tired of winning a lot, use the create_unit command create some badass AI armies, and create a crappy army for yourself. OR what i find myself doing, Once i send a unit into battle, they stay there. If my infantry gets in a fight they stay in that small area,

    As you already stated, Dont send your cavalry on their flanks, pretend you have no idea what the heck is on either side, Pretend you dont even know the area (if your invading) and when your defendinng you can do thhe usual and just pretend it was your general hiding his loyal cavalry in the forest and having thhem wait for his runner to show up in order to flank . The create_unit cheat is really a blessing, as it allows you to create some really good enemy armies to fight, If you play on H or VH and create a good army withh MAX XP vs your army with max XP you can actually still lose, even with superior tactics. If you find yourself winning too much create an army you can lose, and create a strong enemy army that you will have to fight a lot. Realistically a lot of units cant even be used the way they were suppose to be used.

    Catranan for instance, and other Skrimishers if the game allowed should be able to sneak and hide everywhere! and that way you can sneak move into the forest or thhe sides and throw javelins. and so could the enemy engine wont allow this, so we just have to make due with using them as front line skirmishers who throw their javs and run behind the other infantry.
    Some thoughts on these issues:
    - I find disabling the minimap and limiting the camera to help somehow in getting the immersion - you simply don't know where that flank is, so it's more difficult to get around it.
    - another home-rule may be not to check the initial AI army - you don't right-click on the AI army before the battle,
    - Indeed, I've always wondered how realistic are the advises put occasionally on the forum to get the javelin men to behind of the AI army and throw the projectiles from such a position. I find it quite a-historical and perhaps the home-rule should be to throw javelins only from the front.

  7. #27

    Default Re: Non-Cavalry Tactics

    If you were going entirely realistic, you'd be using your skirmishers to take ground ahead of the main line, and to harass enemy skirmishers. They'd flee from the enemy line, not flank it.
    It began on seven hills - a historical house-ruled Romani AAR
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  8. #28

    Default Re: Non-Cavalry Tactics

    My big issue is making stacks full of about 4-5 unit types which work well in cohesion for anvil and hammer combat since I've played mainly as Hellenistic factions and Rome. I mean I know it's repetitive, but if a King or commander had the finances, resources, man power and administrative ability to create a semi-professional or professional core of troops to operate around this tactic, why not? It works.

    I'm about to start a campaign as Carthage and I hope the early game where you are more reliant on mercenaries and 'foreign manpower' forces me to atleast operate with more skirmishers which I tend to neglect.

  9. #29
    Frtigern's Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: Non-Cavalry Tactics

    I rarely use skirmishers to flank and throw javelins at their rear. I try to let them throw all their javelins then fall behind main line to act as reserve. Balkan and Anatolian skirmishers are good at this because they have decent attack and defense and more armor/bigger shields sometimes. I also restrict cavalry to move behind their line until they begin routing.

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