Reverting to old unit models and cards?

[DontHeckWithSnek]

This is a general RTW modding question moreso than an FATW one, but here goes;

As delightful as 3.3 has been to date, I really dislike the new troll models, and they somehow make my game ctd even more than the old ones. What files would I need to replace to revert to the old unit models and unit cards, and would there be anything to be done in txt files on top of that?

[CountMRVHS]

If you still have the prior build, you'll want to look in data/models_unit for the troll models (which will be a .cas file - 4a_orc_troll and 4a_orc_ologhai, I believe), and in data/models_unit/textures for the textures (which will be a .dds file).

For the sake of completeness, you may also want to check data/sprites for the sprites (there may be 3 or 4 different sprite files for each unit).

The unit cards can be found in data/ui/units/empire_east_rebels (Adunabar) or data/ui/units/slave (rebels). Info cards can be found in data/ui/unit_info.

Replace the ones you want to change with the older versions and it should work fine - of course, keep backups!

[DontHeckWithSnek]

I did a fresh 3.0 and 3.2 install off of MODDB. Something's weird with how the files distinguished hill-trolls from olog-hai in 3.2.

In both versions, they count as cavalry and have invisible "riders". So far, so good. Hill trolls are identical in terms of details in export_descr_unit in both versions, so this one would be a simple swap of files and should thereafter be good assuming I get everything.

For olog-hai, the "mount" is listed in 3.3 as "4a orc ologhai" (which has a distinct texture in the folders), but in 3.2 it's set as 4a orc troll, which doesn't seem to make any sense as that's the exact same mount that hill-trolls use in both instances. So how are olog-hai visually different from hill trolls?

[webba84]

in 3.2 the both use the same model but different textures, in 3.3 they have separate models.

[DontHeckWithSnek]

*Just playtested an unmodified version 3.0* Welp, apparently the old 3.0 upload has been modified to contain the new troll models/textures, so that's probably why I was making no progress. Guess I'll need to find that backup from yesteryear.

[webba84]

The old 3.0 has not been modified at any point since it was first uploaded, are you sure you cleared the fatw folder before you installed it?

[DontHeckWithSnek]

Well, good news; I'm NOT losing my mind. Was running the 3.0 version from a mod folder of a different name and models were still being pulled from the "fatw" folder.

This is making me aware that there's more work here than I thought. There are certain things about the 3.0 to 3.3 changes that I just flat out don't understand; why there are three separate models of 4a_orc_troll in the texture folder, why there's no mention at all of hill trolls in descr_model_battle, etc. All I've figured out thus far is how to swap unit cards.

Can somebody walk me thru this from the ground up? What files control the models/animations used by units, and what of the old 3.0 models/textures will I need to port over to be able to just change names of said files?

Cheers

[DontHeckWithSnek]

I'm sorta out of ideas on this: I looked up hill-trolls and olog hai in descr_model_battle, looked at what sprites and models/textures they use within 3.3, replaced said sprites (including spr files), models and textures by renaming old equivalents from 3.0 and replacing the 3.3 ones.

Still get immediate, zero-explanation ctd.

[webba84]

The models are not the cause of ctd, so replacing them won't fix anything.

What we know is that the game rendering the models as the troll units causes the crash, but the models themselves are fine. Use the model for another unit: no crashes, use any other model as the troll unit: crashes.

We've been trying to fix it for two years, the reality is it's probably beyond our ability as modders. If you get crashes every time the trolls are in a battle best thing is the set the sprite display distance to zero so you only ever see the sprites and the models never render, which should allow you to play with them.

[DontHeckWithSnek]

I had crashes with both new and old trolls, just fewer w the old ones. Oddly enough, when I change up files for models or textures and it doesn't work, the game will just always crash from then on w that unit (including if i bring back the old files) and I need a fresh install, so trial by error modding is basically impossible.

Thanks for the sprite tip, though. That'll at least make them usable.

[Wambat]

If you get crashes every time the trolls are in a battle best thing is the set the sprite display distance to zero so you only ever see the sprites and the models never render, which should allow you to play with them.

This is the first time I am hearing this. This is important enough to enough players that I should like to see the bit of advice stickied.

[webba84]

It’s a recent discovery but good call, I’ll put it in the faq.

[DontHeckWithSnek]

It's getting really close here; I've figured out how to do unit cards, I've figured out sprites; I can start the match with oldschool 3.0 edition troll sprites. When the camera zooms in on the sprites, then I CTD. I've had the old trolls rendered on this same rig before without crashing, so the issue has got to be with how I installed the new models or textures. I took old tga and cas files from 3.0, renamed them to the 3.3 equivalent, and deleted/replaced the files as listed below (the names don't seem to synch up but I'm nearly positive from looking at them which were which)

I replaced 4a_orc_troll_adun and 4a_orc_troll_rebel tga's and cas's from 3.3 with 4a_orc_troll merc equivalents from 3.0 for hill trolls,
I replaced 4a_orc_ologhai tga's and cas's with 4a_orc_troll adun from 3.0

Does anybody on the modding team know if those're appropriate file swaps? There were two variant hill troll textures IIRC and I'm not sure if there was any difference.

[webba84]

Those look like the correct files swaps to me.

[Celtic Magister]

I've come sort of late to this thread, but if troll models are causing crash, a 4GB Patch or LAA might help. Can't legally tell you where to find either of those on TWcenter however.