Are Christians, Muslims and atheists idolaters?

[basics]

Gnostic Christian Bishop,

So, what are these lies I supposedly tell? What's fantasy about asking you if the people who administer the death penalty are murderers? When did I ever advocate killing? If memory serves me correct the first person to bring about death was Satan when he knowingly lied about God's word, the very thing that you are doing right now. When you say that God tortures and murders an innocent baby instead of David just exactly what baby are you talking about? Finally I don't have to justify anything you have written as it appears to be the writing of a deluded individual filled with so much hatred that you have no control over what you feel as you write.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

https://vimeo.com/7038401

Regards
DL

[Diocle]

Basic follow a genocidal son murdering God whose religion sees homophobia and misogyny as good.

If you think that deserves respect, you show that your belief system is morally corrupt.

Regards
DL

When we talk of religious beliefs of other people we should be very careful not to ever cross the limit of blasphemy and insult to the religion we are talking about.

For me for example it is not easy when I speak of the Islamic religion trying not to write things that could offend those who believe in this religion but it is an attempt that in some way must be done.

[basics]

Gnostic Christian Bishop,

Notice that in the story as given by the supposed Jewish prisoners in each case given God gave man, all mankind in fact, the choice of repentance before initialising the punishment due to them but of course they wouldn't repent or as in the case of Pharaoh, he wouldn't repent and let the Jews go. So we see that everything is God's fault, not man's. The strange thing is however that ever since the fall of man certain people have repented and still do some six thousand plus years later whilst surrounded by those that think like you.

[fkizz]

It was my pleasure indeed.

I'd like to add that it's highly possible that Gnosis didn't ever exist as religion during the II, III and IV centuries of the current era, the term Gnosticism is in fact a XIX century's creation, modern Gnostics are just reinventing an esoteric cult which never existed in history, all in all it's just one of the infinite septs of naive people trying to reconstruct ancient cults on the basis of a very limited knowledge of few fragments of ancient texts they don't understand. It's like trying to reconstruct ancient Mithraism or Celtic religion, it's more a comics than anything else.

Just a small clarification. Despite what OP might make it seem, "Christian Gnostics" do exist in sense of, are often seen as heretics, and in essence, their esoteric mix accepts all the known revelations about Jesus and His suposed Divinity, despite being at Odds with the Church that considers them heretics.

The biggest disagreement is not the Esoterism in itself (even St. Thomas Aquinas flirted with Hermeticism at one point), but the big divide coming from Council of Nicea, where the official books to make up the New Testament were decided by a congregation of Clerics.

Plenty of other potential New Testament material existed too, but those not chosen were eventually banned and erased as time passed. Since things such as discovery of Nag Hammadi, this has re-kindled this old fight.

Before that, it was more of a quarrel between the importance of the Apocrypha, which by Church standard is just an Appendix curiosity, while for the Gnostics is as equally important as any other NT books.

Cathars, who were subject to Albigense Crusade, were Christian Gnostics for example.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

When we talk of religious beliefs of other people we should be very careful not to ever cross the limit of blasphemy and insult to the religion we are talking about.

For me for example it is not easy when I speak of the Islamic religion trying not to write things that could offend those who believe in this religion but it is an attempt that in some way must be done.

Any criticism of Islam is an insult to Islam even when it is a true criticism.

If you are to think and express your thoughts, you are bound to insult someone.

You go ahead and wimp out. For evil to grow, all you need do is not tell the truth and criticize evil.

Gnostic Christian Bishop,

Notice that in the story as given by the supposed Jewish prisoners in each case given God gave man, all mankind in fact, the choice of repentance before initialising the punishment due to them but of course they wouldn't repent or as in the case of Pharaoh, he wouldn't repent and let the Jews go. So we see that everything is God's fault, not man's. The strange thing is however that ever since the fall of man certain people have repented and still do some six thousand plus years later whilst surrounded by those that think like you.

So your prick of a God will punish us freely, but will not reward us.

Follow your genocidal son murderer into hell all you like.

Just a small clarification. Despite what OP might make it seem, "Christian Gnostics" do exist in sense of, are often seen as heretics, and in essence, their esoteric mix accepts all the known revelations about Jesus and His suposed Divinity, despite being at Odds with the Church that considers them heretics.

The biggest disagreement is not the Esoterism in itself (even St. Thomas Aquinas flirted with Hermeticism at one point), but the big divide coming from Council of Nicea, where the official books to make up the New Testament were decided by a congregation of Clerics.

Plenty of other potential New Testament material existed too, but those not chosen were eventually banned and erased as time passed. Since things such as discovery of Nag Hammadi, this has re-kindled this old fight.

Before that, it was more of a quarrel between the importance of the Apocrypha, which by Church standard is just an Appendix curiosity, while for the Gnostics is as equally important as any other NT books.

Cathars, who were subject to Albigense Crusade, were Christian Gnostics for example.

Not too shabby, but I do not agree with your, " their esoteric mix accepts all the known revelations about Jesus and His supposed Divinity,"

Here is a quick link from a Gnostic Christian scholar that shows that we have always seen Jesus as an archetypal good man and nothing else but an Eastern type mystic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02...list=PLCBF574D

If you are interested in some of the quotes from scriptures we use and our real beliefs, please take the time to view the following.

Modern Gnostic Christians name our God "I am", andyes, we do mean ourselves.

You are your controller. I am mine. You represent andpresent whatever mind picture you have of your God or ideal human, and so do I.

The name "I Am" you might see as meaning somethinglike, --- I think I have grown up thanks to having forced my apotheosis throughGnosis and meditation.

In Gnostic Christianity, we follow the Christian traditionthat lazy Christians have forgotten that they are to do. That is, becomebrethren to Jesus.

That is why some say that the only good Christian is aGnostic Christian.

Here is the real way Jesus taught.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if thereforethine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man loveme, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come untohim, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also didpredestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be thefirstborn among many brethren.

Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded

Joseph Campbell shows the same esoteric ecumenist idea inthis link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGx4IlppSgU

The bible just plainly says to put away the things ofchildren. The supernatural.

Regards
DL

[Common Soldier]

Any criticism of Islam is an insult to Islam even when it is a true criticism.

If you are to think and express your thoughts, you are bound to insult someone.

You go ahead and wimp out. For evil to grow, all you need do is not tell the truth and criticize evil.




So your prick of a God will punish us freely, but will not reward us.

Follow your genocidal son murderer into hell all you like.




Not too shabby, but I do not agree with your, " their esoteric mix accepts all the known revelations about Jesus and His supposed Divinity,"

Here is a quick link from a Gnostic Christian scholar that shows that we have always seen Jesus as an archetypal good man and nothing else but an Eastern type mystic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02...list=PLCBF574D

If you are interested in some of the quotes from scriptures we use and our real beliefs, please take the time to view the following.

Modern Gnostic Christians name our God "I am", andyes, we do mean ourselves.

You are your controller. I am mine. You represent andpresent whatever mind picture you have of your God or ideal human, and so do I.

The name "I Am" you might see as meaning somethinglike, --- I think I have grown up thanks to having forced my apotheosis throughGnosis and meditation.

In Gnostic Christianity, we follow the Christian traditionthat lazy Christians have forgotten that they are to do. That is, becomebrethren to Jesus.

That is why some say that the only good Christian is aGnostic Christian.

Here is the real way Jesus taught.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if thereforethine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man loveme, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come untohim, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also didpredestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be thefirstborn among many brethren.

Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded

Joseph Campbell shows the same esoteric ecumenist idea inthis link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGx4IlppSgU

The bible just plainly says to put away the things ofchildren. The supernatural.

Regards
DL

It demonstrates a typical failing of gnhostics that they take things out of context, and twist the meaning to suit there purposes, which is why gnostic gospels, which are commpletely unhistorical, were thoroughly rejected for their lack of historical accuracy.

Sorry, a first century Palestinean Jew would not be spouting gnosticism. In the gnostic gospel of St. Thomas, Jesus is never mis never shown as quoting the old testament, which we know is completely unrealistic for a 1st century Jew of Judea/Galilee. In contrast, in tje more accurate canonical gospels, Jesus is shown frequently quoting the OT, especially Isaiah, which we know from the contemporary Dead Sea scrolls was a favorite of Jews of tne time and region.

Also, atheist don't all "idolize" a disbelief in God, anymore than a person idolizes a disbelief in Santa or the Easter Bunny. Do you believe in the Eastet Bunny and Santa Claus? If so, you are by your own definition you are an idolater.

You also display the well known arrogance and conceit that gnostics have always displayed - gnostics believed they had secret knowledge others lacked, and that they were superior to othets in their knowledge. Fortunately, for western divilization, gnosticism lost out. Their belief the material world was essentially evil would have been detrimental to the rise of modern science.

[Cyclops]

...

So your prick of a God will punish us freely, but will not reward us.

Follow your genocidal son murderer into hell all you like...

...yeah at this point its safe to say you're a trolling here. Your post and threads are shallow nonsense and contribute nothing of value. You cut and paste bland screed, link to videos that offer weak argumentation and base spurious points on weak foundations.

[basics]

Gnostic Christian Bishop,

Oh yes, God does reward them that believe on Him and that is why one must be born again of the Spirit of God to enter heaven. That's the reward. Now the quotes from the Scripture you made are quite true, your problem is that these apply to them that are born again and stay on the path, not being distracted by false preachers like you. You do know what Paul said about such people?

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

It demonstrates a typical failing of gnhostics that they take things out of context, and twist the meaning to suit there purposes, which is why gnostic gospels, which are commpletely unhistorical, were thoroughly rejected for their lack of historical accuracy.

Sorry, a first century Palestinean Jew would not be spouting gnosticism. In the gnostic gospel of St. Thomas, Jesus is never mis never shown as quoting the old testament, which we know is completely unrealistic for a 1st century Jew of Judea/Galilee. In contrast, in tje more accurate canonical gospels, Jesus is shown frequently quoting the OT, especially Isaiah, which we know from the contemporary Dead Sea scrolls was a favorite of Jews of tne time and region.

Also, atheist don't all "idolize" a disbelief in God, anymore than a person idolizes a disbelief in Santa or the Easter Bunny. Do you believe in the Eastet Bunny and Santa Claus? If so, you are by your own definition you are an idolater.

You also display the well known arrogance and conceit that gnostics have always displayed - gnostics believed they had secret knowledge others lacked, and that they were superior to othets in their knowledge. Fortunately, for western divilization, gnosticism lost out. Their belief the material world was essentially evil would have been detrimental to the rise of modern science.

Correct on your last. The rest is basically garbage.

What is wrong is you going by a Christian interpretation and distortion of our beliefs on matter.

Does this sound like we think matter to be evil? Also as you read it, remember that it is Yahweh in Gen 3 who cursed the world into imperfection. Not a Gnostic God. Christianity clearly lied.

GnosticChristian Jesus said, "If those who attract you say, 'See, the Kingdom is inthe sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they sayto you, 'It is under the earth,' then the fish of the sea will precede you.
Rather, theKingdom of God is inside of you, and it is outside of you.
[Those who]become acquainted with [themselves] will find it; [and when you] becomeacquainted with yourselves, [you will understand that] it is you who are thesons of the living Father.
But if youwill not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are thatpoverty."

As you cansee from that quote, if we see God's kingdom all around us and inside of us, wecannot think that the world is anything but evolving perfection. Most justdon't see it and live in poverty. Let me try to make you see the world the wayI do.

Here is amind exercise. Tell me what you see when you look around. The best that canpossibly be or an ugly and imperfect world?

Candide.
"It isdemonstrable that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as allthings have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for thebest end.”

That meansthat we live in the best of all possible worlds, given all the conditions athand and the history that got us here. That is an irrefutable statement givenentropy and the anthropic principle.

Regards
DL

[PointOfViewGun]

Any criticism of Islam is an insult to Islam even when it is a true criticism.
If you are to think and express your thoughts, you are bound to insult someone.
You go ahead and wimp out. For evil to grow, all you need do is not tell the truth and criticize evil.

Says who?

[Common Soldier]

Correct on your last. The rest is basically garbage.

What is wrong is you going by a Christian interpretation and distortion of our beliefs on matter.

Does this sound like we think matter to be evil? Also as you read it, remember that it is Yahweh in Gen 3 who cursed the world into imperfection. Not a Gnostic God. Christianity clearly lied.

GnosticChristian Jesus said, "If those who attract you say, 'See, the Kingdom is inthe sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they sayto you, 'It is under the earth,' then the fish of the sea will precede you.
Rather, theKingdom of God is inside of you, and it is outside of you.
[Those who]become acquainted with [themselves] will find it; [and when you] becomeacquainted with yourselves, [you will understand that] it is you who are thesons of the living Father.
But if youwill not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are thatpoverty."

As you cansee from that quote, if we see God's kingdom all around us and inside of us, wecannot think that the world is anything but evolving perfection. Most justdon't see it and live in poverty. Let me try to make you see the world the wayI do.

Here is amind exercise. Tell me what you see when you look around. The best that canpossibly be or an ugly and imperfect world?

Candide.
"It isdemonstrable that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as allthings have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for thebest end.”

That meansthat we live in the best of all possible worlds, given all the conditions athand and the history that got us here. That is an irrefutable statement givenentropy and the anthropic principle.

Regards
DL

That ancient gnostics were contempous of the material world is commonly accepted, and is shown by such passages in St. Thomas gospel verse 56 "He who is understands the world only understands a corpse, and he who is understands a corpse is better than understanding the world". That verse doesn't show a respect for the naterial world.

You are are very good at taking things out of context, that is something the gnostics have always done, zs shown by gnostic gospels like St. Thomas. Yet, contrary to gnosticism, context is important to truly understand what is said. The same words can have different meanints in different context.

I notice that you haven't really answered any of my assertions, just provided more quotes out of context, and logical arguments ecen if clever are not necessarily true. We know how 1st century Jews Palestinian thought, as shown by the dead sea scrolls, and Josephus, and they were not gnostics. Gnostic gospels are devoid of any actual history, lacking referennces to ral historical persons like Pilate, Tiberius that the canonical gospels have.

[basics]

As John who was probably the closest to Jesus in that he hung on His every word, that disciple outlasted all the other contemporaries simply because he was chosen to reveal the finish of all Scripture as well as the majesty of Jesus Christ. Indeed, John wrote that there were many writings about Jesus but in his books he was brutally frank about what was expected of a Christian as well as what to believe as the truth. NCB is adept at quoting Scripture but is masterless at getting it wrong.

[fkizz]

Not too shabby, but I do not agree with your, " their esoteric mix accepts all the known revelations about Jesus and His supposed Divinity,"
Here is a quick link from a Gnostic Christian scholar that shows that we have always seen Jesus as an archetypal good man and nothing else but an Eastern type mystic.

Anyone who sees Jesus as a mere "mystic" may be called a Gnostic, but certainly not a Christian Gnostic, to have Christian included in your metaphysics denomination it is implied you see Christ as something ranking much above average even your typical eastern mystic.

If you follow such an idea you're not a "Christian Gnostic", but merelly a "Gnostic".

Why call yourself Christian when you deny Christ?

[basics]

You know when Jesus asked the disciples who they thought He was Peter spoke first saying, " You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." Keeping strictly to the question Jesus said that Peter was rock, Petros meaning rock, and then said that that was the rock upon which the church would be built. What was the rock? That he was the Christ, the Son of the living God. That is the Gospel that Peter and the others carried throughout the world and the Gospel to which Saul of Tarsus was converted. The keys are that Jesus Christ died on a cross and was raised up again on the third day to pay for the sins of all them for whom He died simply because He is the Son of God. This is the stumbling block that unbelievers just can't get their heads around. The sad thing is that there are many so-called men of the cloth who can't get around the miraculous workings of Jesus whether it's His birth, His resurrection or His coming back to judge the world so GCB is not alone.