Results 1 to 11 of 11

Thread: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

  1. #1
    Alwyn's Avatar Frothy Goodness
    Content Director Citizen

    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    5,922

    Default Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    Simple Navy Mod
    Version 0.9, 28 April 2018
    Inspired by historical research by BattleDrumz



    Robert Dodd; Action Between the 'Amazone' and HMS 'Santa Margarita': Cutting the Prize Adrift, 30 July 1782; National Maritime Museum, source.

    Why this mod?

    Simple Navy removes unrealistic features, improves gameplay balance and makes capturing ships more worthwhile. Ships which are weaker in vanilla now have advantages such as better acceleration and higher top speed. Different navies have different advantages, including larger crews for Spanish vessels (see below for what this mod means for different navies). This encourages players to capture ships with different strengths to build a balanced navy. This mod is based on the following ideas:-

    - Better realism: some unrealistic features of vanilla naval combat are removed. For example, 6-pounder cannon are overpowered, giving some ships a disproportionate boost to firepower. This mod does not offer ‘strict’ realism (other mods such as Empire Realism and Imperial Splendour go further) but it offers more realism.

    - Better balance: in vanilla, the ships of Britain, France and the United States have better statistics, such as better accuracy and reloading scores and either speed or stronger hulls. This mod introduces two changes for game-play balance: (1) the accuracy and reloading scores have been made equal and (2) ships of other nations have advantages to compensate for weaker hulls.

    - More variety: capturing ships of other nations is fun. This is more worthwhile when the navies of different nations have different advantages and disadvantages. This encourages players to collect ships from different nations and to experiment with the combinations. Small differences between the ships of different nations could also encourage players to vary our tactics. If you use this mod with the optional graphics pack for the Additional Units Mod (which I recommend), this will work well because the graphics pack adds distinctive paint colours for American, British, French, Russian and Spanish ships (with a few exceptions, such as sloops).

    Optional unit unlock submod
    If you use the optional unit unlock sub-mod, then realism is taken slightly further:

    - Pirates would have used smaller, faster ships during the 18th century. Galleons would be too slow to catch a lot of vessels. As navies expanded and ships improved, pirates would have needed to ‘hit and run’. Galleons can now only be recruited in Europe, so Pirates can no longer recruit them. Pirates can now recruit Xebecs in the West Indies (as well ships such as Race-Built Galleons, Fluyts, Brigs and Sloops which they could recruit in vanilla). Other factions can recruit Race-Built Galleons and Xebecs in the West Indies too, if they have a military port.

    - Two improved types of Sixth Rate are unlocked. One can be recruited with a military port in the West Indies, the other with a military port in the United States. The idea of making better Sixth Rates available in the West Indies is that few land units can be recruited there. The idea of making better Sixth Rates available in the United States is that the early US Navy relied on frigates (and that their later frigates were superior to their British equivalents.)

    - This also unlocks the Fourth Rate Frigate for factions with a naval hospital or steam drydock globally. These ships have lighter hulls than a Razee or 24-pounder frigate but they are faster.

    What this mod does

    Simplified scores for accuracy and reloading
    In vanilla, smaller ships have higher scores than this and ships of the line have lower scores as they get larger; the mod removes this. In vanilla, the very high accuracy and reloading scores for brigs and sloops encourages AI factions to build fleets of these ships. Reducing their scores (50 accuracy, 50 reloading) should encourage AI factions to recruit more balanced fleets. With this mod, generally, warships have 50 accuracy and 50 reloading.

    For larger ships of the line (Third Rates and above), American, British, French and Russian ships have a deck of heavier 32-pounder cannon. Ships with the heavier guns have a slightly slower reloading speed (40 instead of 50). The larger ships of the line of other nations have lighter 24-pounder cannon, with better reloading speed and slightly faster acceleration.

    East Indiamen and Dhows have 50 accuracy and 25 reloading, based on the idea that they are not warships and to discourage AI factions from recruiting excessive numbers of them.

    Artillery ships (rocket ships and bomb ketches) have 15 accuracy and 5 reloading, reflecting the view that they were used historically for bombarding forts and cities, not sea battles.

    Overpowered guns (6-pounder cannon) are replaced
    6-pounder guns were overpowered and have been replaced with 9-pounder guns, except for the bow chaser and stern chasers of the larger ships of the line, where they are replaced with 12-pounders.

    No 'long range' guns for small ships
    In vanilla, brigs, sloops and frigates have longer range guns than ships of the line. This seems unrealistic (ships of the line carried heavier cannon; I would normally expect heavier guns to have a longer range).

    Galleys have more realistic firepower
    Instead of 42-pounder cannon, they have 32-pounder cannon, which seems more realistic. They still have much more forward-facing firepower than even the largest ships of the line. (Their unit cards sometimes suggest that they have 0 firepower; this is a bug with the vanilla game which I don’t know how to fox, unfortunately).

    Slightly more marines and sailors for Spanish warships
    First of all, the Spanish ships did not only have a full crew, but they also carried too many people on board. According to the Official Statement issued on October 19, the crews of the 15 Spanish ships leaving Cadiz comprised a total of 11,847 individuals of all ranks, together with a further 812 men. Although two specific vessels, the Trinidad and the Rayo sailed with 17 and 50 men respectively under the regulatory number, they were going to embark 745 more than envisaged in the regulations. As is well known, the Spanish regulations were particularly generous throughout the eighteenth century and the beginning of the nineteenth century, and they always had 20 percent or more crewmen than their British counterparts.”
    - Agustín R. Rodríguez González (2005) The Spanish at Trafalgar: Ships, cannons, men and a problematic alliance, Journal for Maritime Research, 7:1, 26-43, p. 39, source
    Spanish ships generally have the number of marines and sailors of the next highest class (for example, their Fourth Rates have the number of marines and sailors which Third Rates of other nations carry). This is only a slight increase in numbers.

    Ships of the Line have either slightly lighter cannon and better acceleration or heavier cannon without faster acceleration
    Larger Ships of the Line (Third Rates and above) of Britain, France, Russia and the United States have a deck of heavier 32-pounder cannon (as in vanilla). This slows down their reloading time slightly.

    Ships of the Line of Spain and other factions (such as the United Provinces, Sweden and the Maratha Confederacy have 24-pounder cannon instead. This gives them slightly better acceleration and slightly improved reloading times.

    These changes are based on the following historical research:-
    "Britain, France, Russia, and America favoured heavy guns on the lower decks of their battleships.... The British landed their last....42-pounders in the 1780's, the French persevered with 40-pounders until the 1820's, while the Americans adopted the 42-pounder in 1815. By contrast, the 24-pounder was the heaviest gun in general use by the Dutch and Scandinavian navies." [Lambert p.47]
    What this demonstrates is the variety of naval doctrine between these navies.
    source
    The specific changes are as follows: For Third Rates and above, one gun-deck has lighter guns (except for American, British, French and Russian ships), replacing 32-pounders with 24-pounders. Ships with the lighter guns have slightly better acceleration (+ 0.1) and reloading (50 reloading compared to 40).

    What does this mean for my navy?

    The game has specific ship types for American, British, French, Russian and Spanish navies. Other nations, such as Sweden, the United Provinces and the Maratha Confederacy, use the same type of vessels, which are called ‘Generic navy’ ships in this mod description.

    American and British navies: your ships have slightly higher morale, stronger hulls (these advantages come from the vanilla statistics) and your Third Rates (and above) carry heavier 32-pounder cannon (compared to the 24-pounders carried by other nations except for the navies of United States, Britain, France and Russia). Your disadvantages are that the larger ships of the line of other navies accelerate slightly faster, have faster top speeds and reload slightly faster (because they have lighter hulls and lighter cannon). The frigates of other navies have slightly higher top speeds (because they have lighter hulls).

    French Navy: your ships are still the fastest in the game (despite the improved speeds of Russian, Spanish and Generic vessels). While larger British and American ships of the line (Third Rates and above) have heavy 32-pounder guns like yours, they are slower than your large ships of the line. While larger Spanish and generic ships of the line (Third Rates and above) are almost as fast as yours, your ships of the line have 32-pounder cannon, giving you more firepower than their 24-pounders. Your only disadvantages are weaker hulls and, on larger ships of the line, slightly slower reloading (because of the heavier cannon).

    Russian Navy: your larger ships of the line (Third Rates and above) have faster top speeds (because of their lighter hulls) and heavier 32-pounder cannon. This provides a good balance of firepower and speed. The only things your larger ships of the line lack, compared to generic warships, are faster acceleration and faster reloading (because your ships carry heavier guns). Your frigates are faster because they have lighter hulls.

    Spanish Navy: your ships of the line have faster top speeds and slightly better acceleration. Their disadvantage is that your larger ships of the line (Third Rate and above) have lighter cannon (24 pounders compared to the 32-pounders carried by the American, British, French and Russian larger ships of the line.) However, your Heavy First Rates do have 32-pounder cannon (which means that they have a slightly slower reloading speed). Your frigates have faster top speeds because they have lighter hulls. Also, your ships carry slightly more sailors and marines than others. Generally, they have the number of sailors and marines of the next larger vessel, for example a Spanish Sixth Rate carries the same number of sailors and marines as a French Fifth Rate). This is a small advantage, which might help your ships to resist boarding actions and to endure enemy firepower slightly longer.

    Generic Navies: Your larger ships of the line (Third Rates and above) have better top speeds and slightly better acceleration. This compensates them for their disadvantages – lighter hulls and (for Third Rates and above) 24-pounder guns, compared to the 32-pounder cannon carried by the larger ships of the line of America, Britain, France and Russia. Your frigates have better top speeds because they have lighter hulls.

    Compatibility
    This mod uses its own system of accuracy and reloading scores for ships, so it will not work well with other mods (including overhaul mods) which use the vanilla statistics or which use a different system of scores for accuracy, reloading, speed, acceleration, etc.

    This mod is compatible with Empire Total Factions and the Minor & Emergent Factions Unit Pack. It is also compatible with (and I recommend):
    - The optional graphics pack for the Additional Unit Mod (AUM), which I recommend because it has great textures including different colours for American, British, French, Russian and Spanish ships. This is useful because captured ships keep their original ship colours (and, with this mod, their different statistics). Unfortunately, this mod won't combine well with the AUM, because the AUM adds ships using vanilla statistics. However, it is possible to use the graphics pack for the AUM without using the AUM itself.
    - The Remove Bomb Ketches, Rocket Ships and Steamships mod.

    Feedback
    Feedback is welcome - feel free to post it on this thread. I am not an expert modder and I have very limited time for modding, so I might not be able to produce the effects which you want. There lots of things which I cannot do (for example, I can’t edit ship models or add new ship models).

    Credits
    Thank you to BattleDrumz for your historical research which inspired the creation of this mod. I am very grateful to erasmus777, husserlTW, Lazy Knight and others for your helpful guides and tools. To all members of the modding community who help and encourage modders on TWC - thank you!

    Permissions
    If anyone would like to use any of these files as part of your mod (including your own edited version of them), please do so. If you do so, please credit my work. If the links stop working and if I have not posted on the TWC forum recently, then you have permission to re-upload it so that other players can use it.

    Change Log
    mod_simple_navy_v0901: in the previous v09, the 'admiral' versions of some Fifth Rate frigates didn't have the +1 bonus to top speed which they were supposed to have. This was fixed in v0901.

    My other mods: you can find a list with links to my other mods, here.

    How to install (and uninstall) this mod

    Download the file(s) you want to use. The files are called:-

    mod_simple_navy_v0901.pack (this mod makes the changes to ships)
    mod_simple_navy_unlock_v09.pack (this mod unlocks ships)

    Unzip them (they were zipped with the free software 7zip). Copy and paste the file(s) to your C:/ProgramFiles(x86)/Steam/steamapps/common/Empire Total War/data folder. That's it - you do not need to activate the mod using a user.empire_script file.

    If you want to uninstall this mod, just remove the file(s) from your data folder.

    Download Links

    In case the download links below disappear, you can also download these mod files from this mediafire folder.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by Alwyn; April 28, 2018 at 01:04 PM.

  2. #2
    Alwyn's Avatar Frothy Goodness
    Content Director Citizen

    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    5,922

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    Frequently Asked Questions

    Do I need to use both files?
    You can just use both files, or you can just use the mod_simple_navy (to change the naval game-play without unlocking units).

    If you use mod_simple_navy_unlock, then I recommend also using mod_simple_navy. If you only use mod_simple_navy_unlock, then Fourth Rate Frigates will be unlocked but they will have the same statistics as Fourth Rate ships of the line, which would be odd. If you just want to unlock Fourth Rate Frigates without making the other changes, then you can use my Fourth Rate Frigate mod instead.

    How is Simple Navy different from your Equal Navy mod?
    Equal Navy was based on the idea that, historically, differences in the performance of the warships of different countries came from the experience of their crews, not the ships themselves. With Equal Navy, a Swedish or Spanish Third Rate has the same statistics (the same hull strength, accuracy, reloading, acceleration and top speed) as a British or American Third Rate.

    With Simple Navy, the same type of ships (such as Third Rates) of different navies have small but noticeable differences. These differences are intended to do two things:-
    - To make it more interesting and worthwhile to keep captured ships
    - To encourage us to think a bit more about naval tactics (we might adjust our tactics slightly when facing different navies)
    Last edited by Alwyn; April 28, 2018 at 12:28 PM.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    I haven't touched ETW in years, but this has very interesting concepts. The differences between navies seem really fun and I like the ideas of the optional unit unlock submod a lot.

    If I ever feel like playing around with ETW again, I'll keep this in mind! + rep (once I can give it to you)

  4. #4
    Port's Avatar Civis
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Russia
    Posts
    169

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    What are your plans for the future?

  5. #5
    Alwyn's Avatar Frothy Goodness
    Content Director Citizen

    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    5,922

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    Hi, Port thanks for asking. I have very limited time for modding and there are limits to what I can do. As its name suggests, this is only intended to be a small, simple mod.

    In the future, I might try adjusting the morale of ship crews. In the current version, ships have vanilla morale. My current view is that ships tend to stay in the fight longer than they would have done (particularly smaller and non-military ships).

  6. #6
    Port's Avatar Civis
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Russia
    Posts
    169

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    I think they will return to work. maybe we can help each other. I'm interested in the themes of pirates, Indians, new technologies, colonies and large-scale wars
    Last edited by Port; May 06, 2018 at 02:16 PM.

  7. #7
    Leonardo's Avatar Reborn Old Timer
    Modding Staff

    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Southern Sweden
    Posts
    2,640

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    I take it then this naval mod, I find it interesting, is not compatible with DME as it also edit some naval stuff e.g lower speed in battle. Correct?

    Anyway, nice addition Alwyn and I will try it next time I start a new campaign.

    +rep






    Under patronage of General Brewster of the Imperial House of Hader.

  8. #8
    Alwyn's Avatar Frothy Goodness
    Content Director Citizen

    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    5,922

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    Quote Originally Posted by Port View Post
    I think they will return to work. maybe we can help each other. I'm interested in the themes of pirates, Indians, new technologies, colonies and large-scale wars
    Thanks, Port, your themes are interesting. In case it helps, everything I know about modding Empire Total War is available from here. Good luck with your modding!

    In a future version of this mod, I might also try adding a small difference between British and American ships (since the game has different types of ships for the British and Americans). The British conscripted men into the navy using 'press gangs', while the United States navy used volunteers. If I remember correctly, US Navy ships of this era also had more space per person, so their crews had better living conditions. This suggests that US ships could have slightly better morale and slightly smaller crews.

    Quote Originally Posted by Leonardo View Post
    I take it then this naval mod, I find it interesting, is not compatible with DME as it also edit some naval stuff e.g lower speed in battle. Correct?

    Anyway, nice addition Alwyn and I will try it next time I start a new campaign.

    +rep
    Thanks, Leonardo, I haven't tried this with DME. Combining two mods can be a risky experiment because it might cause the game to crash (if you are very unlucky, you might even have to reinstall the game.)

    If you added this mod your data folder while using DarthMod Empire, any one of three things might happen:-

    (1) DME would override this mod, so you would play DarthMod normally and this mod would have no effect.

    (2) This mod would override the naval changes to DarthMod, so you'd play DarthMod with these naval changes. (That would be okay if you wanted these changes, as long as DarthMod doesn't add any new ships. This mod would not affect any new ships which another mod added to the game).

    (3) The game could crash.

    If you try it, please let me know how you get on.

  9. #9
    Leonardo's Avatar Reborn Old Timer
    Modding Staff

    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Southern Sweden
    Posts
    2,640

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    Quote Originally Posted by Alwyn View Post
    In a future version of this mod, I might also try adding a small difference between British and American ships (since the game has different types of ships for the British and Americans). The British conscripted men into the navy using 'press gangs', while the United States navy used volunteers. If I remember correctly, US Navy ships of this era also had more space per person, so their crews had better living conditions. This suggests that US ships could have slightly better morale and slightly smaller crews.
    I think you'll find these links interesting as it is about US naval history.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbar...19th_centuries
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Barbary_War
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Barbary_War

    Quote Originally Posted by Alwyn View Post
    Thanks, Leonardo, I haven't tried this with DME. Combining two mods can be a risky experiment because it might cause the game to crash (if you are very unlucky, you might even have to reinstall the game.)

    If you added this mod your data folder while using DarthMod Empire, any one of three things might happen:-

    (1) DME would override this mod, so you would play DarthMod normally and this mod would have no effect.

    (2) This mod would override the naval changes to DarthMod, so you'd play DarthMod with these naval changes. (That would be okay if you wanted these changes, as long as DarthMod doesn't add any new ships. This mod would not affect any new ships which another mod added to the game).

    (3) The game could crash.

    If you try it, please let me know how you get on.
    In this case it won't cause too much of a conflict aside for editing the navy, because your mod isn't mod foldered while DME is mod foldered.

    However, I know that DME will prevent ETF to launch when using the "DME - Ready" settings in the DME launcher and I solved it by changing the DME settings to the "DME - Vanilla" settings and after doing that I was able to launch ETF.

    What I'm trying to say here is that people often use ETF along with your mod(s) and some people also play DME as it is still a popular mod, so your mod could also be affected by the minor mod incompatibility I discovered at the same time using the "DME -Ready" settings in the DME then launching ETF.

    But I haven't got the chance to try this mod when having both DME and ETF installed at the same time, because I don't play DME anymore.



    Also, have you ever consider to release a mini mod compilation of your mods altogether by using husserlTW's Easy Launcher tool. Should you decide to do that and need beta testers then let me know.






    Under patronage of General Brewster of the Imperial House of Hader.

  10. #10
    Vaessili's Avatar Foederatus
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Strasbourg
    Posts
    32

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    French Navy: your ships are still the fastest in the game (despite the improved speeds of Russian, Spanish and Generic vessels). While larger British and American ships of the line (Third Rates and above) have heavy 32-pounder guns like yours, they are slower than your large ships of the line. While larger Spanish and generic ships of the line (Third Rates and above) are almost as fast as yours, your ships of the line have 32-pounder cannon, giving you more firepower than their 24-pounders. Your only disadvantages are weaker hulls and, on larger ships of the line, slightly slower reloading (because of the heavier cannon).
    Hi, thanks a lot for your mini mod. It's strait, clear, awesome. Thanks a lot.

    One or two things perhaps. Even if I don't ask for any change, there are some inaccuracy to correct from my French point of view.

    According to my own knowledge, there are two misconceptions about the French Royal Navy ships. 1) they were fast, 2 their hulls were weaker than the Brit. (tho, both French and Brit were weaker than the US but it is related to the type of wood used rather than anything else with all due respect for the USN carpenters.

    Once, I'll need to look deeper where we found out that French ship of the line were faster than British or Spanish... The French were the first to put a copper bottoms on their ship, but not with speed in mind, it was to protect the hull form a sea worm in the Caribbean. It's a discover by serendipity so to speak, and the British realised it too and put more effort to put copper on all their ships. As a matter of fact, English ship where faster as History shown. De Grasse push away the British fleet from the Chesapeake (1781) but was unable to pursue them. Same for Suffren in the Indian Ocean (1781-1783). Only half of his ships were equipped with copper bottoms and he had some issue to make all his line sailing at the same speed and catch up with the Brits'.

    I don't know why the game stated the French hull was weaker, but it's historically untrue. British hull weren't that good and it is known as they tended to use old wood to build new hulls to spare both wood and money. The Invincible was the 1st 74 ship of the line ever built in 1744 and she was French. She was captured by the British at the end of the Austrian succession war (1747). It was an unbalanced fight. 8 French ships of the line (some quite old) were protecting a 200 ships convoy from the Caribbean against 14 Royal Navy ship of the line. In order to buy time and prevent the merchant fleet to be captured, the French decided pick up an unwinnable fight. The first French ship of the line surrender after 5 hours of fight (dismasted). The Invincible was the last one to fight. She surrender after 8 hours of fight against 14 Royal Navy ships and not after having depleted all her ammunition (the legend says, the captain, le Chevalier de Saint-George, in despair, sent a last broadside to the British with the silverware of the ship).

    The British were so amazed by the strength of the ship they decided to copy her design, bring back the invincible in England, fix her and she eventually become the HMS Invincible. Do I have to talk about the Redoutable of the capitaine de vaisseau Lucas? At the battle of Trafalgar this 74guns was alone against two 90guns and give them a hell of a fight. French ships of the age of sails are a lot of thing but not weak, that's for sure.

    On the other hand, French frigates were fast. The Hermione is granted with a top speed of 15 knots ! Her replica manage to reach 13,7 knots while crossing the Atlantic with 2/3 of her historical crew in 2016 (most of the sailors were volunteers BTW.)

    Thanks again for your work, your time and for sharing with us.


    Bataille du cap Finistčre 1747 (Painting by Samuel Scott)

  11. #11
    Alwyn's Avatar Frothy Goodness
    Content Director Citizen

    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    5,922

    Default Re: Simple Navy Mod (with optional navy unlock), v.09 (April 28, 2018)

    Thank you, Leonardo, for the interesting links and your thoughts and suggestions. When I play Empire, I tend to combine Empire Total Factions with a selection of small mods (by other modders and by me), I imagine you're right that other players do the same. Thanks for your kind offer of beta testing; I don't have any current plans to develop a mod compilation with a launcher.

    Vaessili, thank you for your encouraging comments and your helpful feedback! I hadn't heard that the idea that French warships were faster (and weaker hulls) was wrong. For what it's worth, my mod doesn't change those things from the vanilla game. I didn't make French ships any faster or make their hulls any weaker. In fact, by making some other ships faster, I made the gap smaller between French vessels and the ships of some other navies.

    My perception of French ships comes partly from the game and partly from sources such as Ben Wilson Empire of the Sea: The Rise and Fall of the British Navy (Phoenix 2014). Of course, a British historian could be biased against the French navy, the British tend to be proud of our naval history (and remember British victories better than British defeats at sea). To be fair to Wilson, when he mentions the sea battle in 1747 which you described involving 14 British ships against eight French vessels, he says that "the French vessels were some of the best in the world." (p. 305).

    The impression I get from his book is that French warships were often more advanced than British designs, and the British tried to catch up by copying what the French were already doing. You mentioned the magnificent 74-gun Invincible and her brave crew. Wilson mentions the Invincible in the context of the need for the British navy to catch up:

    "It was an open secret that a British warship could not take on an enemy ship of equal armament without help. The advantages enjoyed by the Royal Navy were the sheer number of ships and the seafaring skills of its officers and men. This could not be expected to last. ... The model for reformers was the French ship Invincible, a two-decker carrying 74 guns ... Experts flocked to study her. Their findings sent shockwaves through naval circles. She was 50 per cent larger than her British counterparts. In terms of tonnage, she was much longer and, although she carried the same number of guns, she fired a broadshire 75 per cent heavier. And, despite her greater size, Invincible was faster and more seaworthy than the Royal Navy's third rates. She was also less cramped and could stow more supplies for long voyages. The British navy was a long way behind her her rival ... the new generation of French warships were expensive to build, they did not withstand enemy fire very well and they required continual maintenance. Their full forms were state of the art, but their rigging was inferior to British warships." (p. 318 to p. 319)

    My mod reflects Wilson's view (and the view of the game developers) that the French Navy's ships of the line could be faster - Wilson mentions that Invincible was "faster and more seaworthy", that they had heavy firepower and that their hulls were slightly less effective at withstanding enemy fire. Wilson might be mistaken. Based on your comments, perhaps the difference between British and French ships of the lines should be reversed, so that British ships have weaker hulls and are faster? On the other hand, you mentioned French admirals whose fleets couldn't catch fleeing British ships after French victories, perhaps this was caused (in part) by the problem you mentioned - that some of the French ships didn't have copper bottoms, and the fleets needed to keep their ships together (which would have meant sailing at the speed of the slowest ship). While I'm not currently modding, if I return to develop a new version of this mod in future, I'll think more about your feedback.

    Thanks, again, for your hepful and thought-provoking comments!
    Last edited by Alwyn; September 07, 2018 at 12:07 PM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •