Newb appreciation, Sweboz Strategy Solicitation

[thecheese]

So I have to start out saying what a fantastic mod this is. I've heard of it over the years, but never tried it. Recently I've been researching the Nordic bronze age and pre-Roman Iron age, so installing this and dropping into the Sweboz was an absolute shock! As I started reading descriptions, I noticed things: like moor-bridges installed across the land, much like I imagine the Tollense River Battle was fought on; Hearth-Companions using heavy spears like the Greeks and Spear-Danes of later fame, some wearing the occasional archaic wooden helm; light infantrymen who preferred to wield armor crushing clubs...

Before I had clicked end-turn for the first time, I had been reading for probably well over half an hour, immersed in a mental image of the timeframe, clearer than any I had gotten yet from independent research. And Tacitus' Germania was coming to life before me!

Three or four turns later and I was crushed by hateful foemen envious of my awesome lands and presumably pissed about all my FM's forbearers had done to become such reknowned warlike raiders. /End appreciation ramble

So, would anyone have specific newb oriented advice on EBII in general, and the Sweboz specifically? I am playing on 2.3, have read the Players Guide, and have years of experience with Rtw and M2Tw, but EBII seems like a whole different beast. Thanks for reading

[nvm]

I prefer to combine most of my FM's into one stack then try to secure the north. Your bodyguards are beasts in combat in the local area and generals will not drop easily. Don't try to raid a region if you aren't ready to oppose it's roaming stack because it will come to get you out of there. And most regions surrounding Sweboz do have one, so when you move out to secure a province, you should be prepared to have 2 battles - but with smart usage of your elite troops and cavalry you should be able to prevacil over them.

Or you could just let your capital be taken over, that will turn you into a horde faction so you can start the barbarian migrations earlier. I would not recommend going straight for Rome, though -but Greece might be an option. Just keep in mind that if you attack a faction's historical capital while it is poorly garrisoned and owned by that faction, it will have units added to it's garrison to oppose you.

[Genghis Skahn]

Yes, hording early is a good option if you're having lots of trouble and need a couple of extra stacks to go around.

Personally, my campaign strategy is first to invade north to Jutland, then Scandanavia(besieging these towns long enough to force a starve-out sally) and after that, invade Raurikon, Moenon and finally capture Luppae, which will put you next to the Boii(who if you don't ally yourself with, will probably attack you). After capturing all that, you should be financially stable and be able to recruit a bargain-buy army (at the least) to replace your lost troops.

I'd make an alliance with the Lugians early on as well--letting them have everything east of the Oder for a while means not having to worry about your eastern border(if you invade too far east towards Scurgum/Waldawa, you'll be at risk of being attacked by the Sauromatae).

[YourMadDoc]

I wrote short AAR for Sweboz some time ago, pretty much what other people said: expand north first, starve out settlements to save army etc but with focus on ambushes as Suebic FM are good at it.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...irst-43-turns)

[Beckitz]

I had a lot of difficulties with the Sweboz campaign myself at first, and it used to be even worse in the older versions. If I understand you right, it seems like you're struggling with the huge rebel stacks that hover around your borders right at the start of the game. They outnumber you a lot, but the worst thing is that if you let them camp inside or next to your borders for even a single turn unopposed, they will devastate your lands which severely drops your regional income and, in this game, can take ages to recover effectively leaving you crippled and unlikely to succeed. In my experience, the very first thing you must do is to defeat these rebel armies and secure your borders.

I actually disagree with the comment about your family members, in my campaign I found them to be fragile as all heck and huge liabilities. They easily die, plus their unit numbers are small and there is an awful tendency for your general character to get stuck in the battle lines and become unable to retreat, railroading him into a glorious death you would rather not have. I prefer to keep general units out of the thick and try to send them into battle at the edges of the battle line, also respect the code of Beowulf and never allow your chieftain to go into battle without the close accompaniment of his other warriors.

Campaign-wise, I had very good results using 2 armies at the start, one comprised of the forces under Hrabnaz (?) in the south, and another taken out of the garrison at Leufana and commanded by your king and other family. Use your northern army to strike up into Daneland and repulse the huge stack invasion that is going to come down from there; with your southern army, take a circuit west in an uppercut toward the Heruski lands and intercept the rebel stack which is waiting in the Netherlands area. These armies crushed, you can combined your two forces into a single grand army and then begin by attack whichever rebel settlement you desire. Good options are either north to Scandinavia and Jutland, like was said, or also not a bad idea to go East and take the Rugian settlement, since you will want to get a presence over there and assert yourself before you encounter your main rival, the Lugiones, who can sometimes be a true terror in a Sweboz campaign.

[bordinis]

I want cherussci swordsmen so bad. Can't play Sweboz when they do not have other germanic tribal units surrounding them...

[thecheese]

So, due to the plethora of options and a few more restarts, I've finally gotten the hang of the beginning moves lol. I started with a gathering of men to consolidate my force, and left a singular slinger unit at home to keep them happy. My warband headed North and squashed two half stacks before they could band together, then seiged out Jutland, leaving one FM and the remnants of the starting Calvary unit behind to keep (yellow face) order- then blitzed over to Denmark and seiged them unto sallying forth. The Heruski(?) to my Southwest have set up camp for years on the very edge of my border and show no intention of moving, raiding or seige. I think they were acting in coordination with the Kimbri up north in earlier attempts, as since I've wiped them (Kimbri) out the other neighbors seem reluctant to move in by themselves.
I'm trading and allied with the Lugiones, trading with Boii and Romans. This next battle for Denmark oughtta put my income in the positive and allow for the real growth to begin.

Thanks everyone! I might have to get into some AAR writing for this m'self!

[Cryoshakespeare]

Thanks everyone! I might have to get into some AAR writing for this m'self!

Well I think everyone would be well on board for that! One thing to note as Sweboz is that, aside from your FMs, you're going to have a hard time getting any sort of heavy infantry. But, if you set up Allied Government types in some provinces in Gaul, or even better, in one with a Hellenistic colony, that should get you at least a few to bolster some efforts for your army. I've never tried fighting Roman stacks with the purely tribal Sweboz armies, but I can imagine it might not end so well. Another handy tip is that your Jugunthiz (the young skirmishers) have a +5 combat bonus (attack values and defense skill) while in the woods, so that could be something you use to your advantage. Good luck!

[thecheese]

Thanks for the heavy infantry tip, I hadn't anticipated that far ahead haha! It's such a slow pace. I really dig how ponderously slow yet occasionally momentous everything is. I'm about 40-50 turns in, have secured the north and just taken the Heruskoz land in a heavy battle.

I do so love the Sweboz FM's. They remind me much of how early Generals were a "hero unit" in Rise of the Samurai. It'll be a sad day when they are finally put into their historical place further south. Until that day!

[Cryoshakespeare]

I mean, so, Sweboz FMs are at like 5 armor, 12 defense skill? That's as much armor as a standard hoplite, and defense skill up with the best of them, so they will be a little vulnerable to javelins in comparison to their melee survivability. The real killer on these guys is their locked morale, meaning they literally cannot rout. I think they might be one of the only units in the mod to have it, and it's insane. As you may have noticed in battle already, you tend to win by causing a mass rout in your foes, and the same goes for your armies. I would consider these guys your indomitable reserves - once your enemy is all tired out, morale on both sides wavering, sending these guys in (fresh, so they will have a really good kill/death ratio compared to exhausted troops) and following with a cavalry strike will win you more close battles than you could ever appreciate. To that end, I would ensure that you always maintain supremacy with your cavalry, as they are very significant in causing and cleaning up from mass routs.

[thecheese]

Very good advice again. The FM's have been filling just about any role so far, but I will definitely try them as reserves and tide-changers now. As for calvary, they become a necessity when a neighboring stack came to raid with like 5 units of horse of their own.

I've come to covet the Aswini mercs in particular for the melee calv focus. I used one unit of Aswini and one standard rider unit to hide in the woods far off, and then tore apart the enemy auxiliary line as my own aux formed a temporary melee line and my few spearmen and FM's protected a flank/ supported the aux line. It was a huge route and I was elated haha.

This my be the wrong place to ask, but I have a historical question. Can it be presumed that the ruling tribe of FM's have converted somewhat to a sendentary pastoral lifestyle and keep a long-hall or farmhouse or some such? Many have the Herder trait, so I'm wondering how to start my AAR story. Are these guys living in tents and still following cattle around? Do they just gain warriors and support at seasonal tribal gatherings in these early stages?

[thecheese]

Part one of my AAR is up!
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...z-AAR-in-Prose