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Thread: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

  1. #21
    Commander_Vimes's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    i have no i dea why but in every one i just get my cavalry to go round the back and since my cavalry is usually superior in either numbers or quality they don't even need to hide it is a simple formation
    E
    EEEE
    EEEEEEE ccccc

    IIIIIIIIIII
    MMMM

    also i always try to aim for the general every time because they seem to become absloutley devestated and runaway

  2. #22
    Trajan's Avatar Capodecina
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    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    My favorite formation that I'm using most of time with England is this:

    __A______A__
    __I_I_I_I_I_I__
    ____A_A_____
    ___I_I_I_I____
    ____AR_AR___
    __C___G___C_
    ______C______


    A = archers
    I = infantry
    AR = artillery
    G = general
    C = cavalry

  3. #23

    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    I was getting a bit sick of my usual everybody in one line formation and wanted to experiemnt with something else. I'm playing Scotland right now and thought of the following formation for my mid-game.

    A - Highland Archers
    AR - Artillery
    P - Pikemen
    F - Dismounted Feudal Knights
    N - Highland Nobles
    C - Heavy Cavalry (Feudal Knights)
    G - General


    ----------------AAAAAAA-AR-AAAAAAA-AR-AAAAAAA-------------------
    -------------------PPPPPPPP-PPPPPPPP-PPPPPPPPP---------------------
    -------------------FF-PPPPPPPPPP-PPPPPPPPPP-FF---------------------
    -------------------FF--------------------------FF---------------------
    CCCC--------------FF--------------------------FF----------------CCCC
    CCCC--------------FF--------------------------FF----------------CCCC
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    CCCC--------------FF--------------------------FF----------------GGGG
    CCCC--------------FF--------------------------FF----------------GGGG
    -------------------FF--------------------------FF---------------------
    -------------------FF--------------------------FF---------------------
    -------------------NNNNNNNN----------NNNNNNNN---------------------
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------


    The main point is to protect against enemy flanking you and enable you to easily flank the enemy once engaged in melee.

    Of course the archers and artillery engages first and hold their line to the last moment. Then run back inside the box. Archers then continue firing over the pikemen's head. Pikes are up front to prevent cavalry charges. The second row of pikes are positioned that their pikes extend in front of the first row a little bit. This is to have the second row kill infantry getting between the first row's pikes. The two feudal knights closer to the pikemen are protecting the pikemen's flank and engage any infantry there. Feudal knights towards the back are there to fight troops if the enemy attacks in a long line r flank infantry engaging the knights closer to the pikemen. High land nobles are used for flanking and charging into anything the feudal knights engage on the sides. So they would swing around once melee starts. I put them to the back to protect them from any cavalry charges. Being pretty much unarmored, even light cavalry can decimate them easily. As troops on the side start routing the feudal knights and the nobles swing around the pikemen and flank anything engaged by the pikes. Cavalry is far to the side so infantry won't engage them. They also can effectively counter any cavalry charges coming from the sides. And of course can flank themselves to help the pikers out.

    I tested this against a typical French AI fullstack army from mid-game. The kill ratio was about 6-1 in my favor. At that time I used feudal knights instead of a second row of pikemen. It worked pretty good for the pikemen that received the knight support. However my left pikemen unit get decimated since knights weren't able to help them. I was also using pikemen militia because that's what I had available in game too and wanted to see how they would fare.

    Have to test this a little more, but to me it sounds good in theory and after some prelim testing.

  4. #24

    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    Currently I am using The Danes and would like to share my favourite strategy that can handle most opponent fairly well

    A= Archer (Norse Archer)
    I= Infantry (Norse Raider, Norse Axeman)
    L = Light Cavalry (Scout)
    B= Baliista
    S= Spear, Sword (Spear Militia, Norse Swordman)
    H = Heavy Cavalry (Knight, General)
    G = General

    Starting Formation

    LLLL--------------------------------------------------------------LLLL
    -----------------AAAAA-------AAAAA-------AAAAA--------------------
    HHH-----IIIII----------------B-----------B----------------IIIII-----HHH
    -------------IIIII-----SSSSS---SSSSSS---SSSSS-----IIIII--------------
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    -------------------------------GGGG-----------------------------------


    When the battle start I'll approach in this formation and try sending both my light cavalry to the side of the
    field between my troops and enemy's but keep a good distance so their archers don't come after them then ill
    send my archer in to start battle of range if they have any range attack thats it.

    It should look like this


    ------------------------EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE---------------------------
    ------------------------EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE---------------------------
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    LLLL-------------------[Enemy's Range Units]-----------------------LLLL
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    -----------------AAAAA-------AAAAA-------AAAAA--------------------
    HHH-----IIIII----------------B-----------B----------------IIIII-----HHH
    ------------IIIII-----SSSSS---SSSSSS---SSSSS-----IIIII---------------
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    -------------------------------GGGG-----------------------------------

    The goal here is to lure their range unit from their main force a little and then i'll send in the light
    cavalry up and run in the gap and charge the range unit downward killing as much as I can and try to ran away
    before their main force can catch up with them. Normally ill just ranaway to their flank again and ready to
    flank those range unit again if there are any left. Once all enemy range units are dead you can empty your ammo
    on all range and ballista (just use x3 spd). At the same time send your light cavalry to their rear and heavy
    cavalry to their flank.

    If things go smoothly it should look like this:hmmm:


    ---------LLLL------------------------------------------LLLL-----------
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    H-----------------------EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE-------------------------H
    H-----------------------EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE-------------------------H
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    ---------IIIII---------------------------------------------IIIII---------
    ------------IIIII-----SSSSS---SSSSSS---SSSSS-----IIIII---------------
    -----------------AAAAA-------AAAAA-------AAAAA--------------------
    ---------------------------B---GGGG----B-----------------------------

    Once I get into this formation the enemy are in most case very weak and wavering. Then I'll send in the spear and and infantry and time the flanking with heavy cavalry and the rear with light cavalry at the moment my main force get close to their main force. This should very well ends the battle quickly in most case... and just pick off routed troop with your cavalry and general. As you can see in the picture I left some gap at the rear for them to run so they don't fight-to-death.

    If enemy decided to charge early I will also use this last formation and try to weaken them with arrow and at the same time flank their main force with heavy cavalry and runaway and repeat to save time for more range attack. Once their main force charge into my main force I'll send my light cavalry to finish off their range unit and when they routed I'll charge home to their main force's rear to help my main force

  5. #25
    Town Watch's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    A sick defensive (english) army could be like this:

    4 trebs
    1 general
    2 heavy cavalry
    6 arquebusiers/longbowmen
    7 tough spearmen/armored sergeants


    Trebs stay behind, and aim for any forward skirmishers with rotting cow carcasses. Archers deploy stakes in a phalanx boxish formation, if you have them. Trebuchets should now have contaminated most of the enemy infantry, and you should switch to flaming ammo, and start pounding the enemy with bodkin, or musket shot. Try to target cavalry. Then you could make a battleline, to envelope the enemy infantry, and deliver the final strike with your cavalry and general.

    Horsearchers will rip this army apart though. Well they infact rip most armies apart, when elephants/shítloads of cannons/or musketeers are not present.
    Also a weakness would be the lack of any assault infantry. You must have realatively secure uphill position, otherwise tough armoured swordsmen and units alike will rip your poor spearmen apart. Morale ain't tough either, but so isn't the enemies', because of flying cow intestines. Trebuchets are pretty crappy overall though, they never hit in openfield battles, so you should just use the cows.
    "What do I feel when I kill my enemy?"
    -Recoil-

  6. #26

    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    The thing is with rotten cows is that when ur assaulting, it affects your men which is not very good at all. Also, if the enemy has like a cannon or bombard, u would get mawled as the position is very vey static.

  7. #27
    Town Watch's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    Quote Originally Posted by Ippius View Post
    The thing is with rotten cows is that when ur assaulting, it affects your men which is not very good at all. Also, if the enemy has like a cannon or bombard, u would get mawled as the position is very vey static.

    Yes, the cow carcasses can also affect your rather mediocre line infantry, which hasn't even got the best morale.

    However bombards are crappy, they never hit anything on the battlefield. If the enemy has culverins or better, then I'm gonna be afraid. Also If you get only longbows, then you of course get some long range extermination power, but you also lose the demoralising effect of muskets. Also most of your units are kinda, "weak" against massed crossbowfire. This did ofcourse work wonderfully against the papal armies in campaign.
    :hmmm:
    "What do I feel when I kill my enemy?"
    -Recoil-

  8. #28

    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    I think, there's no universal army composition or tactic. There are too many variety in AI's stacks, to just make typical army and go conquering. True, most of the full stack vs. AI full stack battles will be won, but at what cost? I like to keep my units in as better shape as possible, and avoiding pyrrhic victories.
    I like to see first what am I against, then apply rock-paper-scissors tactic. If I'm fighting Milan, with hordes of tough armored and deadly x-bows, I attack them with mainly heavy cav. If I'm fighting easterners, with lotsa horsearchers, I like to put many good armored archers myself, like Byz Guard Archers, Retinue Longbows or similar. They take a good care of any horsearcher unit. I find that most of the time, my heavy inf is there just to absorb enemy charge, or look scary and deter enemy from frontal attack (giving my archers time to pepper them with pointy stuff...).

    Author of the ---== Knights Templar Mod ==---
    Creator of the ---== Lord Calidor's Weapon Pack 1 ==---
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  9. #29

    Default Troop formation adequate for most open field (defensive/offensive)battles!

    ............IIIIIIIIII..IIIIIIIIII..IIIIIIIIII..IIIIIIII
    ............MMMMMMMMM..MMMMMMMMMM
    ........SI..........BI...................BI............SI
    ..CAV......................GEN..........................CAV

    IIIII=INFANTRY
    MM=MISSILE TROOPS (Once they deplet the missiles, move them back and bring the backup infantry forward in their place)
    SI=SUPPORT INFANTRY (Can be manouvered-In case enemy units attempt to flank front-line infantry, or attack the missile troops from the flanks. If the front-lines are advancing through the enemy, then of course they can begin to flank the enemy)
    BI=BACKUP INFANTRY (Used to replenish the nearly routed infantry unit or strengthen the front-line. Can also be used in offensive moves, while pulling the front-infantry behind, or during an enemy full-out heavy horse charge.)
    CAV=CAVALRY/HORSE (Primarily protect the Support Infantry, but can be used by offensive generals to flank or encircle)
    GEN=Generals unit (ensure that he remains close to the troops to ensure morale boost)
    Last edited by Lucpol; February 09, 2007 at 07:21 AM.

  10. #30
    Sacc's Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    Pravoslavnie.

    I can't believe you're playing as England and aren't using their longbowmen. Screw their weak cavalry and replace them with archers. Usually I have 2 or 3 heavy cav. with 3-5 archers 2-3 artillery and the rest heavy infantry w/ 1 or 2 spearman. Seems to be a good balance, in the open field anyway.

    Zhou,

    I would love you to charge me with all that cavalry with my 4 front units of longbowmen deploying a spear wall pre-battle I know, I know you obviously wouldn't charge seeing this, but it would be a site to see.

    idk, In my opinion nothing is more fun then defending a city/castle with 4-5 units of well trained rutine longbowmen, some mortars and trebuchet's.
    Pentium C2Q 9550 OC'd at 3.4, nvidia 780i, 6gb ddr2 800 ram, EVGA 260 core216, OCZ 700 psu, Samsung 22"

  11. #31
    Axeman's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    My strategy as egypt

    1 general bodyguard
    6 afghan javelinman
    3 archers*foot*
    4 spearmen
    6 heavy cavalary

    I attack thier center with afghan javelinman supported by archers,when they come to attack them I switch to mele mode and engage them, while my heavy cavalary circles behind them and owns them, and my spearmen reinfoce the javelinmen.

  12. #32
    gandy's Avatar Laetus
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    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    Quote Originally Posted by Ulazlo the Warmonger View Post
    Normally I don't have a distint battle strategy before going into the battle. I try to change my strategy based off what the enemy does, and the units they have, that's why I don't have an all cavalry army, or all infantry, i try to balance it so i can react easily to most situations
    Totally agree, I do the same.

    I find that having a spy or other unit accurately showing all the enemies units etc. is a MUST. I will usually not go into battle unless I know what units the enemy has because if not, one is playing a dangerous game

    I have always been a fan of Roman tactics but find it hard to adapt the english units to them. Ideally flexible-style tactics work best (Cannae) and try to adapt to whatever the enemy does.

    Someone posted saying that they were surprised/disappointed about how few people had posted tactics, and that tactics are the most important thing about the game for him...well, I agree.

    I only got the game at the weekend and am not too far into it, but will definitely contribute more to this topic soon...

    Nice tactics from everyone else though.

  13. #33

    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    A question to all of those who are currently playing through as the english; dismounted feudal knights, dismounted english knights, or the swordsmen guys? Personally I prefer the swordsmen, supported by a few spear/halbred units, perhaps some billmen to act as a fire-brigade, 4 heavy cav and as many longbowmen as I can pack in. I find the swordsmen to be versatile enough to take on enemy heavy infantry, and strong enough to hold the line against a cavalry charge long enough for me to move my spears into position. Combined with the absolutely devastating long range power of massed longbows, theres pretty much nothing that'll crack that, least not till we both whip out gunpowder. I've had great success with this formation against the french and the HRE.

  14. #34

    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    I am playing the scots presently and in 33 turns have taken 29 cities/castles. Basically I leave 2 rabble in each city and push all fighting men out in every direction to attack new settlements. I only attack cities/castles and hide in trees if not attacking. Only upgrade castles and only to get better infantry. My only real income is from sacking.

    Siege: I play with ALL highlanders and nobles (rabble as fodder if available) plus my general and hired merc calvary/crossbowers if absolutely necessary for open battles.

    I siege for a turn building 6 ladders. My highlanders (or rabble) with ladders rush an entire wall (a side or even back wall) setting up and swarming one side near a gate. The nobles follow them up the ladders and my general waits patiently at the gate for the men to take it.

    However, once I take to walls I usually sit on them and allow pikemen/spearmen to try and take them back. I spread the men around the walls to flank any archers and horsemen below. Once I have the place surrounded, scots swarm inward from all sides, choking the defenders as my general now safely enter through captured gate. Castles are harder but once the enemy routes my clansmen just follow them fleeing through the inner gate.

    Open Battles: For open battles I am always the defender and hide in the trees until the enemy passes...to only find 540+ madmen with axe and greatsword rushing their rears.

    Open battles with merc bowmen...if possible ALWAYS choose high ground in a clearing with trees beside(see above). Send all bolts to one target on the enemies left flank (on your right) so that you are shooting into their unshielded side (makes a huge difference). Also, always charge clansmen into their unshielded side (or back).

    Calvary or noble death squad. Find the enemy general and charge that unit on the shielded flank. Why? because the general is on that side and dies in the initial charge.

    I suspect my clansmen will have a very hard time with light shooty calvary...but they will deal this that once I claim all the north lands.

    Defence..expanding in all directions every turn means I have never had to defend a siege yet with the scots. But...same as above position archers to the left and shoot to the right (into unshielded side).

  15. #35
    Danny_Two's Avatar Laetus
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    Default Re: Your favorite unit formations and strategies in different situations

    Defending Citadels is the best form of defence. I never have any men on the outer wall, ill let the enemy waste a lot of time an energy knocking out outer wall defences while I sit tight and wait.
    All my men will be depoyed in the inner wall. I always have at least four or five archer units on the walls over the gates, but turn off auto fire as they fire to early and run out of arrows. Combined with ballista and cannon towers they will make a right mess of enemy unit trying to batter down gates.
    I use heavy infantry on the walls to block off any enemy that try and enter from the outer walls.
    A couple of well placed Mortars will also make a contribution to the carnage.

    I always place my general and another cavalry unit in the square, just in case.

  16. #36

    Default What types of formations do you use?

    One thing I really like about this game is how important, and realistic the effects of formation are.

    I've only played as England, but here's what Ive found effective so far.

    Archers I prefer using in 1 long line, to maximize lateral fire, as its FAR more accurate than the arching shots. If I'm out numbered I set them up in ranks so most are holding their shots for the charging enemy (works well for making them route).

    Cavalry I also like to get into 1 long line for a charge, keeps them from bunching up in the back, and maximizes charge damage.
    I use the column formation when I'm maneuvering behind the enemy, it helps keep an equal distance from their archers, and gets me in good position to form the line.
    I haven't found a good use for the wedge formation yet.

    Infantry doesn't seem to matter as much, its more about having the unit in the right location.
    I usually form a line in front of my archers (if theyre on a hill, I dont want the archers to have to shoot over them and force the arch shots)

    On hills my army usually looks like this

    ccccccccccccccccccccc =cavalry
    iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii =infantry
    aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa =archers

    xx =artillery

    or

    cccccccccc
    iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii
    aaaaaaaa
    aaaaaaaa
    aaaaaaaa
    xx


    On level terrain, or when I'm pushing the attack I tend to go

    aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa cccccc
    aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa cccccc
    iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii cccccc
    xx

    Keeping cavalry in a good position to charge.
    Sometimes I'll advance the artillery to harass the enemy and draw them into my archer fire.

    Any comments/criticism of my setup is more than welcome. Only had the game for 3 days, so if there's a better way then I want to know!

  17. #37

    Default Re: What types of formations do you use?

    When Alexander the Great used Wedge formations in certain battles, he used it to charge through the gaps between the formations of different units.
    I, however, have never used it myself. Yet.

  18. #38

    Default Re: What types of formations do you use?

    My front line is usually heavy infantry with spear units on the flanks. Cavary further out on the flanks. Archers behind infantry with gaurd mode on. General behind them. If I have slingers or javelins they are out in front of the infantry. Its easy to set up and it never fails. Kinda like this:

    sl sl
    cc spsp iiiiiiiiiiii spsp cc
    a a a a
    gen.

    I find that archers protected by infantry and spears (flanks)will have a constant rate of fire. Once my Cavalry has taken the flanks it's envelope time. The infantry that is not engaged moves to the sides and back and whatever holes are left, cavalry charges!

    The thing about your formation is that the archers only gety off a few shots before falling back. If the AI actually flanked you might have to split your cavalry to hold it off. (too bad the AI could not flank my mom)

    Don't forget to use slingers! They have so much ammo they IMO better than standard archers. NOT longbowmen they are killing machines.

  19. #39
    awisler's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: What types of formations do you use?

    I usually do something like this with I being a standard infantry/spear unit, i being a shock troop with 2h etc, C is knights, A is archers, G is general

    I I I I I I I I
    C C C C
    i i i
    A A A A
    G


    This way, the four sections on the front of I I absorb the initial charge and are elite troops with high morale/stamina, the enemy usually will get on the flanks of the I I sections, so then my shock troops from the back charge into the rear of the enemy's attempted flank. the cavalry then charge into the fray. The general will be used to flank if needed, and sometimes I will take my knights around if I know the area it is leaving will be ok.

    When outnumbered i sometimes do this also -

    I I I I I I I I
    C i C i C i C
    A A A

  20. #40

    Default Re: What types of formations do you use?

    Box like formations, for infantry and crossbowmen, similar to the legions ere.




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