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Thread: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

  1. #1

    Default Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    Although it may be realistic, it's simply not fun.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    I personally think the unit costs and upkeeps are fine as they are, specially if you compare them to the EB1 ones which were pretty expensive. I think they've found the right balance; I'm playing a Carthage campaign currently and I don't find financial restraints even when recruiting elite units. But financial development varies from faction to faction, so some factions find it harder than others to rapidly develop a powerful economy.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    I wish units were more expensive. It makes them more valuable to you and more time has to be spent considering if you really need to recruit or not.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    My reaction to the title of the thread is "Please, don't!"

  5. #5

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    Yeah, the game is easy enough. If anything, units and buildings should cost much more.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    Short answer: no.

    Longer answer: no, all units are costed according to a consistent formula that makes for a much more balanced experience. What might seem expensive in the early game isn't later on. If you have a problem with the cost of higher-tier units, good; they're supposed to be expensive.

    As always, you are more than welcome to edit the costs in your own installation of the game. Get Notepad++ and go unit-by-unit.
    Last edited by QuintusSertorius; December 12, 2017 at 08:42 AM.
    It began on seven hills - a historical house-ruled Romani AAR
    Heirs to Lysimachos - a semi-historical Epeiros-as-Pergamon AAR
    Philetairos' Gift - a second attempt at an Epeiros-as-Pergamon AAR


  7. #7

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    The unit recruitment cost and upkeep are just fine. It may look expensive in the start, but later on it's more than affordable to recruit.
    I recommend a pugio rather than a spear, because in close quarters combat, a dagger will serve you better than a spear.

    Rad, 2016.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    You just have to realize that elite units are something you can work up to affording. Invest in infrastructure (or raiding and settlement capture/sacking!) and use armies composed with more levies and middle tier units as would be more realistic anyway.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    If anything, more expensive and higher cost would be more fun, but its ok as it is, though I would say that 2.3 features a lot of cavalry in AI stacks, which may be offset by upping their cost a little?

    I think there is no reason to take light cav over mediums or heavies as there is no significant cost differential that warrants taking them. Maybe making heavier varieties more expensive would help?

  10. #10

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    For the most part, light cavalry is quite a bit cheaper than medium/heavy. Because they not only have lighter equipment, but also have ponies, rather than horses (ponies are cheaper).
    It began on seven hills - a historical house-ruled Romani AAR
    Heirs to Lysimachos - a semi-historical Epeiros-as-Pergamon AAR
    Philetairos' Gift - a second attempt at an Epeiros-as-Pergamon AAR


  11. #11

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post
    For the most part, light cavalry is quite a bit cheaper than medium/heavy. Because they not only have lighter equipment, but also have ponies, rather than horses (ponies are cheaper).
    By the way, is there a downside to ponies? In the stats I've seen so far, they seem to have the same speed as warhorses or even more, which strikes me as odd. IMO a Thessalian lancer (mounted on a quality horse with very little barding) should be faster than, or at least the same speed as, a Hippakontistes who's riding a pony. Not to mention Xystophoroi who are even less slowed down by armour. Stamina is another thing, of course.
    Or am I misinterpreting the movement speed stats?

  12. #12
    Roma_Victrix's Avatar Gatorade, is it in you?
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    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    It's frustrating to pay for stuff in the beginning of the game when you don't have a significantly large empire yet (or if you do, you're most likely starting out as the Seleucids, dealing with massive rebellions and public disorder due to an immediate lack of necessary infrastructure in your settlements). However, once you've conquered about 30, 40, or 50 provinces and the ball gets rolling, your internal economy and tax base becomes large enough to handle frequent wars with other factions that would otherwise cripple your economy due to a sudden loss of trade. If you build an empire that contains 60, 70, or 80+ settlements, then you are basically an ancient superpower akin to the Roman Empire, or at the very least the Sasanian Empire at its maximum height. At that point your economy is so secure that regular recruitment of elite units is ensured, with a large core of inner settlements (i.e. not bordering any enemy territories) that are highly developed, have great public order, and can usually be garrisoned with a handful of lighter, cheaper units to make sure you keep making a hefty profit. The more elite units should be recruited in or sent to the borderlands against enemy factions, neutral factions, and even border territories shared with allies (since the AI can back-stab your faction if it perceives you to be weak enough).

  13. #13

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    Quote Originally Posted by Roma_Victrix View Post
    At that point your economy is so secure that regular recruitment of elite units is ensured, with a large core of inner settlements (i.e. not bordering any enemy territories) that are highly developed, have great public order, and can usually be garrisoned with a handful of lighter, cheaper units to make sure you keep making a hefty profit. The more elite units should be recruited in or sent to the borderlands against enemy factions, neutral factions, and even border territories shared with allies (since the AI can back-stab your faction if it perceives you to be weak enough).
    Huehuehuehuehue Roma
    I actually do the opposite once I reach the status of an economic powerhouse. For me, it's fun to throw low to mid level troops at the enemy, while the veterans and the elites stay in reserve.
    I recommend a pugio rather than a spear, because in close quarters combat, a dagger will serve you better than a spear.

    Rad, 2016.

  14. #14
    Roma_Victrix's Avatar Gatorade, is it in you?
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    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    Quote Originally Posted by Rad View Post
    Huehuehuehuehue Roma
    Rad laughs in Portuguese. Roma_Victrix laughs back at him in Spanish, while dressed as King Philip II of Spain.

    I actually do the opposite once I reach the status of an economic powerhouse. For me, it's fun to throw low to mid level troops at the enemy, while the veterans and the elites stay in reserve.
    This is also a decent strategy. To me it boils down to your own personal preference and tastes. I enjoy using elite units as much as possible, since they are so rarely used in the early part of the game. It's kind of a well-deserved and long-awaited treat to use them frequently in the latter half of one's campaign. To each his own, though. There is a certain amusement to be had in stack-spamming the enemy with cheap units, as sweet and savory revenge for all the crap they put you through earlier in besieging your cities.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    I don't use overwhelming numbers to beat the enemy, I use underwhelming troops to beat the enemy - makes the mid/late game a bit more interesting.
    I recommend a pugio rather than a spear, because in close quarters combat, a dagger will serve you better than a spear.

    Rad, 2016.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick View Post
    Although it may be realistic, it's simply not fun.
    If you don't want realistic, this is certainly the wrong mod for you .

  17. #17

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    For footmen only, low tiers can be as low as 40, and high tiers as high as 500, so just chose your army wisely, replace low tiers with high tiers when and only when you can afford it, and only a small part of it at the begining, just to be strong where it count.

    You don't need to hold the line everywhere. Retreat makes a great trap for your enemy.
    You don't need to pierce the enemy lines everywhere. A small gap is enough to finish the job.
    You don't need high tier spearmen on the walls when your very cheap archers can just rob the enemy of their will to take your city.
    You don't need heavily armoured fanatics to push a ram.

    Just think of it as a thread and needle.

    You need a hard and expensive needle but affordable and soft, and very long thread to make a good seam.


  18. #18

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    I guess it depends on whether you want EBII to be Ancient World Simulator or Conquer The World Simulator with an Antiquity skin. I like expensive units that are expensive for a reason - maybe they're difficult to source, or unusually well-equipped, or just recruited in an expensive way (e.g. armed by the state). It helps immersion. imo that should remain the priority.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    Quote Originally Posted by Baharr View Post
    I guess it depends on whether you want EBII to be Ancient World Simulator or Conquer The World Simulator with an Antiquity skin. I like expensive units that are expensive for a reason - maybe they're difficult to source, or unusually well-equipped, or just recruited in an expensive way (e.g. armed by the state). It helps immersion. imo that should remain the priority.
    +1

    Quote Originally Posted by Roma_Victrix View Post
    It's frustrating to pay for stuff in the beginning of the game when you don't have a significantly large empire yet (or if you do, you're most likely starting out as the Seleucids, dealing with massive rebellions and public disorder due to an immediate lack of necessary infrastructure in your settlements). However, once you've conquered about 30, 40, or 50 provinces and the ball gets rolling, your internal economy and tax base becomes large enough to handle frequent wars with other factions that would otherwise cripple your economy due to a sudden loss of trade
    At this point (or even earlier) the main problem should be how to keep your empire together. I think this should be a major issue in the game after you've got 20+ settlements. Plus each change of the leader should be a major earthquake for the faction. I haven't played EBII to the extent to experience if this happens or not. (I know SS-BGR_IV and SSHIP where such mechanism - to some extent - exist).

    Quote Originally Posted by Rad View Post
    I don't use overwhelming numbers to beat the enemy, I use underwhelming troops to beat the enemy - makes the mid/late game a bit more interesting.
    May I ask to what extent this is rewarded in the good traits received by the generals? I think this way of playing the game should be encouraged by both "making the game more interesting", but also by some rewards.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Please Make the Cost of Recruiting Units less Expensive

    Quote Originally Posted by Jurand of Cracow View Post
    May I ask to what extent this is rewarded in the good traits received by the generals? I think this way of playing the game should be encouraged by both "making the game more interesting", but also by some rewards.
    Honestly, can't tell ya. It's been awhile since a major campaign, don't remember. Will report after the next one (hopefully in 2.3a).
    I recommend a pugio rather than a spear, because in close quarters combat, a dagger will serve you better than a spear.

    Rad, 2016.

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