Greek city-states

[Zirteh]

How do you guys fare Greek city-states against other factions (here, we're talking about Athens, Sparta, Rhodos, Pergamon) against other Hellenic or even barbarian factions? How do you like 'em compared to the Succesor Kingdoms that are far more viable factions ?

[ablebodie]

Pergamon is more viable than arguably all the Successors. While Pergamon has a great option in literally every category except shock cav, Successors have one commen strength: the best pikes. Seleucids also having top-tier in most everything else but for foot skirmishers. Macedon has good foot skirmishers and good cav. Epirus has...merc elephants? Ptolemy has a ton of light infantry, which means basically it's easier to conquer Africa (lol)

So far as Pergamon goes, no other Greek state has "melee" cavalry on par with them barring Late Macedonian Hiera Ile.

I'm not sure having the best pikes around means they are the most viable factions. Really only the Seleucids deserve that title. In any case, AoR is necessary component of literally every faction in the game, as intended. Core rosters of everyone-but-Rome simply don't cut it for every situation.

All that said, you simply use their advantages they have over everyone else. Of all the Greek city-states, everyone but Athens has a best-in-class unit, or near to it.

Rhodos has the best navy and slingers. Therefore early game is raids on Knossos, Epirus, and all of Anatolia. I pick either Seleucids or Ptolemies to attack and let my navy defend against counter-invasion of Anatolia. Easy.

Sparta you simply have the best hoplites in the game. Easy answer is load up on AoR cavalry to win the flanks. Ranged superiority is fine as well once you take Rhodos and Knossos.

Athens has a great navy and not-as-bad-as-Rhodos infantry lineup. Basically the same strategy as Rhodos.

[Basilius]

I've played Rome 2 for a few hundred hours, and have played Athens exclusively.

The initial difficulty of Sparta, Athens, and Rhodes is establishing yourself with an initial province to springboard your empire. For Sparta and Athens, that's Hellas. For Rhodes, it's either Hellas or Asia Minor. The good news is that you have a strong core roster that can deal with any situation (to an extent). The bad news is that your army and tactics are outdated, expensive, and defensive. So you have to find (or engineer) opportunities to expand while limiting your confrontation with the bigger Hellenic factions (Successor states, Pergamon, etc.) and Rome. In Hellas, this means capitalizing on Epirus' and Macedon's fragmentation. The biggest pain in your ass early game is Crete, which turtles in Knossos or disrupts your flank.

From there you want to hit reforms ASAP, so you can unlock a more diverse roster with which to execute your grand strategy. I would drop the hoplite backbone for a pikeman core (even as Sparta), which decimates all barbarian factions for the rest of the game. Invest in light infantry and cavalry as a way of out maneuvering the other Greek empires, and gives you a fighting chance against Rome (who must rely on terrain and mobility to defeat you). Note: you will have trouble sieging cities with pikemen. I suggest dedicating an army to taking cities with core units more able to scale/dismantle walls.

Sparta lends itself to a more land based expansion--perhaps a recreation of Alexander's imperium--but Athens and Rhodes demand a maritime empire. If your springboard is Hellas, I would have the following geopolitical imperatives:

• Secure control of the Aegean (shared waters) with your navy, and preferably gain entire control of the sea around your capital to minimize pirating
• Establish control of Corfu, Crete and Rhodes to prevent invasions from the sea
• Hold the Axios River valley and as far up the valley as possible for land and access to mainland Europe
• Build up Hellas/Macedon/Thrace to be major wellsprings of profit and food
• Extend control to outer islands such as Cyprus and Sicily to dominate the eastern Mediterranean

From there I just go around conquering or "liberating", building a vast network of trade, alliances, and client states. Try to win an economic, or even cultural victory.

[Dardo21]

Note: you will have trouble sieging cities with pikemen. I suggest dedicating an army to taking cities with core units more able to scale/dismantle walls.

Indeed, I usually build a siege army where I lower the amount of pike units by 2 or 3 and replace them with the best sword(/or hoplites if necessary) units that I can get.

[Zirteh]

Pergamon is more viable than arguably all the Successors. While Pergamon has a great option in literally every category except shock cav, Successors have one commen strength: the best pikes. Seleucids also having top-tier in most everything else but for foot skirmishers. Macedon has good foot skirmishers and good cav. Epirus has...merc elephants? Ptolemy has a ton of light infantry, which means basically it's easier to conquer Africa (lol)

So far as Pergamon goes, no other Greek state has "melee" cavalry on par with them barring Late Macedonian Hiera Ile.

I'm not sure having the best pikes around means they are the most viable factions. Really only the Seleucids deserve that title. In any case, AoR is necessary component of literally every faction in the game, as intended. Core rosters of everyone-but-Rome simply don't cut it for every situation.

All that said, you simply use their advantages they have over everyone else. Of all the Greek city-states, everyone but Athens has a best-in-class unit, or near to it.

Rhodos has the best navy and slingers. Therefore early game is raids on Knossos, Epirus, and all of Anatolia. I pick either Seleucids or Ptolemies to attack and let my navy defend against counter-invasion of Anatolia. Easy.

Sparta you simply have the best hoplites in the game. Easy answer is load up on AoR cavalry to win the flanks. Ranged superiority is fine as well once you take Rhodos and Knossos.

Athens has a great navy and not-as-bad-as-Rhodos infantry lineup. Basically the same strategy as Rhodos.

So I suppose it's much easier to sack settlements with an army and a supporting navy (as Athens/Rhodes) rather than going all-conquest ?

[Zirteh]

I think I agree with most of what you just said. Athens and Rhodes, whilst not able to field the elite, dedicated infantry/cavalry of other city-states, it can, however, field a more capable navy than most factions in the game and help an overseas expansion. Pergamon has all kinds of useful and good tools in it's fielding roster so that a land expansion is possible, and Sparta is just about the same (although it does lack somewhat in versatility and it encompasses excellent hoplite infantry). So, in all respects, I think Athens, combined with it's capable army (especially after reforms kick in) and even more capable navy, is the second best of Greek city-states, and on the first place I still cannot decide between Pergamon and Sparta.

Another thing I've also noticed is how easy it is to internally conquer Greece. You see, both Hellas and Makedonia both have very large pools of fairly good mercenary troops that allow you to buy troops in no time, and preferably as a faction like, let's say Athens, you can conquer most of the Hellenic lands in 3 years.