Medieval Kingdoms Total War: the Seljuks of Rum (and the Ottomans)

[Sarcasm_pt]

Now that's just dumb.

[Visarion]

Okay I suggest this:

Late

Names

Simply


Janissary - Warrior Guild and Sect:

Recruitable at Janissary Guild
For Left Solak City Baracks as well
For Zerhli Nefer Royal Blacksmith in addition

Right Yeniceri

Left Solak

Zerhli Nefer

Siege Yeniceri

Tufenkci


An additional Bosnian Recruit, the "Yerli Kulu" Janissary City Garrisons, very loyal and dedicated specialised Janissary Corps and native to the Bosnian lands, conscripts and converts

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...issary&f=false

Nobles (Land Owners):

Recruitable at Farms

Akinci

Askeri

Timarli



Kapikulu - Palace Guards:

Recruitable at Sipahi Headquarters:
Needing both the above and the Royal Stables
For Sipahsalar Royal Palace in addition to all above
For Oglanlar Royal Blacksmith and Trader for Garib


Sipahi:

Oglanlar

Sipahsalar

Left and Right Ulufecis

Left and Right Garib


Recruitable at the Royal Palace
Royal Blacksmith in addition for the one bellow

Kapikulu Infantry



Additional

Serengecti



And the descr does the rest and their recruitment place


No point adding Palace Guard or Kapikulu to all of them






And also changing the names to: Cebeli, Deli and Peyk

Maybe recruitable at the Mercenary Camp together with the Armatoloi. The Peyk at Scriptorium or smth like that.

[Danishmend]

Now that's just dumb.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Okay I suggest this:

Late

Names

Simply


Janissary - Warrior Guild and Sect:

Recruitable at Janissary Guild
For Left Solak City Baracks as well
Fir Zerhli Nefer Rotal Blacksmith in addition

Right Yeniceri

Left Solak

Zerhli Nefer

Siege Yeniceri

Tufenkci



Nobles (Land Owners):

Recruitable at Farms

Akinci

Askeri

Timarli



Kapikulu - Palace Guards:

Recruitable at Sipahi Headquarters:
Needing both the above and the Royal Stables
For Sipahsalar Royal Palace in addition to all above
For Oglanlar Royal Blacksmith and Trader for Garib


Sipahi:

Oglanlar

Sipahsalar

Left and Right Ulufecis

Left and Right Garib


Recruitable at the Royal Palace
Royal Bkacksmith in addition for the one bellow

Kapikulu Infantry



Additional

Serdengecti



And the descr does the rest and their recruitment place


No point adding Palace Guard or Kapikulu to all of them

Don't you think those names are a bit too detailed? I mean, it would be totally unnecessary to rename "Kapıkulu Ulufeci" to "left and right ulufecis". It's like seperating Janissaries into a dozens of ortas (divisions), and each orta representing a different janissary unit.

And also changing the names to: Cebeli, Deli and Peyk

Maybe recruitable at the Mercenary Camp together with the Armatoloi. The Peyk at Scriptorium or smth like that.

Why would Deli, Cebeli and Peyk be recruitable at the Mercenary Camp? That doesn't make sense at all. And why do you want to change their names?

[Lucem Mundum]

Now that's just dumb.

Check your facts before calling other people's work dumb.

[Visarion]

Okay I suggest this:

Late

Names

Simply


Janissary - Warrior Guild and Sect:

Recruitable at Janissary Guild
For Left Solak City Baracks as well
For Zirhli Nefer Royal Blacksmith in addition





Yeniceri

Solak

Zirhli Nefer

Siege Yeniceri

Tufenkci


An additional Bosnian Recruit, the "Yerli Kulu" Janissary City Garrisons, very loyal and dedicated specialised Janissary Corps and native to the Bosnian lands, conscripts and converts

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...issary&f=false




Nobles (Land Owners):

Recruitable at Farms


Akinci

Askeri or Askerleri

Timarli





Azap, Azab or Azapleri can still be added




Kapikulu - Palace Guards:

Recruitable at Sipahi Headquarters:
Needing both the above and the Royal Stables
For Sipahsalar Royal Palace in addition to all above
For Oglanlar Royal Blacksmith and Trader for Garib


Sipahi:

Oglanlar or simply Oglan

Sipahsalar

Ulufeci or Ulufeciler

Garib or Garibler


Recruitable at the Royal Palace
Royal Blacksmith in addition for the one bellow

Kapikulu Infantry



Additional

Serengecti



And the descr does the rest and their recruitment place


No point adding Palace Guard or Kapikulu to all of them






And also changing the names to: Cebeli, Deli and Peyk

Recruitable at some sort of Guild or Religious building. Actually Cebeli at Farms or I don't know Colonial Headquarters or smth like that, Suburbs etc.


Balkan Nobles, Voynuk, Eflak, Tartars and Turcomans.

Maybe recruitable at the Mercenary Camp together with the Armatoloi. The Peyk at Scriptorium or smth like that.

[You_Guess_Who]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Check your facts before calling other people's work dumb.

No. That was sarcasm_pt just incredibly baffled at Visarion trying to correct him saying the "Polearm Janissary" into "Siege Janissary" as if Visarion is the one working the Ottoman roster.

Visarion, why are you quoting yourself?

[Visarion]

No I just use that to modify the post. Writing from mobile phone and have limited options.

[Visarion]

I would do these changes: I would add the Zirhli Nefer as some sort of heavy polearm/archer unit and would add the Sipahsalar as a self standing recruitable unit in addition to the current bodyguard and would use the traditional Ottoman round disc lamellar armour used from at least the 15th century and borrowed from the Trapezuntians as depicted in Orthodox Byzantine churches. Maybe even add the armour to the Zirhli Nefer and transform it into a Polearm/Yatagan unit as the team used mid 16 elements all over the place. I would rename the current heavy archer Janissary proposal in Yerli Kulu or the English version Kapikulu Janissary, Royal Palace Guard or the Senior Janissary. See zsimmortal's latest Safavid unit for inspiration.

[Visarion]

The best option for the armoured version of the Janissary Corps or the Senior Janissary would be:

Siege Zirhli Nefer (Bow as primarly and polearm and/or spear as secondary or polearm and spear as primarly and sword and axe as secondary)

Assault Zirhli Nefer, Serdengecti or Serdengecti Zirhli Nefer (Yatagan and shield)

[hessam]

Assault Zirhli Nefer, Serdengecti or Serdengecti Zirhli Nefer (Yatagan and shield)

are we making a new mod about late 16th/early 17th century?

[hessam]

regarding the name of the Yeniceri unit with polearms, I think Billmen is ok but I'm open to better suggestions, something more eastern perhaps. But definitely not something like Siege Yeniceris like Visarion suggested.

Seriously Visarion, you really don't have to write down everything that comes to mind. Change Delis, Cebelis, and Peyks to Deli, Cebeli, and Peyk? Seriously?

[Visarion]

Anyway here are some more options for units 'cause the roster seems somewhat "poor" for such a extraordinary empire but nonetheless a very good start.

http://www.theottomans.org/english/c...army/index.asp


Descr are very good. Oh you have a "extra" [\SPOILER]" at Muqti btw.

[Filips Augustus]

Dude he has around 40-50 units for this roster, that's the most of all factions. I don't think he needs more.

[Knight2708]

The Silahdars are wearing plate and mail, which is the best armour factions of that region get.

I was mostly thinking about the lack of helmets and horse armor and the seeming lack of armor on the general/sultan himself.

[Visarion]

I was expecting the emblematic Ottoman lamellar armour with the disc centralpiece to be honest, myself. And also the Ottoman war coif. I would redo the Ispahsalar and loose the turban, the tunics/cloaks whatever and the Janissary like head piece. The current version seems the parade one to me to be honest.

[hessam]

I was mostly thinking about the lack of helmets and horse armor and the seeming lack of armor on the general/sultan himself.

That Silahdars wore red borks is a historical fact. Although there's no 15th century miniature depicting Silahdars, the early 16th century miniatures also show them with red borks and no horse armor.
Now about the Sultan; the Sultan hardly ever engaged in combat himself and was often dressed in his royal attire, even on the battlefield. That being said, the sultan in this roster is wearing the same armor as the Timarli Sipahis (fabric over a coat of mail) so "lack of armor" isn't quite true about him. Moreover, the Sultan's appearance has no effect on the bodyguard unit's stats and comes down to aesthetics and where available, history.

[Visarion]

Guess to blame is that Turkish Soap Opera then... hmmm... cinema... denaturates things...

[hessam]

I was expecting the emblematic Ottoman lamellar armour with the disc centralpiece to be honest, myself. And also the Ottoman war coif. I would redo the Ispahsalar and loose the turban, the tunics/cloaks whatever and the Janissary like head piece. The current version seems the parade one to me to be honest.

Again, the krug armor (which is what you're describing here) is a mid-late 16th century invention, at the earliest. And who is "Ispahsalar"??? If you mean the Silahdars, read my previous comment. It seems like a parade one to you probably because you haven't seen any Ottoman miniatures.

[Visarion]

Most likely... still from what I remember the agreement was to end at mid 15th century but with military gear go deep into the mid 16th century. Silahdar sorry, wrong region. The mirror armor or Krug based on the Kardiophylax (heart protector) and Klivanion appeared during late 15th century though. And later was adopted by the Russian Cossaks as well, the Zertsalo.

[zsimmortal]

Most likely... still from what I remember the agreement was to end at mid 15th century but with military gear go deep into the mid 16th century. Silahdar sorry, wrong region. The mirror armor or Krug based on the Kardiophylax (heart protector) and Klivanion appeared during late 15th century though. And later was adopted by the Russian Cossaks as well, the Zertsalo.

Mirror armour, char aina, krug, etc. are all 16th century and factions are designed with that 15th c limit in organization and dress. Therefore, you won't see that here. Now, maybe some chest disks could be used more, but no krug.