Rome should start with Polybian reforms!

[Tenerife_Boy]

Can we...maybe...just...










close it?

[Sonny WiFiHr]

Yes same topic every week. We MUST go off topic (or go to tropic).

[TheRazaman]

To add my two cents:

I don't think its ever been firmly established as to when the Roman infantryman switched from hasta to gladius. Plutarch is the primary extant Classical source regarding the Pyrrhic wars. He states that the Romans used swords; however, this may have been an anachronism from the Roman army of his own time, almost 400 years later, in the 2nd century AD (or maybe not).

Modern historians do report with confidence that Rome used the manipular system by this time, but the weapon of choice isn't definitive. Some postulate that the change may not have even begun until ~250 BC, when the pilum was introduced. We also need to remember that at this period, the Roman soldiers still supplied their own arms and any change made by one man, maniple, cohort or legion wasn't necessarily able to be emulated by everyone -- and the richest men kept their hastae up until the Marian reforms in 107 BC.

So I don't think DeI is out of sync with history by having the Camillan army present at start. And as others mentioned, from a gameplay perspective, its nice to not have Rome be an instant juggernaut (they're already close as it is).

[historian1789]

Thank you I now agree that things should stay as they are
I'm the author of the thread and you can close it!

[Damocles]

For what it's worth, I agree, even if at the same time I understand the dev's position (it's low on their priority list).

I don't even mind it so much when playing as Rome.

I find it more annoying when I'm playing against Rome, and I wish for the challenge of them having a very dangerous manipular army and trying to overcome it. I always find early spear-armed Hastati something of a pushover, and it just feels as if it cheapens the challenge of trying to survive against Rome.

[Hoplitus]

Damocles you can also edit global reform triggers for when Rome is controlled by the AI. That would overcome your issue. Just check the stickied "Manuals and Guides" thread, it's explained there how to do it.

[m2sah]

Friends, forgive me, but I've been playing EB 1.2 for two weeks. I chose Rome. The year was 180 BC. Anatolia, Europe, I conquered the Balkans. I have 52 territories. The cities in Italy were huge cities but still polybian soldiers did not come. There is no MIC building in cities. Where am I doing wrong? Please help.

[Augustusng]

Maybe EB has different reform requirements from DeI.

But seriously, could be that you've got a conflicting mod that break's DeI's reform scripts. Oh, and make sure you've researched the purple reform technology. That's required to upgrade your troops.

[HarkonRules]

My only gripe with DeI's camillan units, is the Hastati's weapon; it's a lot more likely that the Hastati almost always used some form of stabbing sword, like in the Polybian reform. Principes still with spears until the Polybian, Triarii like hoplites, but given the Hastati's role throughout Roman warfare, as an aggressive unit of most commonly younger and energetic men meant to have intense wearing down combat with the enemy's frontline, I think it's unlikely they ever used spears as a standard weapon.

[Augustusng]

"Hastatus" does literally mean "spearman" though.