Proposal: Some suggestion regarding the Night's Watch

[Lord Dread]

I know, probably not a really special thing where we need to focus too much now, but given the independent Holdfeasts within lordships,
I got reminded of the Night's Watch, whose territories are only 3-4 regions, given whether they recieved the Queen's Gift or not.
Technically the holdfeast rule would apply to them as well, but far by my knowledge they have no territorial income.

Furthermore they have already pre-existing holdfeasts from the past, but most of them are abbandoned.


Even if it would be an unnecessary rule change, but why not allow commanders of the three major castles to rebuild those holdfeasts for double the prize of an independent holdfeast for each?
That way we provide the Night's Watch some decent RP IF people have a major interest in trying an attempt for RPing there as well. Played in the past a Lord Commander there and I realized pretty soon that there were hardly ways to productively RP stuff with recruits, if it wasn't for chasing Wildlings beyond the Wall. Especially for those guys, who attempted to RP their characters as Stewards.
So rebuilding said castles would not only be a great investment, but also do something for the Night Watch's increase in terms of troops.

Costs:
Tier I: 60,000 Dragons
Tier II: 120,000 Dragons
Tier III: 180,000 Dragons

For each Region I would say that the following holdfeasts can get rebuild:

The Shadowtower:
- Westwatch-by-the-Bridge (Tier II)
- Sentinel Stand (Tier II)
- Greyguard (Tier I)
- Stonedoor (Tier II)
- Hoarfrost Hill (Tier I)

Castle Black:
- Icemark (Tier II)
- The Nightfort (Tier III) (Haunted - same regional bonus as Harrenhall)
- Deeplake (Tier I)
- Queensgate (Tier II)
- Oakenshield (Tier II)
- Wood's Watch-By-the-Pool (Tier I)

Eastwatch-by-the-Sea:
- Sable Hall (Tier I)
- Rimegate (Tier II)
- The Long Barrow (Tier II)
- The Torches (Tier I)
- Greenguard (Tier II)

I could imagine that this way, the Night's Watch RP could change into a direction, where the player's focus gets more on rebuilding some of these forts, while trying to gain the favor of the Commanders for actually being tasked to rebuild and gouvern one of these holdfeasts rather than the regular "Let's hunt some wildlings and wait till a mod moderates stuff, whether we find something or not". Stuff could get more bureaucratic, incomes could be shaped on the actual lands, the Night's Watch gouverns, while instead of hiring sellswords, they also get rules, similiar to Edicts, where they can spend money to recruit more soldiers from what the Seven Kingdoms can offer, increasing their militia.
In general I also think that Night's Watch castles only grant militia troops, which are permanently raised (due to them having no other job than defending the Seven Kingdoms), while levy troops can only be generated if either the Wildlings or Westerosi lords overtake one of the regions or holdfeasts by their own.


But yeah, only a brief suggestion. I don't attempt to revive the NW RP, but given that we kinda managed to make Essos more interactive, I kinda wonder if we can do the same thing for the Night's Watch as well, even if this means to change their RP from action adventure with few characters to "Some dudes gouverning their castles, while mustering armies just in case something happens".
Probably people have better ideas, so I just toss it into the room. ^^

[Pontifex Maximus]

I seriously doubt there will be enough interest to justify giving the NW significant attention.

[Lord Dread]

Yeah I know, but we had in the past plots, where people seeked to overthrow the Night Watch or to annex their territories.
So representing these regions gameplaywise might not be a bad thing.

[Pontifex Maximus]

I am really interested by the Night's Watch myself. I'd like to involve them much more in the RP personally, but I don't think the will is there.

[Lord Dread]

Yeah that's true. I have the will as well, but given my past expierience as Lord Commander in our most active setting, it really ended in nothing interesting.

[Pericles of Athens]

If someone really wants to be involved with the nights watch I may or may not be taking back some ill gotten land after Skagos is finished. Side note playing a recruiter or ranger would be fun personally. But I'm not sure about broad interest in it.

[Poach]

This was the ruleset made for the North-only setting:

The Night's Watch

Income for the Night's Watch The Night's Watch generates a very small income of their own, but rely on other sources such as donations for any other need. The Night's Watch will generate 1 Dragon of income per year for each point of soldiers in the order. Players may donate money to the Watch as they see fit. Any money owned by a player character forced to join the Night's Watch is seized, by moderator discretion (eg based on the circumstances) by any of... - The King - A Lord Paramount - The character's family - Another player character - The Night's Watch This strongly depends on circumstance. In the majority of cases any money will be seized by the family (as a Tarly would, for example, keep any of his money in Horn Hill or in a family-controlled account somewhere) but powerful characters such as the King or Lord Paramount may order it surrendered to them personally, giving the family the chance to refuse or agree. In instances where there isn't a family to seize the money (eg the player being forced to go to the Wall is a sellsword, merchant, freeman etc) it will normally be seized by the character forcing them to take the Black, but again moderation will review the circumstances. Items The Lord Commander may take for free any set of weapons and armour. All other characters will have only the equipment they show up to the Wall with or that are bought for them by the Night's Watch or other player characters. Night's Watch - Total Levy = 17,500 points Important Note: The Night's Watch does not have a levy as such. All points below are considered standing troops, levied for free at all times. Major Castles - 3,000 points Castle Black Large Castles - 2,000 points Shadow Tower Eastwatch-By-The-Sea Nightfort Medium Castles - 1,000 points Westwatch-By-The-Bridge Queensgate Small Castles - 500 points Deep Lake Sentinel Stand Greyguard Stonedoor Hoarfrost Hill Icemark Oakenshield Woodswatch-By-The-Pool Sable Hall Rimegate Long Barrow Torches Greenguard Night's Watch Levy Composition 20% Light Infantry 30% Heavy Infantry 30% Archers 10% Light Cavalry 10% Heavy Cavalry (This will give the Night's Watch a strength of 13,708 Black Brothers if all castles are fully manned.) Building new castles To build a new castle for the Night's Watch funds equal to 50 times their levy points must be raised or granted to the Watch. Thus a 500 point castle needs 25,000 Dragons to construct. Due to the poverty of the Watch these funds are more likely to come from donations from other parts of Westeros or from funds brought by third+ sons of wealthy Lords. A new castle takes 1 RL week to construct. The Watch must have the manpower ready to garrison it when it is completed (a minimum of one third of the points value of the castle), else it will instantly become an abandoned castle and will have to be rebuilt again before becoming useable. Minimum castle garrisons In order for castles to remain active, a minimum of one third of their points value must be garrisoned there. The castles may be left vacant for short periods (eg if the Night's Watch marches to war or post-battle) but at least one third of the points value must have their "home base" at the castle for it to remain active. If the Night's Watch lacks the manpower to maintain a castle at one third of the points value, it is considered abandoned and falls to ruin. It may be reconstructed for half the money it would cost to build it brand new. It is a requirement for the Lord Commander of the Night's Watch player to maintain an up to date list of castles and their garrisons, detailing clearly the castle's points value, the current garrison troops, and their total points value. Failure to do so may cause the moderators to act and shut down castles they feel are not sufficiently manned. Castles manned at game start (Changes per setting) Current setting = Robert's Rebellion Castles in bold are manned. Major Castles - 3,000 points Castle Black Large Castles - 2,000 points Shadow Tower Eastwatch-By-The-Sea Nightfort Medium Castles - 1,000 points Westwatch-By-The-Bridge Queensgate Small Castles - 500 points Deep Lake Sentinel Stand Greyguard Stonedoor Hoarfrost Hill Icemark Oakenshield Woodswatch-By-The-Pool Sable Hall Rimegate Long Barrow Torches Greenguard Replacing dead Brothers The Night's Watch is not like any normal Lordship or fief in Westeros: the brothers are sworn to celibacy and thus do not replace their dead on their own. The Watch relies on outside sources to replace those lost in battle and this can be represented ingame in the following manners: The d20 roll outcomes produce points of recruits, not numbers of men. 1. Every player character joining the Watch (willingly or not) rolls a d20*10 for new recruits. This can be represented ingame as co-conspirators forced into exile with him, or smallfolk inspired to join as they see a nobleman pledging his life to the cause. 2. Every year the Night's Watch may request a d20*20 roll for new recruits, representing people coming willingly to serve the order. 3. One Player Lord Paramount may be approached each year for prisoners or recruits. If they are willing to pay 40,000 Dragons (representing the cost of searching their realm's dungeons and transporting them to one place) the Night's Watch gets a d20*50 roll for new recruits. 4. Three Player High Lords may be approached each year for prisoners or recruits. If they are willing to pay 20,000 Dragons (representing the cost of searching their fief's dungeons and transporting them to one place) the Night's Watch gets a d20*10 roll for new recruits. 5. Any player character may donate money to the Watch to aid their recruitment efforts at any time, with 20 Dragons producing 1 point of recruits.

[Lord Dread]

Oh interesting. I sadly missed the North-only setting, so I wasn't aware of this. By time someone has to tell me why it failed, as I actually liked the idea behind it.

And when reading the castle-founding set, I have to admit that this one is probably the better mechanic.

[Pericles of Athens]

If we want RP along the Wall to have value, we need to generate some form of outside threat to them. Perhaps a roll every year for a King Beyond the Wall or let players RP the rise of a King Beyond the Wall, orherwise donations and effort put into the Wall never really matter.

[Poach]

The problem every Night's Watch RP ever faced was the lack of something to RP for or against. They're a military order with a single purpose: man the Wall. The RP you undertake is no more compelling than RPing a castle garrison. If we departed quite radically from lore and had the Night's Watch get political then it would be viable but that's going too far from what they actually are.

[Pericles of Athens]

It would be fun to have a working Wall in it of itself. But it would also give death row lords and Knights a place to go and RP when they've no options left to them (losing a war, plotting, etc.)