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Thread: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

  1. #121

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    the worst part is that it is an aftereffect of the war which saved the earth .the cold war .because it never happened .
    100% mobile poster so pls forgive grammer

  2. #122

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Are we allowed to post ISIS videos on twcenter, even with warnings? ISIS just posted a new video yesterday and it's one of the most mesmerising and remarkable videos they've ever released, mainly focusing on suicide bombers and actual drone footage of suicide attacks in Mosul.

  3. #123
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by VALIS View Post
    Are we allowed to post ISIS videos on twcenter, even with warnings? ISIS just posted a new video yesterday and it's one of the most mesmerising and remarkable videos they've ever released, mainly focusing on suicide bombers and actual drone footage of suicide attacks in Mosul.
    Such videos are very likely to fall afoul of the ToS paragraphs on Promoting Illegal Activities or Obscene Content (Gore). In any case, please consult with moderation first before posting such hazardous material.
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  4. #124

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    U.S. military aid is fueling big ambitions for Syria’s leftist Kurdish militia
    But first, said the instructors, the recruits must learn and embrace the ideology of Abdullah Ocalan, a Kurdish leader jailed in Turkey whose group is branded a terrorist organization by both Washington and Ankara.

    The scene in the classroom captured some of the complexity of the U.S.-backed fight against the Islamic State in Syria, where a Kurdish movement that subscribes to an ideology at odds with stated U.S. policy has become America’s closest ally against the extremists.

    The People’s Protection Units, or YPG, is the military wing of a political movement that has been governing northeastern Syria for the past 4 1 / 2 years, seeking to apply the Marxist-inspired visions of Ocalan to the majority Kurdish areas vacated by the Syrian government during the war.
    The gains have taken Kurdish fighters far beyond traditionally Kurdish areas into territory populated overwhelmingly by Arabs, threatening not only to stir up long-standing ethnic rivalries but also a wider conflict.
    And it is the Kurdish vision of a future Syria that is being extended to the Arab areas that are being conquered, despite frequent statements issued by the U.S. government opposing the Kurds’ plans to create any form of new region in Syria.

    “The military support has boosted the YPG’s confidence to move beyond Kurdish populated areas and grow their ambitions even beyond Syria,” said Maria Fantappie of the International Crisis Group. “It has huge political implications not only for Syria but also for neighboring *countries.”
    Analysts and YPG opponents question how democratic or egalitarian the group’s ideology really is. Dissent is not tolerated. Photos of Ocalan loom over town squares and in public offices, much in the way Assad’s portrait dominates areas the government controls.

    Though elected councils are administering day-to-day affairs in local communities, real power is wielded by shadowy military commanders who have fought with the PKK in Turkey, said Rana Khalaf, author of a report on the Syrian Kurds’ governance for the London-based Chatham House think tank. “In practice, they are as authoritarian as anyone else,” she said.

    Kurds who support Kurdish parties that are opposed to the YPG have been jailed or driven into exile.

    Those being targeted by the YPG also include people who support the mainstream Syrian opposition, according to an activist from the Arab town of Manbij, which was captured by the YPG and SDF last August. The activist has campaigned against both the Islamic State and the YPG, and the Kurdish militia wants him to turn himself in, he said. As a pressure tactic, the group is holding his brother, who is not politically involved, said the activist, who lives elsewhere in Syria and spoke on the condition of anonymity because he fears for his brother’s safety.
    At a recent ceremony for 250 Arab recruits who had just completed training with the U.S. military near Manbij, the newly minted soldiers were told they would be heading not to the Raqqa front lines but to Aleppo, to confront the rebels backed by Turkey, a NATO ally of the United States. As U.S. Special Operations troops looked on, Abu Amjad al-Adnan, commander of the Manbij recruits, rallied the soldiers to take the fight to the forces backed by “terrorist Turkey.”
    To those who thinks PKK and YPG are two separate groups...
    The Armenian Issue

  5. #125

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Well guess what, for the US a Marxist group is a better ally than crypto-islamist rebels and jihadist terrorists.

  6. #126

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Principe Alessandro View Post
    Well guess what, for the US a Marxist group is a better ally than crypto-islamist rebels and jihadist terrorists.
    Why you try to downplay one group while magnify the other?
    The Armenian Issue

  7. #127
    dogukan's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Because they are a better force for overall stability of the world and progress of humanity....
    "Therefore I am not in favour of raising any dogmatic banner. On the contrary, we must try to help the dogmatists to clarify their propositions for themselves. Thus, communism, in particular, is a dogmatic abstraction; in which connection, however, I am not thinking of some imaginary and possible communism, but actually existing communism as taught by Cabet, Dézamy, Weitling, etc. This communism is itself only a special expression of the humanistic principle, an expression which is still infected by its antithesis – the private system. Hence the abolition of private property and communism are by no means identical, and it is not accidental but inevitable that communism has seen other socialist doctrines – such as those of Fourier, Proudhon, etc. – arising to confront it because it is itself only a special, one-sided realisation of the socialist principle."
    Marx to A.Ruge

  8. #128

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by dogukan View Post
    Because they are a better force for overall stability of the world and progress of humanity....
    That doesn't really justify misrepresentation and the group they're better from isn't really a good starting point. The best you can say is that they're a less worse group for overall stability...
    The Armenian Issue

  9. #129
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria

    I think kurds are crucial for regional stability. A countryless kurd is a problematic kurd.


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    "Therefore I am not in favour of raising any dogmatic banner. On the contrary, we must try to help the dogmatists to clarify their propositions for themselves. Thus, communism, in particular, is a dogmatic abstraction; in which connection, however, I am not thinking of some imaginary and possible communism, but actually existing communism as taught by Cabet, Dézamy, Weitling, etc. This communism is itself only a special expression of the humanistic principle, an expression which is still infected by its antithesis – the private system. Hence the abolition of private property and communism are by no means identical, and it is not accidental but inevitable that communism has seen other socialist doctrines – such as those of Fourier, Proudhon, etc. – arising to confront it because it is itself only a special, one-sided realisation of the socialist principle."
    Marx to A.Ruge

  10. #130

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by dogukan View Post
    I think kurds are crucial for regional stability. A countryless kurd is a problematic kurd.

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    So, the wind blows towards an ethnic state now. Interesting shift from a modern and democratic state understanding. Kurds are crucial for regional stability in the sense that certain Kurdic groups try their best to undermine any resemblance of stability the region has.
    The Armenian Issue

  11. #131
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Setekh View Post
    So, the wind blows towards an ethnic state now. Interesting shift from a modern and democratic state understanding. Kurds are crucial for regional stability in the sense that certain Kurdic groups try their best to undermine any resemblance of stability the region has.
    I didnt say an ethnic state. I refer to a political entity where they have direct representation.
    "Therefore I am not in favour of raising any dogmatic banner. On the contrary, we must try to help the dogmatists to clarify their propositions for themselves. Thus, communism, in particular, is a dogmatic abstraction; in which connection, however, I am not thinking of some imaginary and possible communism, but actually existing communism as taught by Cabet, Dézamy, Weitling, etc. This communism is itself only a special expression of the humanistic principle, an expression which is still infected by its antithesis – the private system. Hence the abolition of private property and communism are by no means identical, and it is not accidental but inevitable that communism has seen other socialist doctrines – such as those of Fourier, Proudhon, etc. – arising to confront it because it is itself only a special, one-sided realisation of the socialist principle."
    Marx to A.Ruge

  12. #132

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by dogukan View Post
    I didnt say an ethnic state. I refer to a political entity where they have direct representation.
    You implied it. You want a state where an ethnic group (Kurds) are the dominant power. A country for Kurds.
    The Armenian Issue

  13. #133
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    Default ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Setekh View Post
    You implied it. You want a state where an ethnic group (Kurds) are the dominant power. A country for Kurds.
    A country that represents kurds. It could be a nation state too if you will. However rojava do far is far from an ethnic nationstate.
    Krg is more of a nationstate.

    The fact is, kurds want and deserve full recognition and representation in their own terms.
    "Therefore I am not in favour of raising any dogmatic banner. On the contrary, we must try to help the dogmatists to clarify their propositions for themselves. Thus, communism, in particular, is a dogmatic abstraction; in which connection, however, I am not thinking of some imaginary and possible communism, but actually existing communism as taught by Cabet, Dézamy, Weitling, etc. This communism is itself only a special expression of the humanistic principle, an expression which is still infected by its antithesis – the private system. Hence the abolition of private property and communism are by no means identical, and it is not accidental but inevitable that communism has seen other socialist doctrines – such as those of Fourier, Proudhon, etc. – arising to confront it because it is itself only a special, one-sided realisation of the socialist principle."
    Marx to A.Ruge

  14. #134

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by dogukan View Post
    A country that represents kurds. It could be a nation state too if you will. However rojava do far is far from an ethnic nationstate.
    Krg is more of a nationstate.

    The fact is, kurds want and deserve full recognition and representation in their own terms.
    That's not what you meant when you said that a Kurd without a country is a problematic Kurd. Deep down, in reality, what you set forth is nothing more than an ethnic state.
    The Armenian Issue

  15. #135

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    Quote Originally Posted by Setekh View Post
    Why you try to downplay one group while magnify the other?
    I'm not downplaying anybody here, I'm just stating a fact.

    We are long past the point when the rebels could still be trusted as a legitimate alternative to Assad, the majority of them support an Islamist ideology and the most important rebel group is nothing more than the Syrian offshoot of al-Qaeda.

    I understand that Turkey isn't keen in letting the Kurds gain autonomy or independence in Syria because is only going to set a bad example for the Turkish Kurds to replicate, but Turkey cannot expect the West to follow your strategy of supporting Islamist bandits to put down Kurdish aspirations and at the same time to fight Assad.

    In fact support for Islamist rebels has blown back now that Islamist terrorists are causing far more deaths and destruction in Turkey than Kurdish and leftists terrorists.

    Beside this Islamist mercenaries are doing a job fighting ISIS to the point that in the Euphrates Shield operation now are involved more Turkish soldiers than Syrian rebels.

    Quote Originally Posted by Setekh View Post
    That's not what you meant when you said that a Kurd without a country is a problematic Kurd. Deep down, in reality, what you set forth is nothing more than an ethnic state.
    It can be any kind of state for what it matters, for sure they deserve to rule themselves as they please instead of being bullied by failed Middle Eastern dictatorships and theocracies.

    Well let's see what CENTCOM thinks:
    SDF confirms that it has no affiliation or ties to PKK


    Last edited by Iskar; January 13, 2017 at 05:58 AM. Reason: consecutive posts merged and off-topic removed

  16. #136

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    The Alewites will ask themselves if it's worth trying to get back the regions the Kurds are now in control off. Assad may think so, his cannon fodder may not.
    Eats, shoots, and leaves.

  17. #137

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by Principe Alessandro View Post
    I'm not downplaying anybody here, I'm just stating a fact.

    We are long past the point when the rebels could still be trusted as a legitimate alternative to Assad, the majority of them support an Islamist ideology and the most important rebel group is nothing more than the Syrian offshoot of al-Qaeda.

    I understand that Turkey isn't keen in letting the Kurds gain autonomy or independence in Syria because is only going to set a bad example for the Turkish Kurds to replicate, but Turkey cannot expect the West to follow your strategy of supporting Islamist bandits to put down Kurdish aspirations and at the same time to fight Assad.

    In fact support for Islamist rebels has blown back now that Islamist terrorists are causing far more deaths and destruction in Turkey than Kurdish and leftists terrorists.

    Beside this Islamist mercenaries are doing a job fighting ISIS to the point that in the Euphrates Shield operation now are involved more Turkish soldiers than Syrian rebels.
    To label PKK as simply as a Marxist group is to downplay it.

    Care to give us the number of deaths caused by PKK and ISIL in Turkey in the last 2 years perhaps?

    Care to give us the number of Turkish soldiers and FSA rebels participating in the Euphrates Shield operation?


    Quote Originally Posted by Principe Alessandro View Post
    It can be any kind of state for what it matters, for sure they deserve to rule themselves as they please instead of being bullied by failed Middle Eastern dictatorships and theocracies.
    So, they have a right to be an other failed Middle Eastern theocratic dictatorship?


    Quote Originally Posted by Principe Alessandro View Post
    Well let's see what CENTCOM thinks:
    SDF confirms that it has no affiliation or ties to PKK
    I posted one article before where YPG fighters were interviewed where one of them bluntly says that one day they're PKK, an other day they're YPG, and an other article detailing how even Arab recruits under SDF are indoctrined under the picture of Öcalan, PKK's jailed leader. So, they could claim to have no affiliation with PKK all they want. Put lipstick on a pig. A pig is still a pig.
    Last edited by Iskar; January 13, 2017 at 06:00 AM. Reason: continuity
    The Armenian Issue

  18. #138
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    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria

    BREAKING;

    It appears that the Israeli airforce has bombed a military airport near Damascus.

    The Syrian military have promised 'serious repercussions'.

    https://www.rt.com/news/373522-syria...bombed-israel/

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  19. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Setekh View Post
    That's not what you meant when you said that a Kurd without a country is a problematic Kurd. Deep down, in reality, what you set forth is nothing more than an ethnic state.
    Should i be ashamed? I fully support it if they create a nation state. Just like all other large nations in the middle east they deserve to have one.

    However i much prefer the rojava project with direct democracy. It is the future of a better middle east. Thats something i d actively support.

    Quote Originally Posted by Setekh View Post
    To label PKK as simply as a Marxist group is to downplay it.

    Care to give us the number of deaths caused by PKK and ISIL in Turkey in the last 2 years perhaps?

    Care to give us the number of Turkish soldiers and FSA rebels participating in the Euphrates Shield operation?




    So, they have a right to be an other failed Middle Eastern theocratic dictatorship?




    I posted one article before where YPG fighters were interviewed where one of them bluntly says that one day they're PKK, an other day they're YPG, and an other article detailing how even Arab recruits under SDF are indoctrined under the picture of Öcalan, PKK's jailed leader. So, they could claim to have no affiliation with PKK all they want. Put lipstick on a pig. A pig is still a pig.
    I am sorry but you have to make your peace with the fact that vast majority of kurds are pro ocalan and this is even more true for rojava.
    Today or tomorrow, people will have to face this reality. They are not going anywhere.
    Last edited by Iskar; January 13, 2017 at 06:01 AM. Reason: consecutive posts merged and off-topic removed
    "Therefore I am not in favour of raising any dogmatic banner. On the contrary, we must try to help the dogmatists to clarify their propositions for themselves. Thus, communism, in particular, is a dogmatic abstraction; in which connection, however, I am not thinking of some imaginary and possible communism, but actually existing communism as taught by Cabet, Dézamy, Weitling, etc. This communism is itself only a special expression of the humanistic principle, an expression which is still infected by its antithesis – the private system. Hence the abolition of private property and communism are by no means identical, and it is not accidental but inevitable that communism has seen other socialist doctrines – such as those of Fourier, Proudhon, etc. – arising to confront it because it is itself only a special, one-sided realisation of the socialist principle."
    Marx to A.Ruge

  20. #140

    Default Re: ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

    Quote Originally Posted by dogukan View Post
    Should i be ashamed? I fully support it if they create a nation state. Just like all other large nations in the middle east they deserve to have one.

    However i much prefer the rojava project with direct democracy. It is the future of a better middle east. Thats something i d actively support.
    Ashamed? I don't know. That depends on how much you care about your principles. It simply tells me that all the talk about the principles of modern age being the fuel of the Kurdic cause in Syria to be empty talk. Nothing more.


    Quote Originally Posted by dogukan View Post
    I am sorry but you have to make your peace with the fact that vast majority of kurds are pro ocalan and this is even more true for rojava.
    Today or tomorrow, people will have to face this reality. They are not going anywhere.
    You have any data on this? If you do, please share... By the way, this is not a dick measurement race. You're clearly approaching it as one. Me accepting that a lot of Kurds support Öcalan or not has no relevance to what we're talking about. What you're saying here is merely the echoes of deflection from having democratic and modern principles tested and failing in your position's case. Every single Kurd out there could love the guy to death. That wouldn't change a single thing I said.
    Last edited by Iskar; January 13, 2017 at 06:02 AM. Reason: continuity
    The Armenian Issue

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