ISIL War in Iraq and Syria II

[Papay]

False. The two bodies that tracked civilian casualties caused by the fighting sides, SOHR and SNHR, both place civilian killed by ISIS as higher than by the entire international coalition combined (this doesn't include Russia, which killed the 2nd highest number of civilians according to both, and I don't see you criticise them). You can easily access this data on wikipedia, rather than spewing lies and propaganda in favour of a genocidal group of barbarians who literally enslave people due to their religion and use women as sex slaves. How can you possibly support this? Is this what you wish upon your own family? Is seeing a female relative being sold in a market something that you yearn for?

US bombs completely destroyed Mosul(1.500.000 population), Fallujah(300.000 population), Ramadi(400.000 population), Raqqah(100.000 population) and the cities years later are still in ruins with thousands of bodies still not found. Luckily for US and its allies media have chosen not to show these war crimes and instead focus to various muslim michael Myers's who attack people with a knife in the west.

[Abdülmecid I]

Meanwhile, after Zenki was evicted from the Aleppo countryside, Ahrar al-Sham, probably the second strongest group in the jihadist-dominated Idlib, surrendered the south-western territory. The Salafists of HTS pretty much now control the entire periphery of Idlib, with a couple of NFL pockets in the center. It would be really hilarious if Erdoğan's bullying against the Kurds only leads to the destruction of Turkey's proxies, instead of the "liberation of Ayn al-Arab". The President really excels at populism and at manipulating the electorate, but his foreign policy has been embarrassingly amateurish. In my opinion, he will be forced to either helplessly watch his mercenaries getting decimated by the fundamentalists his administration equipped and financed or sacrifice even more resources, in order to restore the status-quo and stop the imminent collapse of the National Front for Liberation. By the way, just yesterday, an Algerian Sharia scholar belonging to that, supposedly more moderate, group, was filmed torturing and beheading a civilian accused of spying for Damascus. Poor Syria is literally a honeypot for psychopaths from North Africa and the Caucasus.

False. The two bodies that tracked civilian casualties caused by the fighting sides, SOHR and SNHR, both place civilian killed by ISIS as higher than by the entire international coalition combined (this doesn't include Russia, which killed the 2nd highest number of civilians according to both, and I don't see you criticise them). You can easily access this data on wikipedia, rather than spewing lies and propaganda in favour of a genocidal group of barbarians who literally enslave people due to their religion and use women as sex slaves. How can you possibly support this? Is this what you wish upon your own family? Is seeing a female relative being sold in a market something that you yearn for?

He also counts the numbers from the operations of the Iraqi for the liberation of cities like Tikrit, Mosul, Fallujah and Ramadi. Not that the accidental deaths during aerial bombardment and frontal assault against enemy positions are somehow morally comparable to the random executions of dissidents and "law-breakers" or the genocide of Shiites and Yazidis in Iraq. Overall, Papay, I think it's time to recognize the fact that Islamic sectarianism in the Fertile Crescent was decisively defeated, despite the invaluable foreign support it received, mainly by the regular armies of Iraq and Syria, as well as thanks to the contribution of secular and religiously tolerant militia. There are many factors that shaped the result of the conflict, but the most important one is that the Syrian and Iraqi people massively reject the political model of theocracy as socially divisive, economically disastrous and politically tyrannical.

[nhytgbvfeco2]

US bombs completely destroyed Mosul(1.500.000 population), Fallujah(300.000 population), Ramadi(400.000 population), Raqqah(100.000 population) and the cities years later are still in ruins with thousands of bodies still not found. Luckily for US and its allies media have chosen not to show these war crimes and instead focus to various muslim michael Myers's who attack people with a knife in the west.

You post those population numbers as if every single person living there died. Yes, those are big cities, all the more reason to wrest control of them out of the hands of genocidal slavers.
You have failed to address anything I said in my post.

He also counts the numbers from the operations of the Iraqi for the liberation of cities like Tikrit, Mosul, Fallujah and Ramadi.

Even still, the Yazidi genocide commited by ISIS alone reaches a number of killed between 2,100 and 5,000 with another up to 10,000 taken captive (enslaved), and this is just for the Sinjar massacre, which already is higher than casualties caused to civilians by the US, or even the international coalition as a whole.
His claim is false however you look at it, unless he believes, like his ISIS friends, the Yazidis to be subhuman.

[ioannis76]

I wouldn't drink to killing of Greeks even when they were helping Öcalan to smuggle him around Africa and hide him in their embassy.

How very magnanimous of you. However, the President of the Turkish Republic did say, quite recently, that he would kick the Greeks in the sea.

https://greece.greekreporter.com/201...the-sea-video/

"The miserable Greek cannot achieve his aim. Don't cross, they will say, but I will go into Smyrni (Izmir, for you). I will throw the Greeks into the sea. Yes, this city was by day always in our imagination, by night in our dreams. For us, the borders of Smyrni (Izmir, for you) start from Vienna, the Adriatic, eastern Turkestan, the north Black Sea (did you tell that to Putin?) This city has been Turkish for nine centuries, from the era of Caka Bey, People live in this city, whose roots reach all the way from the eastern Turkistan to Thessaloniki. From Crimea, to Crete, and they all live peacefully"

But that is not war rhetoric.

But never mind that, I guess Turkey will conquer Washington soon:

Turkey says it will launch Syria offensive if US delays pullout

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...delays-pullout

LOL, I am pretty sure that this is NOT going to happen, as Turkey never starts a war or any other military operation, unless it is sure that it's going to be successful, and it doesn't look like engaging US troops is going to guarantee success. Even more so that the Turkish and Saudi jihadists are killing each other in Idlib. See, the US doesn't even have to fire a single shot to defeat Turkey.

And it looks like the SAA is going to reclaim Idlib from the Turkish proxies, taking full advantage of the havoc that has been caused by the HTS:
https://syria.liveuamap.com/en/2019/...eading-towards
I would recommend that the the turkish "observation points" in Idlib be evacuated, but that is up to Turkey, of course.

I wonder if there has been some sort of US-Russia deal to discipline Turkey.

[nhytgbvfeco2]

The factions in Idlib seem to have reached an agreement whereby all of greater Idlib will be handed over to HTS and the other factions will withdraw to the Turkish occupied zone. HTS 1 - Turkey 0.

[PointOfViewGun]

How very magnanimous of you. However, the President of the Turkish Republic did say, quite recently, that he would kick the Greeks in the sea.
https://greece.greekreporter.com/201...the-sea-video/
"The miserable Greek cannot achieve his aim. Don't cross, they will say, but I will go into Smyrni (Izmir, for you). I will throw the Greeks into the sea. Yes, this city was by day always in our imagination, by night in our dreams. For us, the borders of Smyrni (Izmir, for you) start from Vienna, the Adriatic, eastern Turkestan, the north Black Sea (did you tell that to Putin?) This city has been Turkish for nine centuries, from the era of Caka Bey, People live in this city, whose roots reach all the way from the eastern Turkistan to Thessaloniki. From Crimea, to Crete, and they all live peacefully"
But that is not war rhetoric.

Sigh... I do not define myself by the words of my country's president... What you quote is not war rhetoric though. It is nationalistic rhetoric. The context is that he's halfway reciting a poem (though the article chooses a particular moment in his recitation to start) from a Kurdic poet who is known to have taken part in a Kurdic rebellion (though pardoned) in the early days of the republic. The throwing of the Greeks to sea from Izmir is part of the poem and points at the Greek occupation of Izmir from back in 1919-1922. The event the those lines were recited was an AKP municipality candidate introduction event. The article, at least the title directly, tries to present it as if he threatened Greeks. At best, its a cheap jab.

[dogukan]

The original poem was not written for Greeks.

https://www.gazeteduvar.com.tr/gunde...i-alisere-ait/

Seyran eyleyelim Sultan Bağını,
Ne hoş çiçekleri var, gülü Dersimin. …./…
Nice padişahlar geldi cihana, Bunu almak için düştü gümana,
Arslanlar yurdudur tilkiler giremez, Gerçekler sırrıdır akıllar eremez , Evliya gülüdür zalimler dermez, Ona bağlıdır yolu Dersim’in…


It was actually written against Turkish oppression of Kurds by Alişer Koçgiri.


Erdoğan clearly took a hostile tone on the Greeks. That is an unacceptable behaviour. He is using the nationalist wave to take İzmir.

[tgoodenow]

US Military Occupations Now Supported by Far More Democrats Than Republican

To the question “As you may know, President Trump ordered an immediate withdrawal of more than 2,000 U.S. troops from Syria. Based on what you know, do you support or oppose President Trump’s decision?”, 29 percent of Democrats responded either “Somewhat support” or “Strongly support”, while 50 percent responded either “Somewhat oppose” or “Strongly oppose”. Republicans asked the same question responded with 73 percent either somewhat or strongly supporting and only 17 percent either somewhat or strongly opposing.

https://theantimedia.com/us-military...LgiaubmfQqzGE8

Orange man bad we support war now

[Heathen Hammer]

https://theantimedia.com/us-military...LgiaubmfQqzGE8

Orange man bad we support war now

For Democrats and liberal-leaning mainstream media partisanship trumps (pun intended) everything else. Essentially American "liberals" are just neocons who pretend to like gay people but still want pointless and unwinable wars in Middle East to make their Israeli and Saudi owners happy.

[Genghis Skahn]

<snip>

And so the cycle of warmongering continues...

[Prodromos]

Most Ds oppose anything an R does, and most Rs support anything an R does. Not really news.

[Heathen Hammer]

Most Ds oppose anything an R does, and most Rs support anything an R does. Not really news.

Democrats under Obama were just as pro-war as Republicans are. Plus GOP is still infested by McCain types that dream of attacking Iran, overthrowing Assad and all that other neocon globalist nonsense.

[tgoodenow]

Most Ds oppose anything an R does, and most Rs support anything an R does. Not really news.

Not true. The support for the 2009 Afghanistan surge initiated by Obama was as follows:

As Gallup noted, the poll revealed “an unusual set of political cross-currents,” since support for a troop surge came primarily from Republicans. The poll showed that 63% of Republicans supported a possible surge; in contrast, only 30% of Democrats and 38% of Independents favored that policy

While support for the Iraq surge looked like this:

The partisan breakdown of the poll data showed that the bulk of support for a troop increase came from Republicans, with 67% of this group favoring an increase. In contrast, only 35% of Independents and 12% of Democrats supported a troop increase

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/ful...58244015621957

Democrats never supported either the surge in Iraq or Afghanistan and have been pretty opposed to war for the past 18 years.
Till orange man bad

[Prodromos]

Those polls don't really contradict what I said.

Most Ds oppose anything an R does.
=/=
Most Ds support anything a D does.

Most Rs support anything an R does.
=/=
Most Rs oppose anything a D does.

This also applies to other issues, like health care. Republican support for socialized medicine shoots up when the program is portrayed as a Trump proposal. Of course this is a generalization, but on most issues this is just how it is.

Just as Democrats have Orange Man Bad, Republicans have Orange Man Good. Most people don't have a coherent worldview or solid political principles. Politics is like a sport. As long as they're winning, policy is an afterthought.

So I wouldn't derive too much out of this. Once say Cruz or Rubio are the nominees in 2020 or 2024, most Republicans will shift back to advocating for free trade and a proactive foreign policy.

[Vanoi]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/president...125353801.html

Trump threaten's economic consequences for Turkey if they attack the Kurds. Not sure how effective that'll be though.

[PointOfViewGun]

The more interesting notion from his tweet was the 20 mile long safe zone.

[95thrifleman]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/president...125353801.html

Trump threaten's economic consequences for Turkey if they attack the Kurds. Not sure how effective that'll be though.

I wouldn't trust America if I was the Kurds, not based on how they where left to die back when Saddam was in power.

[ioannis76]

The original poem was not written for Greeks.

https://www.gazeteduvar.com.tr/gunde...i-alisere-ait/

Seyran eyleyelim Sultan Bağını,
Ne hoş çiçekleri var, gülü Dersimin. …./…
Nice padişahlar geldi cihana, Bunu almak için düştü gümana,
Arslanlar yurdudur tilkiler giremez, Gerçekler sırrıdır akıllar eremez , Evliya gülüdür zalimler dermez, Ona bağlıdır yolu Dersim’in…


It was actually written against Turkish oppression of Kurds by Alişer Koçgiri.


Erdoğan clearly took a hostile tone on the Greeks. That is an unacceptable behaviour. He is using the nationalist wave to take İzmir.

Thank you for clarifying the issue.

[Nebaki]

Erdoğan clearly took a hostile tone on the Greeks. That is an unacceptable behaviour. He is using the nationalist wave to take İzmir.

You have no clue about Izmir and also Erdogan does not need to make something to take over Izmir since there is no real Opposition.

Can you please stop using unserious amateur Sources to just substantiate your view of Turkey? Also it´s funny that you Sources never explain the whole Story.

[Vanoi]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/israeli-m...000911635.html

It looks like Israel is more open now in stating it is directly targetting Iranian weapon caches and military personnel. Even with the eventual deployment of Syria's S-300 system I don't see Israeli attacks letting up as long as Iran continues to funnel support through Syria to Hezbollah and generally continue to establish a military presence in Syria itself.