Proper Combat Mod [Update 24.10.2016]

[Zhokar]

It's all good, KAM. Just wanted to give the feedback, i'll do a few test games myself and decide if I will continue investing heavilly in ranged units. Overall would you say ranged units are still as good as vanilla? Makes sense that you would see less kills with the same damage stats on units with buffed HP.

So, you're working on something new for Attila? I really loved the old Combat Mod before you stopped updating it. By far my favorite Battle Mod for the game.

[KAM 2150]

Yeah, I enjoyed my Attila one too, but real life could not give me enough time for update it with patches and DLC, while I was able to make this Warhammer mod in few hours.

Missiles also got damage buff, even with nerf from today, they still have higher damage (even though in UI it will give you lower value because for some reason the game calculates the damage dealt over 10 seconds).

As for the overl usage, at first I too thought that those changes from yesterday were great, but like those tests shown, it was OP config if even best cavalry in the game was being slaughtered, that tactic would be to easy to exploit. Missile damage will probably change many times so one day we will hit proper values xD

[McCarronXLD]

Thanks KAM you're a life saver!

[Chris P. Bacon]

I downloaded the PFM Kam but I'm hopeless with computers and couldn't find the line to delete. Could you please make an alternate version with the vanilla unit sizes real quick when you get back to your computer?

[KAM 2150]

I will make on in the evening.

[EternalSilence]

Hey,
Big thanks for this mod.
I really disliked the clickfest when playing a battle.

I would also like vanilla units sizes.
I'll be promoting your battle mod with the gaming RTS community in Belgium & The Netherlands.

[Pyro88]

Thank you for this mod, I can't get myself into the battles as they are, I just can't keep up with the frenetic pacing of them. Much appreciated will post some feedback after a few hours play.

[KAM 2150]

Vanilla size unit version will be released in a matter of minutes Tomorrow I should release bigger update that will change how some stuff is working to make it more unit mod friendly.

[KAM 2150]

Enjoy

Basic version with -50% unit upkeep:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfile.../?id=692824598

Here is basic version of my mod, but without increased unit size or reduced upkeep (just use existing upkeep mods for it):
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=692829237

[cyox]

thanks for the other versions. was waiting on that vanilla unit size one

[peer]

In the increased unit size version, chariot units have an extra crewman floating in the air just behind the horses/boars/wolves.

[KAM 2150]

Ok, thanks, I will check it

[peer]

No probs. Just noticed there's also an extra guy on the Arachnarok howdah, clipping into one of the other goblins. Not a big deal, really, just looks a little bit silly (if you even notice it)

[KAM 2150]

NEW UPDATE IS ONLINE:

Long story short, this version is easier to me to update in future plus it is COMPATIBLE WITH UNIT MODS! I dropped some of original changes and replaced them with workarounds so gameplay is still good, but you can use more mods with it
Changes:
-unit size back to vanilla version
-unit HP values are back to vanilla version
-decreased weapon damage to make combat slower, despite going back to original HP values
-small tweaks to morale, units will hold ground a bit longer but will be broken easier
-tweaks to ranged units (Mortars should be more useful)


I will delete mods for upkeep and vanilla version since they are redundant now. This version allows for other upkeep mods anyway

[Arayel]

Hey Kam,

Really liking where this is going. Just played around 20 turns with your mod (probably the previous version so will go test this new one now) but had a few observations.

Firstly I much prefer the speed, however the problem is now (maybe was) that large numbers of my army just stand around literally doing nothing. This is most noticeable with ranged units after their reload speed reduction. Their animation finishes and they just stand there looking dumb. It's not as noticeable in melee (it was already a bit of an issue in vanilla anyway) simply because its harder to see whats going on but one thing I would really like to see is more attack animations in general, probably at reduced damage to account for this.

Secondly I think you overdid it with the ranged guys. I had 4 crossbow units vs some savage orcs, total kills for the army was around 500, crossbows did 30 between them all firing at least half the battle.....

I've not looked at any of the unit stats files yet, been concentrating on diplomacy and character skills mainly, so if I'm way off the mark no worries. The pace just feels so much better when out of combat it would be awesome if there was a bit more frenetic action once combat was actually happening. Ranged wise you'd have to add ammo if you decreased damage and put reload speed back to normal though, otherwise ranged would suffer even more.

Off to see how your changes affected things, will pop back in a bit.

Ok two battles played with the updated version. A definite improvement I think. Mortars felt like they were having an effect again and my ranged units weren't so ineffective, the crossbows took down 32 people in the opening empire battle, although I misused them slightly so my bad there.

Still seeing quite a lot of people just doing nothing. Again its still most noticeable with ranged units but I'd rather play with this mod and have that issue than play the battles at 2x speed which was how vanilla felt to me. It might sound odd but I actually think somehow this has helped the ai too...no idea how that could be the case but fought these battles on normal and have only managed a close victory in the opening battle both times, plus those savage orcs beat me (twice) even though auto resolve said I have the advantage (which I did in numbers).

This brings me to another question. Any chance you know where the difficulty modifiers for battles are? I'd love to know whether normal or hard is closest to no advantage for either side and then mod a version where no side gets any buffs or nerfs. I've already done this for the campaign in Very Hard and while I'm happy that I can get beaten on normal by an Ai Orc army I'd love to figure out where these settings are!!!

[KAM 2150]

Hi buddy,

Morale bonuses for AI per difficulty level are located in kv_rules tables.

As for ranged units, you can't look at their kills. This game has a lot of units that have varied HP amounts and ranged unit damage is more spread across entire unit. For example during testing this version, a volley of 2 or 3 handgunners killed only 3 Greatswords but at the same time they lost 20-25% of their total HP, like I wrote, only single volley. Second volley didn't take much damage from entire unit (maybe 5-10%) but killed a lot of people, because targets that were already weakaned by first volley died more easily. Melee units are stuck fighting guy in front of them until they kill him, but missile units spread their damage more. It would love if there would be a screen which shows how much damage has a unit dealt to have better results.

As for the animations, blame CA. My speed changes have nothing to do with animations, they just work as they would work in vanilla or 2x speed. Also blame CA for lack of reload animations ; P There is a table that would make units attack more often, but it is too much to balance at the moment, plus imagine giant swinging his club each second, instead of once in 3.8 seconds (Attack intervals are same for all units), but not being able to actually kills much due to severly lowered damage in order to have longer combat.

[Arayel]

Yea I found the morale bonuses...or rather lack of +5 for player at easy, 0, 0 and plus 5 for Ai on very hard....almost doesn't seem worth having battle difficulty settings if those are the only changes! I'm surprised there aren't damage or defence buffs hidden somewhere like previous games. Not that it seems to matter, normal seems nicely balanced as it turns out.

So what about say doubling speed of attack, halving damage across the board. One club swing every 1.8 seconds doesn't seem too insane, or you could go with a 33% speed increase and 2/3 the damage? Is this something that can be modded globally somewhere or do you have to mod each unit or weapon stat individually?

I'm aware of the ranged units damage vs kills, especially since often they get to do the early damage and the melee guys clean up the killing blows.

[KAM 2150]

Cobmat animation thing is deffo doable, I just rather play this game a bit more instead of giving my all free time on testing and modding ; D

[Commissar Caligula_]

Cobmat animation thing is deffo doable, I just rather play this game a bit more instead of giving my all free time on testing and modding ; D

We signed a pact with the devil kam, we are MODDERS! We don't get to play the game, we must MOD! By the time we've finished making the mod, we'll hate it so much we never actually use it.
Modders 4 lyfe =P

[KAM 2150]