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Thread: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

  1. #1
    Zarax's Avatar Triple Chaosmaster
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    Default Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    first of all, a video showing the results:

    https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resi...int=file%2cflv

    It really looks impressive and is actually easy to implement as shown below.

    limitations of this trick:

    1) it's limited to 2 models at best
    2) you must use 2 different models in the unit other wise the texture will not load
    3) it's extremely memory intensive, it will cause CTDs and slow-downs if too many units are on the battlefield
    4) you will loose control of part of the unit (just like vanilla wardogs!) and it cannot have missile weapons or shields

    now, on the coding part:

    descr_animals.txt:

    change the wardog unit to another model of your liking. For example, XC5 generic "rebel rabble" unit uses greek crew:

    type wardog
    class wardog
    model greek_crew
    radius 1.0
    x_radius 1.0
    height 1.0
    mass 1.0

    export_descr_units.txt:

    the unit has to be set-up in a similar way to vanilla wardogs.
    "Dogs" max number is handlers*4-1
    Use secondary weapon to define "dog" stats.


    type barb rebels
    dictionary barb_rebels ; Warband
    category handler
    class light
    voice_type Light_1
    soldier barb_infantry, 60, 239, 0.8
    animal wardogs
    mount_effect horse -6, camel -6, elephant -8 ; western barb, garrison
    attributes mercenary_unit, is_peasant
    formation 1, 1, 2, 2, 4, square
    stat_health 1, 0
    stat_pri 5, 4, no, 0, 0, melee, simple, piercing, spear, 25 ,0.325 ; Spear, barbarian
    stat_pri_attr light_spear, spear_bonus_4
    stat_sec 5, 4, no, 0, 0, melee, other, piercing, none, 25 ,1
    stat_sec_attr no
    stat_pri_armour 0, 7, 4, flesh; garrison, barbarian, no armour, thureos
    stat_sec_armour 0, 7, flesh
    stat_heat 3
    stat_ground 2, -2, 3, 2
    stat_mental 1, low, untrained
    stat_charge_dist 30 ; Foot
    stat_fire_delay 0
    stat_food 60, 300
    stat_cost 99, 475, 225, 30, 60, 400
    ownership barbarian, nomad, slave
    The Best Is Yet To Come:

  2. #2

    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Ah I was right. I can only see this being beneficial for revolts or uprisings. If it's a medieval mod or fantasy mod there could be fanatics.

  3. #3
    z3n's Avatar State of Mind
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    You seem to have discovered a way to create pseudo berserkers for M2TW. I'll link it in the relevant M2TW discussion as they (berserkers) don't work there.
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  4. #4
    Zarax's Avatar Triple Chaosmaster
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    So wardogs still works in M2TW? Interesting...
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  5. #5
    z3n's Avatar State of Mind
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Yes they do a modder named Eothese was able to get them working in 2008.
    The AI Workshop Creator
    Europa Barbaroum II AI/Game Mechanics Developer
    The Northern Crusades Lead Developer
    Classical Age Total War Retired Lead Developer
    Rome: Total Realism Animation Developer
    RTW Workshop Assistance MTW2 AI Tutorial & Assistance
    Broken Crescent Submod (M2TW)/IB VGR Submod (BI)/Animation (RTW/BI/ALX)/TATW PCP Submod (M2TW)/TATW DaC Submod (M2TW)/DeI Submod (TWR2)/SS6.4 Northern European UI Mod (M2TW)

  6. #6

    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Hi,

    I tried your method to create some kind of pseudo-beserk unit. Unfortunalety I get a CTD the moment my "dogs" hit the enemy. Obviously my crash log did not give me any real information. I also made sure that the heightvalue of my "dogs" are 2.6. I could normally start the game and get into a custom battle - only when the "dogs" arrive at the enemy frontline my game crashes. Could it be that some kind of special attack animation is necessary?

    PS: I am also using models from a mod. So not vanilla soldiers.

  7. #7
    Zarax's Avatar Triple Chaosmaster
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Did you try height set to 1?
    Also, are you sure your model has a proper attack animation?
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  8. #8

    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Well the modell works if I put it as a normal Infantry unit. I also put another (working) Infantry unit as handlers.

    But i will set the height to 1 thanks for that.

    EDIT: Nope doesnt work either.
    Last edited by Nihilem; May 19, 2016 at 01:02 PM.

  9. #9
    Zarax's Avatar Triple Chaosmaster
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Weird, can you try some vanilla model?
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  10. #10
    nhinhonhinho's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Not trying to change 'the dogs' but still testing this method. Anyway is it possible to create more dogs units?

  11. #11
    Zarax's Avatar Triple Chaosmaster
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    You can use the pig slot changing the animal in descr_animals but it's hardcoded to max 2 types.
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  12. #12
    nhinhonhinho's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Aww kinda sad then . I want more like that...

    Anyway this's what I've achieved so far
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 












  13. #13
    Zarax's Avatar Triple Chaosmaster
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Looks epic, doesn't it?
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  14. #14
    nhinhonhinho's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Yeah it's epic! Anyway there're 2 things

    - The ratio should be 2 'dogs'/ 1 man. Larger ratio crash the game so theoretically 720 'troops'/unit is the max
    - The texture do work using the same model for both handlers and 'dogs' as you can see in the screenshort I only use galloglass model for both 'man' and 'dogs'

    Anyone here tried to use pig?

  15. #15
    Zarax's Avatar Triple Chaosmaster
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    No but it would be tricky as you cannot change the hardcoded effects.
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  16. #16
    nhinhonhinho's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarax View Post
    No but it would be tricky as you cannot change the hardcoded effects.
    Just tested. Pigs doesn't work, epic fail here

    - The 'pig' did nothing, they have no fighting animation and they just stand idle in battle
    - Worse they literally BUSTED into FLAME, whole units run amok and when they stopped only handlers left and their formation turned from square to horde!

    I tried to change the model_battle and gave the pig the attacking animation of dog but it still not work.

  17. #17
    Zarax's Avatar Triple Chaosmaster
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    I think you need to change the class to wardog to use them properly... TBH I only find them useful to emulate desperate peasant rebels or fanatical bodyguards.

    I seriously wish CA would release the source code, the community could do wonders with it...
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  18. #18
    nhinhonhinho's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Hm...I'll try changing the class

    Anyway I just found another problem for the 'dogs' . The 'dogs' behavior thought similar to proper soldiers but they're very weak and not fighting effectively despite having the same stat with the troops, may be they spent too much times playing running animation. i.e: The gallowglass in the above shorts, I pit a unit of 720 guys (240 'handlers', the rest were 'dogs) vs 240 guys commitatense first cohort. The 'dogs' killed merely 30 or so before being slaughter, the 'handlers' joined the fight and rout the legionnaire

    In the other hand the 'handlers' need to have good moral or they will rout very quickly when the 'dogs' get kill!

    And I do agree this method seem to be useful only for cannon foldder for a single faction or being rebel or so

  19. #19
    Zarax's Avatar Triple Chaosmaster
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    Yes, remember "dogs" have no armor and no shield so you need to give them better stats to compensate.
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  20. #20
    nhinhonhinho's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Using wardogs mechanics to emulate larger than limit units

    This's my current stat for the units

    type celtish wolfhounds2
    dictionary gallowglass
    category handler
    class light
    voice_type Medium_1
    soldier gallowglass, 60, 120, 0.9
    animal wardogs
    attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, can_swim
    formation 2.2, 2.2, 3, 3, 3, square
    stat_health 1, 1
    stat_pri 13, 5, no, 0, 0, melee, blade, piercing, sword, 25 ,1
    stat_pri_attr no
    stat_sec 13, 5, no, 0, 0, melee, other, blunt, none, 25 ,1
    stat_sec_attr no

    stat_pri_armour 7, 10, 0, metal
    stat_sec_armour 7, 10, metal
    stat_heat 3
    stat_ground 1, -2, 3, 2
    stat_mental 9, impetuous, trained
    stat_charge_dist 30
    stat_fire_delay 0
    stat_food 60, 300
    stat_cost 2, 477, 150, 60, 80, 530
    ownership celts

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