For Crown and Anvil: A Guide to the Kingdom of the Dwarves

[webba84]

I've seen Dunland attack the shire at least once (playing as Rohan iirc).

[athanaric]

Haven't seen anything like that for a long time. I've seen Adunabar seem about to attack the Shire, but never actually go through with it yet.

I've seen Adunabar attack the Shire a couple times (most recently in my current Dwarven campaign), and wipe them out twice or so. Assisting the Hobbits is pretty difficult because they are useless in battle (any Hobbit unit is hard countered by Royal Longbowmen).

[SnuggleBunnies]

It would also be nice in that, for example, if you were playing the Dwarves, Lorien falling to Adunabar would create an entire new front for you to have to worry about. But I agree, aggresive Elves/Dwarves would also be really weird, and having them be too weak early on could allow the player to steamroll them. It's hard to think of a good solution.

[Wambat]

In the diplomacy discussion there has been testimony that the AI will honor diplomatic agreements whereby they are obliged to attack enemy factions, provided they have access to them. If you want to see Elves and Dwarves more active in your campaign you might try paying them to attack other factions.

[athanaric]

In the diplomacy discussion there has been testimony that the AI will honor diplomatic agreements whereby they are obliged to attack enemy factions, provided they have access to them. If you want to see Elves and Dwarves more active in your campaign you might try paying them to attack other factions.

Good idea, might try that. On an unrelated note, your font size is off.

[webba84]

Good news Athanaric, the fix for the mithril armoury is very straightfoward, and will be included in the patch. To fix it yourself in the meantime just go to the army_barracks_dwarven entry in edb and change the lines

                armour bonus 3 requires factions { saxons, } and building_factions { slavs, }
                weapon_bladed bonus 3 requires factions { saxons, } and building_factions { slavs, }

to

                armour bonus 3 requires factions { saxons, }
                weapon_bladed bonus 3 requires factions { saxons, }

[demagogos nicator]

Very nice and useful guide

[Dáin II]

Two little side notes about Southern and Northern Arthedain.

The worst case scenario I experienced for not expanding early towards Sarnford was the elves bribing it and making it their capital and thus not possible to bribe/buy. I personally don't trust these military access deals that much (even in a fixed alliance with Dale it doesn't work 100%, have seen them attack my dwarves in their territory) and the troops Elves would field around Sarnford are not exactly the thing that is fun to meet in battle, so I tend to make Sarnford my very first priority. This also goes very well with the starting family member, since the first marriage offers you get are for that girl in Hollowbold, giving you a 2nd governor for the area very soon.

Expanding early into Northern Arthedain soon seems to trigger war with Adunabar. Whenever I took it very early it was just a matter of time until an army with trolls showed up, so I only take it once I can produce ballistas in the area.

Besides that, nothing to add. Like all your guides this one is very helpful.

[CountMRVHS]

Those are both great points, thanks! I too like to move on Sarnford sooner rather than later, to prevent getting boxed in by the other factions (and get trade with the Shire). And I haven't had much luck with N. Arthedain either; Adunabar does seem to 'shadow' your movements up there, bringing lots of troops toward that little settlement.

[Wambat]

What I have done is simply hold the ford at Sarnford and Lune's northernmost ford with four infantry, four archers, and a catapult at each. This has been sufficient deterrent for 150 turns; for all I know it is overkill. It might not be sufficient deterrent if I where at war with Adunabar, but, fortunately, I have had no trouble getting ceasefires with them.


Another good piece of advice to add to your guide is to get alliance and military access with The Shire early; as early as possible; no matter the cost. It is not that difficult to get military access with the Elves, and you definitely should do that as well, but the Elves just cannot resist the temptation to attack your units if you leave them on Elven territory at the end of your turn. Infantry have just enough MP to get from Lhûn Valley to Westmarch, and The Shire does not have the same problem with allied troops on their territory. This is essential to your two western provinces being able to support each other.


I would also take the position that, of the two IP provinces available, Lune is the more essential to capture ASAP. As stated, the Elves cannot be trusted to let your troops hang out on their soil unmolested, so you need control of Lune in order to move your troops north and south. If the Elves capture Sarnford, you can expect that either Adunabar or Tharbad will "liberate" Sarnford at some point, and if they do not, you will, at least, never have worry about Hollowbold. If, however, the Elves take Lune before you, you will never be able to get it for yourself without going to war with the Elves, and you will lose any hope of easy communication between Hollowbold and Gabilgathol.

[Dáin II]

It's possible to buy Lune from the Elves. I had it gifted to them in some campaign and decided later that I wanted it back. They sold for 30000. Didn't try any lower cause they seem to need high offers (I noticed when trying to buy Thrimfeld from them in a different campaign). Money is just not that important for immortals.

And about the liberation of Sarnford by Adunabar/Tharbad. I paid Adunabar to attack the elves, but there was 3 stacks all including Mithlond Guards hanging around Sarnford so it seemed impossible to me that they would ever liberate it. I bought Threeways then and I think Lastbridge, to gift it to the Elves, hoping that they would change their capital, but they didn't. Started a new campaign then.

[Wambat]

I suspect the Elves require large payments for settlements because they generally have a very large bank balance. I am curious as to why you would be willing to buy Lune, but not Sarnford. Personally, I do not like to spend more than 10k on a settlement unless there is some very compelling reason to do so. I would be fine with Hollowbold safely stuck behind an Elven Sarnford; I would just use it to pump out agents.

[webba84]

Or migrate the whole population and then crank the taxes up to very high.

[Wambat]

Or migrate the whole population and then crank the taxes up to very high.

Well, we are talking about a Hollowbold stuck behind an Elven Sarnford, with the knowledge that the Elves will probably not allow your Dwarven units to cross their territory, so I don't think you could move the population. You could deplete the population via high taxes.

[Dáin II]

I suspect the Elves require large payments for settlements because they generally have a very large bank balance. I am curious as to why you would be willing to buy Lune, but not Sarnford. Personally, I do not like to spend more than 10k on a settlement unless there is some very compelling reason to do so. I would be fine with Hollowbold safely stuck behind an Elven Sarnford; I would just use it to pump out agents.

I usually don't pay more than 10000 either. In my Dale campaign, the elves bribed Thrimfeld from someone and when I wanted it from them they wouldn't settle for anything below 25000, while with the dwarves, who also have a large bank balance, it seemed easier to get settlements for 10000.

Well, usually I play those two western starting provinces isolated from each other, so I didn't feel I need Lune that much and gifted it to the elves in the first place. In my dwarven and elven campaigns I always tend to push the other non-mannish faction a bit. Then I read your previous comment and thought that I wanted Lune back to be able to move troops north and south. Since my bank balance was high and I had this previously mentioned experience with the elves only settling for high offers I didn't really bother and offered 30000. Sarnford they made their capital, so I couldn't buy it. Would have liked to do that though. I like the idea of pumping out agents when Hollowbold is isolated, seems like the best alternative.

[Dáin II]

Found some more things to add while continuing my Dominion of Dwarves campaign.

First, the tanneries industry armour upgrade doesn't work for the Dwarves unlike written in the guide. I think it did in a previous version though. The consequence is, that horses are often the more attractive specialization, when both are available. They seem to generate more money per settlement traded with than livestock (check which resource is traded with more settlements to make a decision).

Second, the Dwarven Weaponsmiths city specialization is not very useful in settlements close to your homelands (e.g. Dale), since you will get full armour and weapon upgrade by retraining your hirelings in Dwarven provices (after the mithril armory was built this started working as far as I remember, was a bit surprised though since I thought the upgrade was only for standard units, but it makes sense to me they get it there, very useful).

[gasas]

Mithril armory doesn't stack with weaponsmiths?

[Dáin II]

The dwarves only get +3 upgrades unlike mannish factions, who can stack up +1 and +2 upgrades by combining the necessary industry and city development buildings, so there are no stack up effects.

Dwarves get +3 armour in their homelands (for all units: dwarves, hirelings, mercenaries) after the infrastructure is built, as well as +3 weapon (for dwarves and hirelings, not mercenaries).
In non-homelands, where the weaponsmith specialization is built, hirelings will be produced with +3 weapon as well.
Taking Erebor and City of Dale as examples, the consequence is that it makes more sense to go for the trade specialization building in Dale, since you would most likely send your recruits to Erebor anyway in order to provide them with an armour upgrade. As they also get the weapon upgrade there, it doesn't really make sense to produce them with this upgrade in Dale.

[webba84]

IIRC the Hirelings are not supposed to get the weapon upgrade from Mithril Armouries (or, as you say, the Dwarven Weaponsmiths aren't very useful), but will have to double check to be sure on that.

[Dáin II]

They are useful, just not as much close to the homelands. Wouldn't build them in Dale or Swanfleet in this version, but well in Rhun, Khand or Mordor.

Was wondering about that issue too though since the building description of the mithril armory only says standard units get the weapon upgrade.