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Thread: Authentic City Names

  1. #1

    Default Authentic City Names

    Inspired by the "Better City Names" mod for Rome II by SilentResident, I present: Authentic City Names!

    What it does:
    This mod is pretty much what it says on the tin: better, more authentic city names for the campaign map and battles. While trying to come up with suggestions for Augustusng's "Authentic Faction Names" (which this mod should work well with), I got interested in the names for the cities themselves, and so I started trying to see how many of them were accurate. For the Grand Campaign, most of them were, but a number used names that were either too old or too new, not appropriate for the faction, designated a more minor city, or described an area rather than a specific city. Names in The Last Roman were a little more difficult, as it appears CA used a number of modern names that would still have been Latin or weren't appropriate for the culture. And finally, with AoC naming was more difficult, as it appears CA used a number of modern names that would still have been Latin or weren't appropriate for the culture. Unlike the previous two mods, most names changed, so instead of listing all of them, I used the appropriate language for the faction. The list of changes and my explanations for each of them is below (new additions and updates in bold):

    Grand Campaign:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Eudaemon -> Adan: Arabic/Semitic version of Greek name
    Duin -> Dvin: Armenian version of Latin name
    Arbela -> Arbaira: Sassanid version of Greek name
    Ctesiphon -> Tesifon: Sassanid version of Greek name
    Meshan -> Bahmanshir: Actual port city for the region of Meshan
    Tuesis -> Uerteru: Brythonic/Celtic version of Greek name
    Kotais->Tsikhegoji: Georgian name for Archaeopolis, actual capital of Lazica
    Apulum -> Balgrad: Early Slavic name
    Angulus -> Treva: Angulus seems to be anachronistic or possibly a medieval invention, whereas Treva (ancient Hamburg) is an attested historical site
    Aregelia -> Leufana: Leufana is described as a major settlement and likely capital of the Langobards
    Oium -> Aujum: Germanic name (probably from Goths, but should work for Venedi)
    Gothiscandza -> Rugium: Due to errors in Ptolemy's maps, it is believed Rugium (Rugion) was further west
    Rugion -> Laciburgium: See above
    Nitrahwa -> Singona: See above
    Abarshahr -> Nishapur: Actual capital of Arbashahr (region)
    Merv -> Marw: Sassanid version of Bactrian name
    Harmosia -> Hormuz: Sassanid version of Greek name
    Phra -> Zaranj: Actual capital of Sagastan (region)
    Pura -> Para: Matches Sassanid name of province (Paradan)
    Ecbatana -> Ekbatan: Sassanid version of Greek name
    Ganzaga -> Ganzak: Sassanid (from original Median name) version of Greek name
    Rhaga -> Rag: Sassanid version of Greek name
    Nisibis -> Nasibin: Sassanid version of Greek name
    Arheimar->Kyevu: Since it's roughly in the area of Kyiv/Kiev, I'm using the Old East Slavic version of the name
    Leopolis -> Turris: Attested as a city given to the Antes
    Palteskja->Poletesku: Reconstructed Proto-Slavic version of Norse name
    Kariskos->Kurisku: Reconstructed Proto-Slavic version of Greek name
    Moramar->Murom: Slavic version of Norse name
    Tamousiga->Amaqdul: Berber version of the nearby large port of Essaouira
    Cydamus->Adamis: Berber version of the Latin name
    Bolghar->Palkhar: Chuvash (a language closer to Proto-Turkic) version of Latin name
    Sarai->Atil: Earlier Turkic version of Mongol city
    Samandar->Balanjar: Capital of Hunnic tribe that settled in the area around 370CE
    Hrefnesholt->Hrabanashulta: Reconstruction in Proto-Norse of Anglo-Saxon Hræfnsholt (trans. "raven's wood")
    Hafn->Hleithraz: Reconstructed Proto-Norse name for modern Lejre, site of a large Danish settlement
    Alabu->Alhsburgz: Reconstructed Proto-Norse version of modern Aalborg (trans. "temple-fort")

    The Last Roman:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Lemonum -> Pictavium: Latin version of Celtic name for modern Poitiers
    Narbonne -> Narbona: Anachronistic name
    Nimes -> Nemausus: Anachronistic name
    Vapincum -> Eburodunum: At the time, this was likely a more prominent city
    Nikaia -> Nicaea: Latin version of Greek name
    Vienne -> Lugdunum: Modern-day Lyon, the actual capital of the Burgundians
    Illici -> Dianium: At the time, this was likely a more prominent city
    Aeminium -> Conimbriga: At the time, this was likely a more prominent city
    Astorga -> Asturica: Anachronistic name
    Tolentum -> Toletum: I don't know why CA added the "n" so I removed it
    Rusaddir -> Mlila: Berber name for a city owned by the Mauri
    Pomaria -> Tlemsan: Anachronistic name
    Cirta -> Constantina: CA had it right in the GC, not sure why they changed it back.
    Patavium -> Tarvisium: At the time, this may have been a more prominent city, as Patavium had been laid waste by the Huns
    Lissus -> Olcinium: At the time, this may have been a more prominent city

    Age of Charlemagne:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Franks: Old French and Old High German if I could find it, and apart from a few here and there, I avoided Latin
    Langobards: Latin for the most part, as the Langobardic language (derived from Proto-Germanic) had essentially died out by then
    British Isles: Anglo-Saxon for England, Old Irish/Scottish/Brythonic for Scotland and Ireland
    Slavs: Old Slavic or Old Church Slavonic where I could find it
    Brittany: Breton
    Andalusia: Arabic
    Theme of Sicily: Greek

    Downloads:
    Grand Campaign: Steam | Mediafire
    The Last Roman: Steam | Mediafire
    Age of Charlemagne: Steam | Mediafire

    Sources:



    DISCLAIMER:
    This is for entertainment, as I am by no means a historian, archaeologist, or etymologist. These names came largely from online research, and as such could be subject to errors or biases found there. Neither changing a name nor leaving the vanilla version is meant to be a slight to any culture or nationality. That being said, if you have constructive criticism, feel free to let me know here and/or in the comments on Steam.
    Last edited by zombieflanders; February 29, 2016 at 03:37 PM. Reason: Updated GC version

  2. #2

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Very cool! Indeed it should work well with my faction names mod. Good job finding these. I imagine it's almost impossible to find some of them.

    EDIT: Oh, one suggestion. The region names can also be changed (the regions text file of course), so if you want more work to do, I'm sure there are some anachronistic or otherwise inaccurate region names too...
    Last edited by Augustusng; February 17, 2016 at 11:43 AM.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Very cool, you have done us a great service.

    (Any chance of a non steam link?)
    The guy who used to test DeI and FotE on Mac.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Quote Originally Posted by Augustusng View Post
    Very cool! Indeed it should work well with my faction names mod. Good job finding these. I imagine it's almost impossible to find some of them.
    Thanks! Like I said, I have you to thank for inspiring me.
    EDIT: Oh, one suggestion. The region names can also be changed (the regions text file of course), so if you want more work to do, I'm sure there are some anachronistic or otherwise inaccurate region names too...
    Waaay ahead of you, man. When I was doing my research, it turned out that CA's individual regions actually matched up pretty well with the Diocletian and Constantinian provincial reforms. I got real excited, updated regions.loc with basically the entire lists from the the Notitia Dignitatum (for the WRE and ERE)and Sharestaniha i Eranshahr (for the Sassanids). But when I loaded it up...nothing. Unfortunately, as it turns out, for some reason changing it does absolutely nothing. I asked a question about it (and a related issue) over at the official forums, but I haven't heard from anyone in response. Which sucks, because it definitely works in Rome II. I've still got the file ready to go if CA ever gets back to me, but until then it's just a dream.
    Quote Originally Posted by Delicate Strawberry View Post
    Very cool, you have done us a great service.

    (Any chance of a non steam link?)
    Sure, I'll put up a link when I get back to my personal PC.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Hm, yeah. Surprising that changing the region names doesn't work in Attila. Well that's disappointing. There's always something like that with text files, isn't there? I've run into more than one bizarre issue like this trying to mod text files. I imagine that this one in particular will be a bigger problem for those overhaul mods that change the time period.

    And yeah, that's also how I decided to call the Roman emergent factions dioceses, since they all (mostly) matched up to that system geographically.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Mediafire links added.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Hmm, the files don't seem to be changing anything. Any ideas?
    The guy who used to test DeI and FotE on Mac.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Quote Originally Posted by Delicate Strawberry View Post
    Hmm, the files don't seem to be changing anything. Any ideas?
    They're a direct copy of the Steam version. I changed the name of the table so it wouldn't interfere with other mods, so maybe changing it back would work?

  9. #9

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Seems the GC version works now, but the other two still don't. Any ideas?

    Maybe an all in one mod?
    The guy who used to test DeI and FotE on Mac.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Sure, I'll upload an AIO version to both Steam and Mediafire, probably later today.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Thank you, much appreciated.
    The guy who used to test DeI and FotE on Mac.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Can confirm now that they all work individually, but not together.
    The guy who used to test DeI and FotE on Mac.

  13. #13
    Magister Militum Flavius Aetius's Avatar δούξ θρᾳκήσιου
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    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Apulum -> Balgrad: Early Slavic name
    Why? The Slavs weren't even important until the late 6th century.

    Check out this map for important Roman cities and their names (it is missing some, like Aurelianum (Orleans), etc):

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._ca_400_AD.png

    Illici -> Dianium: At the time, this was likely a more prominent city
    Never heard of Dianium. Portus Illicitanus gets several mentions in the 4th-6th centuries. It was the site of Majorian's invasion fleet in 468, which was promptly set fire to when Gaiseric bribed the city's inhabitants.

    Kotais -> Kutaisi: Georgian version of Greek name
    Hmm... okay. I prefer the Greco-Latin names though considering so much of the region of Georgia/Armenia was pretty Romanized at the time. AFAIK their cultural identities redeveloped in the late 6th century.
    Last edited by Magister Militum Flavius Aetius; February 23, 2016 at 08:46 AM.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Quote Originally Posted by Delicate Strawberry View Post
    Can confirm now that they all work individually, but not together.
    That's probably because all the mods have the same table name. I'll fix that tonight.
    Quote Originally Posted by Magister Militum Flavius Aetius View Post
    Why? The Slavs weren't even important until the late 6th century.
    With the Slavic Nations DLC coming out, I think it works a bit better. I'm considering changing it back (or possibly to something else) though.
    Check out this map for important Roman cities and their names (it is missing some, like Aurelianum (Orleans), etc)
    The problem isn't really Roman names, at least not for the Grand Campaign.
    Never heard of Dianium. Portus Illicitanus gets several mentions in the 4th-6th centuries. It was the site of Majorian's invasion fleet in 468, which was promptly set fire to when Gaiseric bribed the city's inhabitants.
    Interestingly enough, Dianium is on the map you linked. In any case, it's important to note that TLR is set more than half a century later.
    Hmm... okay. I prefer the Greco-Latin names though considering so much of the region of Georgia/Armenia was pretty Romanized at the time. AFAIK their cultural identities redeveloped in the late 6th century.
    I tried to reflect an actual change in national identity that was going on in the 5th-6th centuries, particularly in Georgia and Armenia.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Quote Originally Posted by zombieflanders View Post
    That's probably because all the mods have the same table name. I'll fix that tonight.
    Thank you, appreciate it a lot.
    The guy who used to test DeI and FotE on Mac.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Quote Originally Posted by Delicate Strawberry View Post
    Thank you, appreciate it a lot.
    I uploaded new files with changed table names for the TLR and AOC versions to Mediafire. Try downloading them again and let me know if they work.
    Last edited by zombieflanders; February 24, 2016 at 06:18 PM.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Quote Originally Posted by zombieflanders View Post
    I uploaded new files with changed table names for the TLR and AOC versions to Mediafire. Try downloading them again and let me know if they work.
    That's it now, thanks a lot.
    The guy who used to test DeI and FotE on Mac.

  18. #18
    Eldgrimr's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    The earliest form of old French has not been documented until the 800s, so why not use Old High German for the Frankish provinces instead?

  19. #19

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Quote Originally Posted by ZombieZleeping View Post
    The earliest form of old French has not been documented until the 800s, so why not use Old High German for the Frankish provinces instead?
    I think I tried for Old High German where I could find it, but unfortunately I didn't mark which ones were OHG and which were OF in my notes. Let me know which ones should be in OHG and I'll make the changes.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Authentic City Names

    Added/updated for the GC:

    Kotais->Tsikhegoji: Georgian name for Archaeopolis, actual capital of Lazica
    Palteskja->Poletesku: Reconstructed Proto-Slavic version of Norse name
    Kariskos->Kurisku: Reconstructed Proto-Slavic version of Greek name
    Moramar->Murom: Slavic version of Norse name
    Tamousiga->Amaqdul: Berber version of the nearby large port of Essaouira
    Cydamus->Adamis: Berber version of the Latin name
    Bolghar->Palkhar: Chuvash (a language closer to Proto-Turkic) version of Latin name
    Sarai->Atil: Earlier Turkic version of Mongol city
    Samandar->Balanjar: Capital of Hunnic tribe that settled in the area around 370CE
    Hrefnesholt->Hrabanashulta: Reconstruction in Proto-Norse of Anglo-Saxon Hræfnsholt (trans. "raven's wood")
    Hafn->Hleithraz: Reconstructed Proto-Norse name for modern Lejre, site of a large Danish settlement
    Alabu->Alhsburgz: Reconstructed Proto-Norse version of modern Aalborg (trans. "temple fort")
    Arheimar->Kyevu: Since it's roughly in the area of Kyiv/Kiev, I'm using the Old East Slavic version of the name

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