Heavy cavalry against trolls

**ThorHa** · December 12, 2015, 08:28 AM

I had to fight a battle that I dislike most as an Elven player (due to unavoidable losses) - a full Mordor stack with 2 troll units, 3 troll catapults and 3 ballistae with me as the attacker unfortunately.

So I set up a specific HE stack for the task - all archers and 4 heavy cavalry (Eldar lancers) plus General. While the archers made short work of the 2 troll units and had no problem (0 losses) with all the other units anyway, the cavalry circled around and charged the siege units. While I made sure to withdraw the cavalry and repeat the charges, sometimes melee could not be avoided due to my attention being elsewhere etc.

But I found the result pretty astonishing - in fact without the intervention of any archer unit the 5 cav units annihilated the 3 troll catapult units alone (the ballistae as well, but that was expected). With low to moderate losses, about 35 figures of the 193 involved (42 Eldar lancers each and the general with 25).

I just want to know if the Eldar lancers are that much exceptional or if I could repeat such an attack successfully with heavy cavalry from other factions as well? If so, which ones would be comparable?

Regards,
Thorsten

**LuckyPistol** · December 12, 2015, 09:05 AM

Actually the trolls in the Troll Catapult unit aren't as strong as even mountain or cave trolls.

I'm not even sure if they have more than 2 hitpoints, but you could always check the unit files to see their stats.

**ThorHa** · December 12, 2015, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by LuckyPistol

Actually the trolls in the Troll Catapult unit aren't as strong as even mountain or cave trolls.

I'm not even sure if they have more than 2 hitpoints, but you could always check the unit files to see their stats.

Hongas Royal Military Academy says 5 hitpoints? But thanks for the answer.

Regards,
Thorsten

**Joseignacio** · December 14, 2015, 01:07 AM

Don't know really how many hitpoints but for sure they are very much weaker.

**Flinn** · December 14, 2015, 07:42 AM

indeed they are weaker; I remember battles in which I could take off 1 unit of troll catapult with only one unit of Westfold riders (armed with AP axes, medium stats)

I forgot to mention I'm relating to submods, so maybe it's not so in the Vanilla TATW

**ThorHa** · December 14, 2015, 07:52 AM

Originally Posted by Flinn

indeed they are weaker; I remember battles in which I could take off 1 unit of troll catapult with only one unit of Westfold riders (armed with AP axes, medium stats)

I forgot to mention I'm relating to submods, so maybe it's not so in the Vanilla TATW

Anyway, thanks for the answers :-). I don´t know how often I avoided attacks on such stacks in the couse of my games - but it was quite often. So I found a pretty easy solution for that years old problem.

Regards,
Thorsten

**DrDragun** · December 14, 2015, 02:30 PM

Even the stronger trolls perform pretty poorly against cavalry charges. Their spread formation allows the cavalry to envelop them and roll many hit chances. Especially from the rear since trolls rely so much on the defense stat.

**Roma_Victrix** · December 14, 2015, 04:09 PM

Echoing everyone else, yeah, the catapult trolls aren't up to snuff when compared to the cave and mountain trolls, and certainly are not on the same level as the Olog-hai. Your cavalry would have taken much greater losses. There are few cavalry units in Middle Earth that can charge and withstand the defensive measures of such trolls:

^ Your typical cave troll after decimating a hundred of your soldiers.

**Ngugi** · December 14, 2015, 04:40 PM

The trolls by the catapult is slightly weaker in all regards to their 'infantry' counterparts [from TATW 3.2:

Code:

type             Mordor Catapult
... stat_pri_armour  6, 20, 0, flesh

as seen (the order of the numbers is Armour, Defence and Shield):

Code:

type             Mountain Trolls
... stat_pri_armour  6, 23, 0, flesh


type             Battle Trolls (a.k.a Olog-Hai)
... stat_pri_armour  9, 27, 0, metal


type             Cave Trolls
... stat_pri_armour  7, 24, 0, flesh


type             Snow Trolls
... stat_pri_armour  8, 22, 0, flesh

Also the Troll Catapult is slightly fewer in numbers, making them easier to take out.

**ThorHa** · December 15, 2015, 04:52 AM

Originally Posted by Roma_Victrix

^ Your typical cave troll after decimating a hundred of your soldiers.

As a predominantly Elven player I am never mad at trolls. I only see them in the form of dead, arrow riddled, corpses littered througout the battlefield :-).

As an aside - even in the worst case (a full Olog Hai unit having reached my lines because I was careless) I never experienced ""100 dead". If you know your trade you can abuse the extreme spacing of a fleeing unit of which some elements still have to fight in those cases.

Regrads,
Thorsten