Totalheadaches final review!

[Totalheadache]

Attila fails, well the bad points outweigh the good! Which is a damm shame as it's a game I could really enjoy.

This will be short and to the point as some of you know I dont mince my words. Now I have tried this on vanilla and Radious and some other mods but it boils down to the engine and sieges and the C.A.I in campaign. First off the A.I seems reluctant to siege even when it has the advantage of several stacks, you can often see this when for example you play as the Alamans per say and take the northern Italian towns. How many people have faced sieges from the Huns?

Sorry to say but that is in essence the game...you are trying to stave off the Huns hordes.

But this aside when you are faced with large stacks it becomes a lagfest/mosh pit at the entrance. Ok with smaller armies this isnt a problem but I will give you an example. Playing Radious mod I got to turn 60 or so with the Ebdanians, the Saxons attack London with 2 stacks.

I am weakish in infantry but have archers n javelins so makes for an epic siege. They break through and I defend...all good until the engine cant cope with that many men. Sure I can play it out but its less than impressive.

P.S and know enough about pc's/overclocking and building them to know it's the engine not my rig. Unless you are telling me I need 980ti x2 to run the game @1920x1200...then I'd say sorry x off am not upgrading for one game when I can play all others fine (mgs5/witcher3).

So I will continue to play Rome2, which actually with mods isnt a bad game but cant see myself playing Attila or getting Total war Warhammer until something is done about the sieges/optimisation/C.A.I. I did like the units in Attila, the campaign map, the family tree etc so I am annoyed with CA that they cant admit this needs a beefier engine.

X yrs of playing total wars and other games tells me this is fact!

Otherwise I can see Warhammer being potentially great fun but let down by the engine.

[pyj99]

So I will continue to play Rome2, which actually with mods isnt a bad game.

It was worth waiting 2 years to hear that from TH

Made my day

[Totalheadache]

It was worth waiting 2 years to hear that from TH

Made my day

I should have perhaps amended the thread title to include "current state of affairs with Totalwar games". Oh wait you must be one of those people who thinks Warhammer is going to be amazing....? You know what I strongly doubt it.

When effects from magical spells etc cause huge lag in framerates you'll remember this thread.

[Fanest]

I find it funny that ppl still praise RTW2 over Attila and always find their arguments kind of cheesy. Apart from optimization which can be a problem for some PC builds they all fall apart pretty quickly.

[Totalheadache]

I find it funny that ppl still praise RTW2 over Attila and always find their arguments kind of cheesy. Apart from optimization which can be a problem for some PC builds they all fall apart pretty quickly.

I havent given any arguements per say...if you call better framerates cheesy ok.

And "some pc builds" what are you on about..? Unless you are saying somehow people can play Attila siege/lag free? We all know that's rubbish.


p.s my current build is 4ghz corei7 970 gpu@1920x1200 all under H20 so pray tell and enlighten me with your build and how it can do 2-3 stack sieges lag free? Am all ears...i'd bet you £500+ you cant prove what you say..

Next!

p.p.s we all know Attila runs worse so that's a very very feeble excuse...and if anything backs up what I say even more.

The point am making is it's so bad no pc build I have seen can run the game lag free....(Atilla. Rome2 isnt so bad, nor was Shogun2 nor was Napoleon...you see the point am making). Unless ofc you can prove it then I will eat humble pie but after 2 yrs and looking at people with sli 980ti etc I am 90% sure the engine is a turd).

[Aeneas Veneratio]

That review is rubbish, I have had 40vs40 siege battles with no lag, which seems to be the primary issue you focus on. The main problem I have with Attila is the crazy fluctuation with food production, going from +500 to -200 in just one turn and then back to +500 the turn after. Other than that, the rest is fixable by the use of mods.

[badbomb]

So your entire thing is the sieges aren't often enough, which i find its probably because you have full/nearly full stacks in cities, and the game lags for you? i get very little/no lag, sure i dont play on max settings but its still relatively high for a laptop. I love when people say mods fix the game what you mean to say is the mods make the game more manageable for you.

[Fanest]

I really don't see any point for this thread here unless u feel that your opinion is super special, u see we already have this sticky one here: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ussion-Thread/

Beside that game has been out for 6 months and pretty much everybody who cared enough to try it did so already (free weekend not so long ago) or watched some video to get the impressions ...

However if u need to know i got radeon 6850 and amd phenom II X4 965 (5 years old PC) and i run the game at 30 fps on min-medium settings, on large unit size i got no lag in 2v2. As for sieges on leg dif in sp i got quite a few of them but since for the most part i defend only with garrison there is never too many units on the screen. That said Attila is more demanding but it also looks better than rtw2 and as i said before optimization wouldn't hurt after all CA games are known for poor optimization. Mybe tomorrow with new patch we get some improvements., we will see.

[yupper]

so pray tell and enlighten me with your build and how it can do 2-3 stack sieges lag free? Am all ears...i'd bet you £500+ you cant prove what you say..

Don't play on max graphic settings. I play on "quality" graphic settings, and tune down to performance on rare occasions. That allows me to "do 2-3 stack sieges lag free."

You are welcome. And I prefer my "£500" (or more/"+") via WU. Please send to

Those-Who-Know-How-To-Adjust-Graphic-Settings
666 Sinceyoudidntspecifywhatgraphicsetting Street
Liguria, Western Roman Empire
513513513

[Sharpe]

I can play with 10k troops zero lag, 15k slightly laggy, and with 20k quite noticeable.

[Totalheadache]

I am not playing on max graphics and sorry all these "i can play it comments" are quite frankly bs unless you can post me a vid or proof. Have seen numerous comments from people with even more expensive rigs than mine ala £2000+ who say it runs poorly.

So am just not buying "it runs ok". The point of this thread was for me just to say why I think Attilla fails...and its a shame because it only really fails in this aspect which has been a common flaw over the yrs and actually got me into rig building to try and get rid of these siege lags and its happened on previous titles when I have way surpassed the min requirements.

Therefore short of someone showing me clear proof it runs ok, I have done enough testing to know what's what.

But just to see I will run the same siege with lowered settings, which by the way will look pretty ugly (and yeah I dont mind this), and see if I can get a smooth siege. If I can I'll even post a screenshot to show what needs to be done...

P.S So dont get me wrong I have put in the time+money on this, and to get the negative responses here is quite annoying as I have been a big supporter of the franchise yet I feel the games arent getting due justice because of CA economic decisions.

And open battles arent nearly as bad. It's just the gateway where all the units collide. In fact I saw other people talk about "terrible unit collision". It's just a real downer to an otherwise pretty good game.

I truly believe we deserve better. If you guys want to settle for whats on offer by all means....but some of us are disgruntled and disappointed.

And Yupper "Its pretty obvious I know what I am talking about re settings etc, I no doubt know more about getting performance right on games then you will ever dream of, tutti aposto, ciao, -£500 for you).

[Totalheadache]

That review is rubbish, I have had 40vs40 siege battles with no lag, which seems to be the primary issue you focus on. The main problem I have with Attila is the crazy fluctuation with food production, going from +500 to -200 in just one turn and then back to +500 the turn after. Other than that, the rest is fixable by the use of mods.

Have seen enough of your posts over the yrs to know you talk complete rubbish...I have a very good memory

[yupper]

And Yupper "Its pretty obvious I know what I am talking about re settings etc

No, it's not "obvious", since you did not (and still has not) indicate what "settings" you normally run the game at and did not "talk" about it at all in your original post--so there is no way that it would be "obvious" you know what you are talking about "re settings." For that to be "obvious", you actually have to mention it.

[Totalheadache]

No, it's not "obvious", since you did not (and still has not) indicate what "settings" you normally run the game at and did not "talk" about it at all in your original post--so there is no way that it would be "obvious" you know what you are talking about "re settings." For that to be "obvious", you actually have to mention it.

Yes it is as i mentioned building pcs..overclocking and i talk about other games. Plus 4000 posts here might lead you to conclusion I have seen my fair share of Totalwars and how they run...(oh and framerates//lag/optimisation). That sound like someone who doesnt know how to choose the right settings?

And yeah I played the same siege again just now. Same thing happens my 4 spearman and several axeman n woodrunners form a defensive wall and the enemy form a bottleneck in the gateway. Only zoomed in it is bad. Yes I could sit back and wait it out as tbh nothing much happens but surely part of the fun is going close up and seeing the action.

Frankly at 20fps or so and med/high settings it's not an amazing sight.

So I'll wait till CA improves the engine and ignore new total war releases if based on the same engine. Perhaps it does need a modern cpu and sli 980ti? But at the moment I am not building a new rig...although when cpu's hit 5ghz plus I will...

[Garensterz]

There are three huge game breaking pronlems that Attila is known for, it's badly optimized, idiotic siege AI's, and CAI not building siege equipment in the mid to late game. But I still think Attila is superior than Rome 2, because of the added content that has been presented, and a bit of polishing from some of Rome 2's issues.

[Huberto]

Other than that, the rest is fixable by the use of mods.

Which one fixes the lunatic CAI?

[Fanest]

Which one fixes the lunatic CAI?

I find Attila CAI much better than passive RTW2 where i cant even find a challenging campaign - once u get 4 provinces u basically won the game

[barry12]

Campaign AI is fundamentally flawed, 200+ hrs game play, maybe 1 - 2 sieges defended, and see the CAI do some lamentably stupid and inexplicable things.

Therefore, regardless of how good any of the other features (there are loads), the game has failed at the first hurdle.

All DLCs and patches should have been held off until they fix this one fundamental and gamebreaking flaw. Medieval 3 is too good and beautiful an idea for this terrible engine and this frankly offensive CAI.

Shogun 2 had much better CAI. Fact. Why have we gone back years when things should be getting better?

[Totalheadache]

Campaign AI is fundamentally flawed, 200+ hrs game play, maybe 1 - 2 sieges defended, and see the CAI do some lamentably stupid and inexplicable things.

Therefore, regardless of how good any of the other features (there are loads), the game has failed at the first hurdle.

All DLCs and patches should have been held off until they fix this one fundamental and gamebreaking flaw. Medieval 3 is too good and beautiful an idea for this terrible engine and this frankly offensive CAI.

Shogun 2 had much better CAI. Fact. Why have we gone back years when things should be getting better?

I agree but I was actually being kind in my mini review as playing with Radious I did notice an improvement but until I got to this siege it just took all the fun out of it.

Can see the same thing happening with Warhammer. Whilst improving on some things (I like things from all the recent games) they are for me ignoring the one key component which is the engine.

I have actually been saying this since medieval 2 kingdoms days which is when I first noticed the optimisation issues and have even messaged people at CA, they simply choose to ignore it or just arent given the funds. (plus yeah 2nd to this major problem is the C.A.I which as you say is idiotic).

So where does this leave us?

Just waiting on seeing what horrors are in store for us with Warhammer! I mean surely if it's the same engine it's gonna fail as well...?

[Humble Warrior]

I agree but I was actually being kind in my mini review as playing with Radious I did notice an improvement but until I got to this siege it just took all the fun out of it.

Can see the same thing happening with Warhammer. Whilst improving on some things (I like things from all the recent games) they are for me ignoring the one key component which is the engine.

I have actually been saying this since medieval 2 kingdoms days which is when I first noticed the optimisation issues and have even messaged people at CA, they simply choose to ignore it or just arent given the funds. (plus yeah 2nd to this major problem is the C.A.I which as you say is idiotic).

So where does this leave us?

Just waiting on seeing what horrors are in store for us with Warhammer! I mean surely if it's the same engine it's gonna fail as well...?

Fail with us, but not the children it will be pointed at.