v 0.35 Open Test Pack - Last Updated 4/2/2016

[MajorTom]

Ah, no, moved EP on top... Will fix that to check (previous versions seemed fine, but, I see that you did some changes which is probably why!).

[MajorTom]

That fixed things, and I found as I played more aggressively, that my treasury did indeed dry up, so maybe I overestimated the potential of the WRE economy...

[juanplay]

Would it be possible to give edicts to the white huns and also include them to the list of nomadic factions that reappear from time to time?

[Augustusng]

That fixed things, and I found as I played more aggressively, that my treasury did indeed dry up, so maybe I overestimated the potential of the WRE economy...

So what do you think? Is corruption at a good spot then?

Would it be possible to give edicts to the white huns and also include them to the list of nomadic factions that reappear from time to time?

Only settled factions can have edicts. I am thinking about allowing the White Huns to settle, and if we did that, we'd give them edicts of course.

As far as reappearing from time to time, only the Huns do that, because of their preservation (doomstack ) script. We'd have to write a separate script for the White Huns to do something like that. However... in EP we did allow for horde factions to re-emerge from some of the desolate regions on the map, but that means you'd have to settle those regions and have a rebellion.

[MajorTom]

Yes, corruption is good, especially with the drastically increased unit costs for the two major empires. One thing I did notice is that the AI builds Mercenaries and troops recruited from hoards exclusively, no units from barracks. I have never seen that before, I wonder what it is doing to their economy with such high maintenance costs?

[Augustusng]

Yes, corruption is good, especially with the drastically increased unit costs for the two major empires. One thing I did notice is that the AI builds Mercenaries and troops recruited from hoards exclusively, no units from barracks. I have never seen that before, I wonder what it is doing to their economy with such high maintenance costs?

That's bizarre. If anything, the AI has lower upkeep costs. I don't see why they wouldn't recruit units from barracks. Hmmm... I'll probably have to play some turns as a few factions and see what's up.

[Jurand of Cracow]

Yeah, we should work on something for Honorius, Arcadius, and Bahram. They've all got negative traits like that, and the best option is too often just getting rid of them. Prometheus may be working on something more interesting for them...

Are you sure you're loading FotE above the EP test pack? Garrisons are fine for me, though they are very depleted on the first turn. I can't fix that without adding each unit individually in the startpos, which I'm not going to do, at least not soon.

And sure. I'll take another look at the corruption values and tweak them a bit more. After that, I think I'll release this as an update to the mod tomorrow. Also with that fix for the Franks and other factions with the Roman unit recruitment trait.

I play Sassanids on VH/N, with FotE5.2 and EP0.3.

Some observations:
- FotE/EP provide for a great experience, I clearly see benefits of the features (EP: building changes, garrisoned armies cost 500, fertility levels, edicts, traits etc.)
- the Sassanids are really strong, I find their faction bonuses: Irrigation (+1 fertility) Puppet state (+100% tribute), and +10% research to be very powerful;
- diplomacy is easy for the Sassanids – ERE broke the non-agression pact, but did not attack;
- my vassals indeed declared war on each other – but I don’t find it much ahistorical, it was indeed problematic for a great power to steer among local ambitions;
- I had no problems with garrisons – they were depleted at the beginning, but their numbers seem to be ok;
- with the need for food I find Camels OP: they provide more food than Wheat farm already at 6th level of fertility. With Global Warming coming, it pays off to build Wheat only in Asorisan (i.e. Mezopotamia), in the rest Camels feed the whole population. Also Horses and Sheeps provide crazy amount of money at higher levels (I’ll post an Excel spreadsheet showing it).
- with battle victories and proper management Bahram IV evolved quite fast to „Bahram IV” stage, where his traits are not so harmful for the state; but suddenly he died at the age of 48, just for natural reasons;
- White Huns
--- were really tough to catch, and desolated Marv despite my efforts;
--- even when they were crippled to 4 units, they managed to go to another province and recruit 15 mercenaries. I killed their king and the heir – but they kept on fighting;
--- their Spies killed my heir and 4 other generals – it was like AI went on killing spree, each turn one failed attempt and one successful.
--- strangely enough, it’s easier to auto-resolve battles than to play they yourself (and I did switch from VH to N, as Dresden keep on advising). I don’t know why, but White Huns horse archers got big buffs for armour and morale. They were like tanks, with endless morale. I’ll report further on the experience with other nations.

Some little questions, maybe you can answer tchem outright:
- are the wifes’ influences of the Other Grandees also counted towards Dominon? I have Dominon of 63%, my family influence is of 630, the other aristocrats count 270, so there’s like 100 lacking? I imagine they have also hidden children since I could offer a Daughter I didn’t have for a marriage with my vasal.
- longevity of characters – how long do they live? Is it hard-coded? Bahram died at th age of 48, but most of the other characters live long.
- is there any difference if an army has Integrity of 20%, 50% and of 100%? I could not see any differences in speed, morale etc.
- The Great Wall of Gorgan (on the south-east shore of the Caspian Sea) – does it have an in-game effect, or it’s just a visual cookie? The horde of White Huns passed it freely, while the whole point of this wall was to prevent such incidents.

[Augustusng]

Yes, corruption is good, especially with the drastically increased unit costs for the two major empires. One thing I did notice is that the AI builds Mercenaries and troops recruited from hoards exclusively, no units from barracks. I have never seen that before, I wonder what it is doing to their economy with such high maintenance costs?

You're using FotE, right? Make sure you have the latest version of FotE (March 30). With previous versions, there was a bug preventing normal recruitment for many factions.

- with the need for food I find Camels OP: they provide more food food than Wheat already at 6th level of fertility. With Global Warming coming, it pays off to build Wheat only in Asorisan (i.e. Mezopotamia), in the rest Camels feed the whole population. Also Horses and Sheeps provide crazy amount of money at higher levels (I’ll post an Excel spreadsheet showing it).
--- strangely enough, it’s easier to auto-resolve battles than to play they yourself. I don’t know why, but White Huns horse archers got big buffs for Armour and morale. They were like tanks, with endless morale. I’ll report further on the experience with other nations.

Some little questions, maybe you can answer tchem outright:
- are the wifes’ influences of the Other Grandees also counted towards Dominon? I have Dominon of 63%, my family influence is of 630, the other aristocrats count 270, so there’s like 100 lacking? I imagine they have also hidden children since I could offer a Daughter I didn’t have for a marriage with my vasal.
- longevity of characters – how long do they live? Is it hard-coded? Bahram died at th age of 48, but most of the other characters live long.
- is there any difference if an army has Integrity of 20%, 50% and of 100%? I could not see any differences in speed, morale etc.
- The Great Wall of Gorgan (on the south-east shore of the Caspian Sea) – does it have an in-game effect, or it’s just a visual cookie? The horde of White Huns passed it freely, while the whole point of this wall was to prevent such incidents.

Yeah, please do send me a spreadsheet if you have one with the farms. I've already reduced income from horses (not in the pack yet), and also there's a food production effect missing on level 3 and 4 wheat farms. That'll be fixed too, of course. I did the balancing for the farms a long time ago, and it's basically similar to vanilla anyway (just with the extra subsistence income). It would be worth looking into changing some effects there.

As far as the autoresolve and White Hun stats, you'll have to bring that to the attention of the FotE team. Maybe they missed some units doing their battle balance.

For your other questions:
1. Hmmm... I'm not sure. Maybe I've accidentally left some wives/children hidden in the startpos from when I removed most of the Sassanid vassals. I'm not sure what else explains that.
2. Longevity is mostly random, though I think there are some traits that affect it. Basically, once your character hits a certain age, there's a random chance each turn of him dying of natural causes, that goes up the older he is. It might be something we could change a little.
3. I'm not sure if there are any integrity effects for non-horde armies. It's worth looking into though. I'll check it out.
4. I think it's just a visual, but we could probably assign a "wonder" effect to the region it's in (well, one of the regions it borders) to slow enemy movement. I think there was a mod that did that actually...

[MajorTom]

I use Steam, so the update is recent, March 30. The ERE recruits primary units, but the WRE seems to be recruiting mercenaries exclusively... Possibly a FotE error still hiding?

[Augustusng]

Maybe. The WRE should have plenty of money, and anyway mercenaries are typically more expensive than core units. I was more concerned about small factions not having enough money. They should be okay in the current version, or close enough to okay, but the mod does currently favor big factions since I removed base income. I've only been able to re-add it to AI factions in a way that also favors large factions. Might have to make a script to add bonus income for the AI instead.

[Jin-]

Thanks

[Jin-]

I say this here and in FotE thread.

There is annoying bug when used with FotE. On both Romans it shows you can establish more armies, but you still can't. Pressing button does nothing. With ERE it shows 7/10 when it is actually 7/6 while using only FotE. Might be in other factions aswell, but haven't checked with high imperium.
EDIT: Possibly game breaking bug cause you cannot establish any new armies even if you delete all the old ones 0/10.

This issue was also with the earlier EP version

[Augustusng]

I can't replicate this issue. I'm not having any problems recruiting armies as either the WRE or ERE.

Of course, if you assign all your statesmen as governors, you'll have to wait for the next turn to get more candidates to be generals, but the game tells you that.

Maybe you're using a conflicting mod, or the wrong load order? Make sure FotE loads before EP.

[Augustusng]

Released 0.35 and removed the download link in this thread. You should post your bug reports in the main bug reports thread again.

[Delicate Strawberry]

The standalone link in the main download is still for 0.3.

[Jurand of Cracow]

Augustusng,
thanks for the answers to my questions. I understand that Other Grendees wifes' do not provide influence to dominion. In another thread I gathered information that Integrity has now effect but the defection of an army if it's close to 0. The Great wall of Gorgan - I think nomads could have something like 30% move penalty in the Nishapur province (if it's possible to mod it).

Concerning the effects of the EP ver 0.35 vs. 0.3:
- you've levelled farms very good (at least for the Sassanids): Wheat buildings level 2 and 3 are at break-even with Camels for fertility level 5. Later in the game it changes, I suppose, given climate change and knowledge of level 4 buildings (Camels 4 are much better that Wheat 4, at least as food is concerned, but there're Squalor and PO penalties). You've also introduced difference between sheeps and horses - good one.
- income for Sassanids is an issue after your changes. I mean: too much money. My income rose as following: foreign trade 15%, taxes 30%, and diplomacy 200%. The reason is: puppet states provide enormous amount of money, Hayasdan 6000, minor ones 3000. Change in expenses: no basic income (that 3000), maintenance +15%.
However, now for the Sassanids money ceased to be a problem They can field 14 good quality full stacks. Imperium allows only 10, but what to do with the rest of the money? Buildings cost peanuts, only technology prevents from building all them to the maximum level (with EP0.3 it was not like this, money was limited).
I'll probably try Lakhmids instead.

I have one request: can you describe here or in the manual what the recruitment points limit? (it's about number of units one can recruit in a turn? total number of units? number of slots?)

[squirel]

Is the standalone download link in the main download really updated for 0.35 ?

[Augustusng]

Damnit, no it's not. Sorry guys. I did the same stupid mistake again with that. Will try not to do it a third time. Hold on... and... it should be fixed now.

[Augustusng]

- income for Sassanids is an issue after your changes. I mean: too much money. My income rose as following: foreign trade 15%, taxes 30%, and diplomacy 200%. The reason is: puppet states provide enormous amount of money, Hayasdan 6000, minor ones 3000. Change in expenses: no basic income (that 3000), maintenance +15%.
However, now for the Sassanids money ceased to be a problem They can field 14 good quality full stacks. Imperium allows only 10, but what to do with the rest of the money? Buildings cost peanuts, only technology prevents from building all them to the maximum level (with EP0.3 it was not like this, money was limited).
I'll probably try Lakhmids instead.

I have one request: can you describe here or in the manual what the recruitment points limit? (it's about number of units one can recruit in a turn? total number of units? number of slots?)

Yeah, my worry was that big factions would have an easier time now. I'll try and work on this. Maybe increase higher level building costs, and retune corruption again.

And yeah, recruitment points refer to how many units you can recruit each turn in a province. I'll make that clear in the manual.

[Jurand of Cracow]

I've started a game with the Lakhmids, H/N, using FotE5.3+EP0.35.
I hired some troops to take Dumatha, which I did in a battle. Then I went bancrupt, totally bankrupt (say -1500). Just 1 trade agreement is possible (Mazun), the other two (ERE, Himyar) are obviously refused. With the others, there's no physicall road. I can make my budget even only if I dismantle the whole army. But then Himyar and Mazun declare war outright. I don't see any possibility to cope withouth that 3000 at the outset for small factions (or Lakhmids at last).
Can you fix it?