Problems I have with modern Hip Hop

[The Despondent Mind]

I have had a lot of exposure to hip hop music last year or so, and I must say it seems to be pretty dreadful and gets worse and worse by time.

We have had a billion of threads about how music gets work, but this really seems to be the exception. And It kind of has broader "problems" than just in music.
Look I know every genre or movement had it's artist, Hip Hop in early 90's had Will Smith, Kid n' Play, Vannila Ice, MC Hammer... But even then people were more or less aware that they are and they didn't really last that long.

But you also had Public Enemy, Ice-T and the mother F-ing N.W.A in the mainstream. They had something to say and if anything they were at least badass.
Later in the 90's we got Nas, 2-Pac, Wu Tang, A Tribe Called Quest...

Flash Forward today.

Now I would really willing to bet that 90% of Hip Hop music is self absorbed imbeciles.
If you turn on a hip hop radio with popular artists you will be shocked with the amount of misogyny and narcissism. Almost every song is based about the artists rambling how awesome he is, how he gets laid, has money, cars, drugs etc...
Even when the initial "subject" of the song might seem different it still ends up as a self praise or simply killing the whole point of the song.
Also Chris Brown is EVERYWHERE!

The most entertaining hip hop artist to me right now are the ones who go full on stupidity without any holding back or a shred of self awareness.
That would be Lil Wayne (see: Love Me), Nicki Minaj (See: Anaconda) and the new master 2 Chainz (See: Everything).

An interesting thing is that the word and the N word (are allowed to write it?) have 0 weight whatsoever. Women are and man are Ns, I would guess that modern kids exposed to this words will be completely oblivious to how damn inapropriate they are and actually insulting to both parties.
Anyway the songs that were the final drop for me were N***as in Paris by Jay Z & Kanye West and I Don't Mind by Usher.
First you got two superstars of the genre who have at least descent reputations for their song craftsmanship and they go and make a whole album and it's best single about how awesome they are.
The second one though which is actually an R'N'B song goes really fine, until the part where Usher says " I'm proud to call her my "….
I just cannot understand how is that okay with the modern black culture.

Essentially if you look at any Hip Hop top ten in last 5 years you should be shocked by it's utter dumbness. Jason Derulo might illustrate my point perfectly in a song where he sings how he doesn't need to know the language to get laid but in the chorus he sings "Talk Dirty to me" ....



There seems to be no equivalent to bands like N.W.A or Public Enemy that are angry at "real" problems not because their is not letting them have threesome's.

P.S.

Also what in hell is "Keepin' it Real" or "I'm the Realest" means?

And why do so many songs start the beginning phrase in this song , which I also do not understand ( I can't make out the words).

[Soothsayer]

I can barely understand what that song was about or what he was even saying, though it was probably sex. Rap/Hip-Hop is mostly just about the cool beats now, no artist bothers with writing deep meaningful lyrics, it's a devolution. I wish Tupac to come back and slay those who rap blasphemy in the holy genre.


This may sound confusing, but to me Pop doesn't exist anymore. On the broad scale, Pop got absorbed into Hip-hop which it sounds so similar now. The music is so heavily focused on that bass and techno sound.

[LaMuerte]

So when NWA and Wu Tang sing about Ho's , Bs , N's , dope , cars , act badass , and they are saying they are keeping it real , they have got 'something to say' , but when someone else does it , it's not okay? What problem did NWA address with singing ' A Bh is a Bh 'One Less Bh To Worry About' , 'Find m , m and Flee' , 'Just don't bite it' and what not?

Don't get me wrong , I understand your point. But I would put NWA and Wu Tang in the same class as those artists who talk dirty these days. They say it because it sells. If it wouldn't sell most of them would be singing about whatever would sell . Some of them already did change. (Yes , I'm looking at you , LL Cool J)

At the end of the day , it will always be 'the market is always right'. Dope and ho's sell , murder sells , Pop sells , artistic rap not that much , and political rap seems completely dead from a commercial perspective. Now lemme get back to my GTA 5...

[Halie Satanus]

One of my co-workers listens to all that plastic ''hip hop, crap.'' I ******* hate it..

You might like Task Force..

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC1p...fDXUqrQywaUAnQ

[Kyriakos]

That all is insane in the membrane.

[The Despondent Mind]

So when NWA and Wu Tang sing about Ho's , Bs , N's , dope , cars , act badass , and they are saying they are keeping it real , they have got 'something to say' , but when someone else does it , it's not okay? What problem did NWA address with singing ' A Bh is a Bh 'One Less Bh To Worry About' , 'Find m , m and Flee' , 'Just don't bite it' and what not?

Don't get me wrong , I understand your point. But I would put NWA and Wu Tang in the same class as those artists who talk dirty these days. They say it because it sells. If it wouldn't sell most of them would be singing about whatever would sell . Some of them already did change. (Yes , I'm looking at you , LL Cool J)

At the end of the day , it will always be 'the market is always right'. Dope and ho's sell , murder sells , Pop sells , artistic rap not that much , and political rap seems completely dead from a commercial perspective. Now lemme get back to my GTA 5...

Yes I'm aware they too did the generic hip hop lyrics, but at least they did it a long time a go, now we have heard it time and time again, how aren't the people getting tired of listening narcissistic misogynistic dumbass douchebags ?

[Condottiere 40K]

Any music genre that makes money is mainstreamed, and successful formulas are tweaked just enough so that they can be sold in Walmart.

[saxdude]

The sad thing is, Hip Hop is one of the genre's with most potentially powerful lyrical content since what? 60's/70's Rock? The genre can embranch political/social/economical commentary, personal emotions, all manner of subjects, without coming across as jarring and forced, and can even become mainstream. You rarely see a Death Metal, Pop rock, R&B, Electronic whathave you with any matching subject content, that can be taken serioursly. At best they are laughably out of touch or whiney, and at worst they are insulting and even extreme (sadly that happens often with the more "hardcore" Metal).

And yet, Rap and Hip Hop have been relegated to the broadest of main stream pop culture and "gansta" culture, which is fine, as superfluos as they can be (I love AC DC after all), but it has sadly become the norm.

[G-Megas-Doux]

The sad thing is that Rap was invented in the 70's and hip hop at the same time, it just didn't get main stream until the 80's and afterwards. I'm not a fan of Rap music or Hip Hop so it has to be really good to get me interested or really funny in an unintentional or ironic way. Example I like the Lonely Island. Those guys are very ironic in the whole thing. So many serious hip hop songs to me sound just like I'm on a Boat or I just had Sex. Its great how T'payne and Akon send themselves up and join in with those songs.

[sabaku_no_gaara]

rap and hip hop have been dead and worthless since the rise of chingy and nelly and that little bow wow kid

EDIT

Let me take you guys back to the year 1998 and listen to this:

[Knight of Heaven]

Never realy cared or liked Hip Hop, specialy american hip hop.

There is always the ocasional exception, but honestly as hiphop is concerned i tend to look in other places. National market included. But honestly when i had 15 and 16 i used to look at hip hop with a certain eyes. Now i look at it in a very different way. Generaly speaking, just doesnt do much for me.

exceptions?! For example.

[sabaku_no_gaara]

Where I was when I was from my 13 to my 18 years of age, people where either, rockers/metalheads or Gabbers (a Dutch working class youth culture involving hardcore house music) or gay pop listeners.

hip hop wasn't a big thing back then, I remember my first rap album being doggystyle by snoop doggy dog, I also remember stealing the cassette tape from my older sister's boyfriend's walkman when I was home for the weekend at the time because hey I was young and stealing was kind of my thing to rebel and act out when I was 13. anyway, a new world opened up to me, and I was sold to the genre, after snoop I started listening to Tupac and the Wu Tang, "r&b" and "hip hop" are mainstream now, but back in the day it was mostly the music for different ethnicity kids, and poor kids and some wannabe rich kids, I'd say around 1996-1997 white suburubans started listening to rap, and it slowly evolved into the monstrosity it is now

[Denny Crane!]

I really don't think you can talk about inappropriateness and laud the older generations. I loved some of the older hip hop but it was also disgusting. I mean Geto Boyz, holy crap that was some awful stuff yet they were also good at times too.

Its a long running trend through hip hop and needs to die, the misogyny and the racism. And a lot of the best (which oddly you don't mention) are both old and new and never had to employ them. Public Enemy were amazing, but NWA, em. Honestly I think they are so over rated. Everyone gets a hard on for them because they said stuff like the police but they were never that good compared to some of the brilliance and lyrical artistry that was around. Ice Cube came into his own when he went out on his own but I don't get the fascination for NWA.

There are plenty of people perhaps not mainstream who are crafting wonderful hip hop that is inventive and often without the disgusting ethical faux pas of being all material and derogatory bling and violence.

The signs of a great lyricist are people who can tell a story or pick a fight with the world through their songs. Andre 3000 was amazing, Talib Kweli, going old school you've got Rakim the finest lyricist to date whose phrases are still picked on by people who can't write better. Nas, Lauryn Hill, Mos Def.

King of the pile for most enjoyment will always be Cypress Hill.

A lot of these aren't necessarily old school. You'll be hard pressed to find someone quite as inventive as blackalicious or immortal technique:



I'm also a big fan of Atmosphere for the feel goods and off the wall ideas they have.



You just have to dig a bit deeper these days. You'd never hear a lot of this stuff on radio but then who listens to that these days.

[The Despondent Mind]

What I miss in modern Hip Hop that N.W.A has is that anger and rebellion, they were "punks" but today's rappers are just self obssesed jerks. And as you said Ice Cube did his own thing and in the beginning he had very good lyrics and still that aura of anger and being pissed. AmeriKKKa's Most Wanted is probably better than anything in N.W.A.

[Denny Crane!]

What I miss in modern Hip Hop that N.W.A has is that anger and rebellion, they were "punks" but today's rappers are just self obssesed jerks. And as you said Ice Cube did his own thing and in the beginning he had very good lyrics and still that aura of anger and being pissed. AmeriKKKa's Most Wanted is probably better than anything in N.W.A.

Well at least some of the anger was righteous, there is less to be angry about now. The best rap historically has been social commentary IMO.

But I think you can still find that anger if you really want it but NWA were far less the embodiement of that but simply seeking and finding status in self empowerment in the gangsta image that was pure self aggrandizement which was far different to the social commentary and righteous anger of other artists. Of course you could say that this was a representation of how and what they grew up in and around. But I don't think that washes and I can't really listen to the anger which is egotistical hate and misogyny for the most part and feel happy about what I'm listening too (especially given that it wasn't just a fiction, their actions made that more than clear).

[sabaku_no_gaara]

That made them authentic though, the whole thing with rap was that it was the genre of the criminals and the poor. Kids that grew up poor or grew up in poor area's where drugs was sold often identified with the rappers. Then middle class white kids thought they would be seen as cool and though listening to rap, so they adopted the genre en masse, it's the way it always goes with a counter culture, I've known middle class white kids who actively started selling weed because they listened to rap and wanted to be "real".

Rap/hip hop isn't about lyricism, or being an artist, it was the voice of the class that society shunned, and rappers sang about what they grew up in.

As for the misogyny you get lots of that outside of rap as well, pop for instance

[Denny Crane!]

That made them authentic though, the whole thing with rap was that it was the genre of the criminals and the poor. Kids that grew up poor or grew up in poor area's where drugs was sold often identified with the rappers.

What a load of crap its mixing up cause and effect, that media can only represent and that is why I said it was weak. Rap was rising on the back of Rakim, GMFlash and more and didn't need NWA to make it a hit. They created a message and sold it, yeah it was popular but then again anyone can create a violent message and sell it, doesn't make it represent society does it? Did Nazism represent Germany? No thats crap. It was hate that played upon societal trouble.

The very people you claim to like laid the foundation for what you hate and all the people you didn't mention such as the two I mentioned, tribe called quest and my god the list goes on were creating good clean hip hop laid down on good beats. Not long after the golden age plenty kept on going with the likes of J5.

You don't want to hear about why the modern artists do what they do, at least where YOU look but you just need to look at what Snoop Dog, part of the Gangster prodigy said when questioned on his extreme lyrics were that sex and violence sells nig*a. So what do you think? The deep irony is you are looking back at the golden age of what is then what you deride now. Your golden age was the older version of your new hated genre.

And there is really a clear link between bad ideologies and bad behaviour and why they should be discouraged, modern and old should be and why we should be supporting any lyrics that promote disgusting acts should be as abhorrent as promoting Mein Kampf, seems mindless that we would defend it randomly for art? Violence hate, rape and racism as good? C'mon seriously defend what popularises that.

Then chill the out dude and listen to some real ing hip hop that wasn't some ing self aggrandizing dickhead who gets a hard on looking at a gun and raping a woman. And the music ain't got on GMF.

Then middle class white kids thought they would be seen as cool and though listening to rap, so they adopted the genre en masse, it's the way it always goes with a counter culture, I've known middle class white kids who actively started selling weed because they listened to rap and wanted to be "real".

Rap/hip hop isn't about lyricism, or being an artist, it was the voice of the class that society shunned, and rappers sang about what they grew up in.

As for the misogyny you get lots of that outside of rap as well, pop for instance

Man, read an article or two, how backwards you have this is so beyond me. Read the damn history of rap and realise that NWA were a popularised footnote, that hate and gangsterism weren't the start and thank god they weren't the end. You just romantacised criminality.

Put the reefer down.

[Azog 150]

I think Denny has summed it up nicely.

There is still plenty of good hip-hop that doesn't get air time, and it is also worth looking a bit further afield (I am not a massive fan of British hip-hop, but I can think of a few British hip-hop artists with an insane flow and meaningful lyrical content. I hear France also has a thriving hip-hop scene).

Saying all that, I think A Tribe Called Quest will always be my favourite hip-hop act.

[Condottiere 40K]

10497


Jumped the shark.

[Maximinus Thrax]

(your typical modern blackface character)

Today's mainstream hip-hop is nothing but the modern version of the coon songs, a hugely popular genre which caricatured the Black communities at the turn of the 20th century. Back then the blackface minstrels were usually played by white artists. Nowadays, these roles are performed by black people, who are doing a great job at degrading themselves and the community they represent. The target audience is still represented by white people, who are major consumers of hip-hop (some say THE major consumers).

Coon songs' defining characteristic, however, was their caricature of African Americans. In keeping with the older minstrel image of Blacks, coon songs often featured "watermelon- and chicken-loving rural buffoon[s]".However, "blacks began to appear as not only ignorant and indolent, but also devoid of honesty or personal honor, given to drunkenness and gambling, utterly without ambition, sensuous, libidinous, even lascivious. Blacks were portrayed as making money through gambling, theft, and hustling, rather than working to earn a living