WIP: Keep Your Low Cost Units. Removal of Unit-Replacement System.

[Mephalamos]

I didn't like in Attila how units didn't 'unlock,' they 'replaced.' Basically, you lost access to your low cost, levy units over time, and this meant you -never- had access to a diverse, choice-rich unit roster.

In Rome 2, this would be the equivalent of playing as the Suebi and only having access to Oathsworn and Wodanaz spears mid to late game. It makes no sense.

This changes that by building a proper Unit-Tree inside of the buildings, while allowing the player and AI to keep access to their levies and lower cost troops types. Instead of one unit being replaced by another, they instead 'unlock' as you construct buildings -- just like in the original TW titles.

Update 1:

1) Finished the Western Roman Empire
2) Finished Eastern Roman Empires. Now to test.

Update 2:

1) Worked out issue with the garrisons. Previously they became bloated due to an oversight I made regarding the garrison groupings.

Update 3:

1) Finished Nordic Unit Trees.

Update 4:

1) Finished Vandals, Alans, Visigoths, and Ostrogoths.
2) Rebalanced Nordic unit recruitment after a brief play-test of the Saxons.

Currently Working On:

1) Sassanids
2) Play-test Gothic trees.
3) Regrouping Gothic garrisons.

Original Thread

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I posted this on the official forums,

Playing as West Rome, it becomes a little frustrating that every new unit, replaces an older unit, even if the two units can and should coexist.

For example, why must Limitani be entirely replaced by Comitatenses? Even though those two spear units can and should fill entirely seperate roles? Comitatenses are 'professional' spears, and Limitani are a decent 'militia' unit? Further up, Comitatenses then are replaced by Auxilia Palatina...why? Even though Auxilia are rather expensive.

Essentially, what is an otherwise large Unit tree becomes very, very restrictive.

For example, why can't I have a mix of decent spears, mid-level spears, and cheaper spears? Limitani as cheap front line units, with Comitatenses and Auxilia held in reserve, but with each unit -replacing- its predecessor this becomes impossible.

Not only historically, but also gameplay wise these units can fill very different roles due to their differing cost and states. Why the need to replace one with the other?

I'm familiar with rather basic modding, and I wanted to make it so that I can recruit both units at the same time, and then I figure that once I do that, I can extend the same process to other units.

So, I tried editing technology_unit_upgrades, and removing the entries for limitani, and then adding comitatenses into the building_units_allowed, but I can now only build limitani, comitatenses don't show up despite being in the same buildings as limitani.

What am I doing wrong?

[clench]

Yeah this needs to get looked at. Some of the upgrade choices are odd.

For example as Jutes, you get access to Norse Brigands fairly early which are a javelin unit that can hold it's own for a bit in a fight... but before you even deploy them you can get another tech that upgrades Norse Brigands to some fairly mediocre mounted raider.

So your above average javelin unit gets upgraded to a average or even below average cavalry unit and you can't recruit anymore brigands.

[Mephalamos]

I added comitatenses into the building_units_allowed and removed their technology requirement in technology_unit_upgrades, but they didn't show up in the recruitment browser in game.

That leads me to believe that there is another table at work here that I haven't discovered yet.

I'm thinking perhaps in the unit_technology _requirement, but the PFM can't view that file yet.

[FréreAne]

<<unit_technology _requirement, but the PFM can't view that file yet>>
I don't know if it can't edit it or if the table don't exist in the pack ( it is just in xml descriptor something about but no table in the pack ( empty ))

[Mephalamos]

I think I may have found the problem, or at least part of the problem.

Buildings_units_allowed does not seem to be working right at the moment. To experiment, I added Cohors to -all- standard roman buildings, and it made no difference. I was still only able to build at the barracks.

So that may be the problem

[FréreAne]

is cohors a tier 1 unit ?( i have play only with frankish since there )

[Mephalamos]

is cohors a tier 1 unit ?

Yes, it's a basic Tier 1 unit, that can be recruited right at the start of the game, so by moving it from one building to another, and seeing no change, likely means buildings_units_allowed is not being read properly by the PFM.

[FréreAne]

Are you sure you have give an "unique" ID to all the line you add?(in building_unit_allowed_table, is a integer that must exist once in the table)

[Mephalamos]

Are you sure you have give an "unique" ID to all the line you add?(in building_unit_allowed_table, is a integer that must exist once in the table)

Problem solved. Awesome! ^_^ Thanks for the tip!

[FréreAne]

It arrived to me so many time...good modding.

[Taishō]

Surprising that with all the (good and bad) critic for Attila right now very few people seem to be bothered by this. I mean it just feels so wrong - to me at least. Any chance there'll be a mod to address this?

[Mephalamos]

Surprising that with all the (good and bad) critic for Attila right now very few people seem to be bothered by this. I mean it just feels so wrong - to me at least. Any chance there'll be a mod to address this?

I honestly don't think many people have noticed yet. I will be making the mod. It'll take a few days, but it's very easy to do, just tedious.

[FréreAne]

A good things that will to do is to separate the faction units so your faction is the only abble to get your units so you may
adjust their properties ( units stat , price ) in function of the adversity ( without having probléms exept may be rebellion).
for example you can adjust salary to be at scale ( 1,1.2,1.4,1.6 ) in place of ( 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 ),Give them descent combat
abilities etc...

[Mr. Os]

Good luck on this.

[stevehoos]

Good idea, looking forward to this.

[Mephalamos]

Update 1:

1) Finished the Western Roman Empire
2) Finished Eastern Roman Empires. Now to test.

Currently Working On:

Nordic Unit Trees.

[Chris P. Bacon]

I like the idea, but will this mess with the AI's recruitment?

[Mephalamos]

I like the idea, but will this mess with the AI's recruitment?

The AI will simply have more at it's disposal to recruit.

The AI recruits according to proportions defined in the data table, and fills those proportions according to what it can afford.

[Chris P. Bacon]

The AI will simply have more at it's disposal to recruit.

The AI recruits according to proportions defined in the data table, and fills those proportions according to what it can afford.

Cool! Downloading now, is it savegame compatible?

[Mephalamos]

Cool! Downloading now, is it savegame compatible?

Thanks for the enthusiasm! But it won't be ready for download until late tomorrow or early the next day.

And yes, it will be entirely savegame compatible, as well as savegame safe should you want to uninstall it.