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Thread: That's A Lot of Euros

  1. #81
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    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Mangalore View Post
    The additional question would be if you had similar ideals, would you stay out of the cooperation systems of the West just because the US is bigger?
    I can't think of any state which has similar ideals which isn't under the US sphere already, though.

  2. #82

    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Stavroforos View Post
    I think it's quite clear, actually. They'd rather aspire to be an independent power. How much they can achieve that is questionable, but it's clear that that is what they've been trying to do since the early 2000s.
    I think it's more likely Russia's current system lets the people who make decisions in Russia be billionaires and own 100 mansions when in a democracy they would not be wealthy people at all. After all, that's what the USSR was all about.

  3. #83

    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    I think it's more likely Russia's current system lets the people who make decisions in Russia be billionaires and own 100 mansions when in a democracy they would not be wealthy people at all. After all, that's what the USSR was all about.
    The person who makes decision in Russia rose through the KGB and has destroyed the fortunes of the billionaires who tried to oppose him, imprisoned them, exiled them, killed them.

  4. #84

    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    You mean those poor, poor billionaire oligarchs who made their fortunes by killing their opponents, thieving the nation's wealth and leaving Russia in tatters? What a shame. I bet you also believe in the Western propaganda myth of Yeltsin as a flawed, yet heroic leader. I'm not saying Putin is a good guy here, but let's try and look at things with a bit more perspective.
    Once a political decision has been reached to proceed with internal disturbances in Syria, CIA is prepared, and SIS (MI6) will attempt to mount minor sabotage and coup de main [sic] incidents within Syria, working through contacts with individuals. Incidents should not be concentrated in Damascus. [A] necessary degree of fear, [...] frontier incidents and [staged] border clashes [will] provide a pretext for intervention. The CIA and SIS should use [...] capabilities in both psychological and action fields to augment tension. [Funding should be provided for a] Free Syria Committee [and arms should be supplied to] political factions with paramilitary or other actionist capabilities.
    ~ Joint US-UK leaked Intelligence Document, 1957

  5. #85

    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by YukonTrooper View Post
    You mean those poor, poor billionaire oligarchs who made their fortunes by killing their opponents, thieving the nation's wealth and leaving Russia in tatters? What a shame. I bet you also believe in the Western propaganda myth of Yeltsin as a flawed, yet heroic leader. I'm not saying Putin is a good guy here, but let's try and look at things with a bit more perspective.
    What perspective makes Putin's brutality any different? You clearly want to demonise his opponents.

  6. #86

    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrets54 View Post
    The person who makes decision in Russia rose through the KGB and has destroyed the fortunes of the billionaires who tried to oppose him, imprisoned them, exiled them, killed them.
    Sounds like every post-Stalin party chairperson. I remember reading about senior Soviet generals having basically their own feudal fiefs, making themselves rich through corruption and getting away with rape and murder. But they seldom got to enjoy such a lifestyle for long before falling out of favour for one reason or another.

  7. #87

    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrets54 View Post
    The person who makes decision in Russia rose through the KGB and has destroyed the fortunes of the billionaires who tried to oppose him, imprisoned them, exiled them, killed them.
    And after that he ensured his KGB buddies could be the next billionaires...
    "Sebaceans once had a god called Djancaz-Bru. Six worlds prayed to her. They built her temples, conquered planets. And yet one day she rose up and destroyed all six worlds. And when the last warrior was dying, he said, 'We gave you everything, why did you destroy us?' And she looked down upon him and she whispered, 'Because I can.' "
    Mangalore Design

  8. #88
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    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    ​Won't someone think of the billionaires?!?

  9. #89
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    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Stavroforos View Post
    ​Won't someone think of the billionaires?!?
    Fat chance here with all the communist posters around
    Λέων μεν ὄνυξι κρατεῖ, κέρασι δε βούς, ἄνθρωπος δε νῷι
    "While the lion prevails with its claws, and the ox through its horns, man does by his thinking"
    Anaxagoras of Klazomenae, 5th century BC










  10. #90

    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    What a joke. Hope Merkel intensifies the sanctions and puts them four trillion in the hole.

  11. #91

    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Stavroforos View Post
    Russia is the legal successor to the USSR, so it doesn't matter if the actions occurred against Russia or the USSR. As far as Poland and Finland go, losers don't ask for war reparations.
    What, Poland was on the losing side, now? Or was it "game over" because they were occupied? In which case, Denmark, Norway, Greece, Holland, Belgium and occupied France were also losers with no right to demand reparations.

  12. #92
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    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Kissaki View Post
    What, Poland was on the losing side, now? Or was it "game over" because they were occupied? In which case, Denmark, Norway, Greece, Holland, Belgium and occupied France were also losers with no right to demand reparations.
    Sorry don't know why I used Poland as an example, my bad.

  13. #93
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    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by zcfhcgh View Post
    What a joke. Hope Merkel intensifies the sanctions and puts them four trillion in the hole.
    This has been pointed out before, so it's a shame it has to be repeated, but the sanctions imposed upon Russia are EU sanctions and Merkel can't decide to just up them without the agreement of other EU leaders.

    "For what it’s worth: it’s never too late to be whoever you want to be. I hope you live a life you’re proud of, and if you find that you’re not, I hope you have the strength to start all over again."

  14. #94
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    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Indeed, foreign policy is the area where Germany isn't simply issues mandates in the EU. It's not surprising either, they want all the perks of leadership but none of the responsibilities.

  15. #95
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    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Stavroforos View Post
    Indeed, foreign policy is the area where Germany isn't simply issues mandates in the EU. It's not surprising either, they want all the perks of leadership but none of the responsibilities.
    I wouldn't call the billions of German taxpayer money funnelled towards failing European economies a "perk" of being the leader in EU population and economic size.

    "For what it’s worth: it’s never too late to be whoever you want to be. I hope you live a life you’re proud of, and if you find that you’re not, I hope you have the strength to start all over again."

  16. #96
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    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    Quote Originally Posted by Jom View Post
    I wouldn't call the billions of German taxpayer money funnelled towards failing European economies a "perk" of being the leader in EU population and economic size.
    Sure it is, considering they're profiting off of the interest rates of these loans while implementing the reforms they want in the European periphery.

  17. #97
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    Default Re: That's A Lot of Euros

    - will this help turn the German masses into Putin's embrace once and for all? Or has this once pragmatic mediator between east and west now been discarded as a 'comrade' for good?
    - will Angela Merkel now feel pressed to cease the sanctions, intimidated by the thermonuclear levels of hipocrisy? Or will she rather realize that there simply is no moving forward diplomatically anymore?
    - does this behaviour point towards a broader trend, where autocracies, to save face inwardly, must estrange their former friends? Can Laika come back from outer space and save Russia's relationship with Europe?
    Seriously OP really?
    Last edited by pacifism; February 27, 2015 at 11:49 PM. Reason: insult removed
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