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Thread: IB: SAI-ALEX Roman Unit Roster Revisions - Limitanei

  1. #1
    julianus heraclius's Avatar The Philosopher King
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    Default IB: SAI-ALEX Roman Unit Roster Revisions - Limitanei

    Now some of you will know that I have been slowing revising the Roman roster and increasing it for the SAI-ALEX version. The roster is now complete, barring some minor changes that may arise. My initial intention was to just redo to roman roster, but having now finished that I intend to redo most other factions. I have spoke to Joar about this and since we intend on revising the Sassanids, Arabs and berbers again for RO he has allowed me to use his current textures from these factions for the new revised ones for SAI-ALEX. This has now been extended to the barbarian factions.

    So, this is the first preview of the roman roster looking at the town watch and limitanei units. I have to thank Joar, lief_erikson and Razor for the use of textures and shield designs. Roman helmets and equipment by Razor.

    Firstly, the Vigilum - Town Watch and Numeri



    These men are local workers and peasants given enough training to defend their homes and keep order in the streets. They are no substitute for fully trained Roman legionaries, but then they are not expected to be more than a citizen militia with an interest in keeping the peace (and possibly they might have some fire fighting duties). They do not have much equipment, as the most they are expected to do is stand behind their spears and shields, and then hold position when charged. By and large, this they manage to do. These units are very handy for helping to keep villages/towns/cities under control as they are recruitable via the roman drill ground (first level recruitment building).

    Numerus Infantry were originally raised from barbarian tribes for service in the roman army, as the auxlia by this time had become almost identical with the legios. Originally armed and dressed as their own culture, over time they too became more romanised and dressed similiar to other roman troops and commanded by roman officers. By this time they had become part of the Limitanei, the frontier or garrison troops. These troops are the equivalent of the auxiliaries of earlier centuries. They are not heavily armoured infantry, but can be relied upon to give a good account of themselves in battle.

    Limitanei Units

    Border troops were referred to as limitanei, (pronounced LEE-mays). The law of 325 AD implied that the limitanei consisted of two classes of troops; the ripeness (legions, equites, cunei equitum, and auxilia) and the alae et cohortes. The alae et cohortes included the classis (flotillas). The ripenses or riparienses as they were also called were higher grade troops than the alae et cohortes much like during the principate period. During the 4th century and even into the early 5th century these troops were still considered battle worthy but were less prestigious than the comitatensis and palatinae units of the field armies.

    These troops were permanently stationed along the borders and were usually reluctant to move to another province, though could act in cohort with field armies within their own province or even be promoted to field armies assuming the title of psuedocomitatensis. Over time, however, the limitanei settled down at their posts and became soldier-settlers with families and farms, rather than purely garrison troops. Although a militia of sorts and treated as second class by the mobile comitatenses, the limitanei are fairly well trained and reasonably well equipped.

    Auxilia Cohortes Limitanei



    These milites belong to an old auxiliary detachment. Auxilia Cohortes are left over from the old imperial system. During the third century the differences between auxilia cohortes and legions narrowed to the point that they were virtually identical Being unarmoured they are more likely to fight in the rear ranks. These milites are armed with veruta and lancea. You may notice the two more heavily armed units at the far right. These are Auxilia Cohortes Armatus Limitanei. The first has leather muscular protection who is recruited in western provinces while the second has chain mail protection and is recruited in eastern provinces.


    Western Legio Ripenses



    This group of legionaries belong to the western provinces of the empire. The first two are recruitable in the British provinces. The second two along the Rhine provinces. The third two along the Danube provinces and the fourth two in the Spanish and African provinces.

    You will also note that the upgraded units have leather muscular armour. The lesser armoured units armed with veruta and lancea, while the more heavily armoured units have spicula and lancea. The first four wear a Spangenhelm helmet while the last four wear an intercisa hemet.

    Eastern Legio Ripenses



    This group of legionaries belong to the eastern provinces of the empire. The first two are recruitable in the Asia Minor and Armenian provinces. The second two are recruitable in the Egyptian and Arabian provinces. The third two are recruitable in the Palestinian provinces and the fourth two in the Syrian provinces. The lesser armoured units armed with veruta and lancea, except the the two on the right who are armed with plumbarti and lancea, while the more heavily armoured units have spicula and lancea. They all wear a spanglehelm helmet.

    Note, that the upgraded units have either mail or scale armour as opposed to the leather muscular armour. I have made the assumption that the eastern provinces which faced more highly armoured factions that also used missile weapons to a large degree would have been more heavily armoured than their counterparts in the west. At least a border protection goes. As for the comitatensis and palatinae forces, at this stage I am assuming that they were more heavily armoured with mail and scales.


    Skirmishers and Scouts



    The last group consist of the skirmishers, scouts and sagitarii.
    From left to right we have the:

    Milites Sagittarii.

    Centuries of warfare have taught the Roman army the value of archers. These men wear no armour as they are not expected to fight in melee. While archers from the eastern parts of the Empire are equipped with composite bows, those raised in Western areas are armed with the simpler self bow, carved from a single piece of wood. While the self bow is not as powerful as a compound bow, it does have one major advantage over the Eastern weapon: it is not useless in the damp conditions of western and northern Europe! Bowstrings will always stretch and become useless when wet, but a compound bow will actually fall to pieces as the glue used to make it weakens as the damp gets in. A self bow has nothing to 'go wrong' when it gets damp, and need only be dried out to be as good as new, an important consideration for any Western Roman soldier. Even so, these archers are a supporting arm to other troops, and are not expected to stand and fight. They wear no armour so that they can move swiftly in battle.

    Auxilia Praeventores

    Praeventores are scouts sent out beyond Rome's frontiers to watch and, when necessary, attack Rome's enemies. Praeventores are chosen men given the authority to deal with problems before they fully ripen. On the battlefield they are employed as scouts, spies and as military assassins, falling on unsuspecting enemies from any promising ambush spot. They are usually given the best of weapons, but little armour as this would hinder them in moving quietly. Praeventores are not men who fight fair, ever.

    Auxilia Superventores

    Superventores are troops that specialise in ambushes. They fight as an irregular force, specialising in ambushes and nasty surprises.

    Arcuballistarii

    The Arcuballista which according to some sources is really a hunting weapon, this is because it was seen on a mural depicting men armed with these devices hunting animals. Stephenson in his book "Romano-Byzantine Infantry Equipment", calls the arcuballista not a crossbow but an arch-ballista. He refers to the Strategikon which states, "weapons of the light-armed infantryman. They should carry bows on their shoulders with large quivers holding about thirty or forty arrows. They should have small shields, as well as solenaria with short arrows in small quivers. These can be fired a great distance with the bows and cause harm to the enemy." The solenaria. Was more precisely a "hollowed out wooden tube or channel", rather than a crossbow which would act like an arrow-guide.

    Milites Exculcatores

    In actuality not a formal division, exculcatores were simply hand picked men expected to do skirmishing duties. They may come from any unit so they can actually be well trained comitatenses, or they can be simple milites. Armed with javelins and a shield but wearing little to no armor, they must rely on their speed and mobility and must keep out of melee combat.

    Screenshots below:













    Last edited by julianus heraclius; January 27, 2015 at 07:18 AM. Reason: Added Screenshots

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  2. #2
    tomySVK's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Amazing work!

    So if you are going to redone Romans, Sassanids, Arabs and berbers for RO and SAI?

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    vikior's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Oh my God!
    These are beautiful!

    How did you get the upgraded limitanei? Is it like in Med II, where upgrading a unit's armour changes its texture or is it just simply a texture variation?
    Last edited by vikior; January 06, 2015 at 04:21 AM.

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    tomySVK's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Quote Originally Posted by vikior View Post
    How did you get the upgraded limitanei? Is it like in Med II, where upgrading a unit's armour changes its texture or is it just simply a texture variation?
    I don´t think this is possible on RTW engine.

  5. #5
    Diocle's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    cool

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    Stath's's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions



  7. #7

    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Very nice! I only have Alexander on Steam though, will it work on there?


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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    the units in this game are the best looking in overall,my only whinning is that the shield of line infantry are too small,but i guess its because of animation problems?

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    demagogos nicator's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Beautifull!!

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    Julianus Flavius's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Beautiful work!
    Am I right in assuming that any Armatus unit can be posted to field armies?
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    What have the Romans ever done for us?? apart from better sanitation and medicine and education and irrigation and public health and roads and a freshwater system and baths and public order... what have the Romans done for us?
    Some of my favourite quotes:
    "Your god has yet to prove himself more merciful than his predecessors" ~ Hypatia, as represented in the film 'Agora'
    "If you choose to do nothing, they will continue to do this again and again, until there is no-one left in the city, no people for this governement to govern"
    ~ Hypatia, as represented in the film 'Agora'

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    julianus heraclius's Avatar The Philosopher King
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Quote Originally Posted by tomySVK View Post
    Amazing work!

    So if you are going to redone Romans, Sassanids, Arabs and berbers for RO and SAI?
    That is correct.

    Quote Originally Posted by vikior View Post
    Oh my God!
    These are beautiful!

    How did you get the upgraded limitanei? Is it like in Med II, where upgrading a unit's armour changes its texture or is it just simply a texture variation?
    The armoured limitanei are available via upgraded barracks.

    Quote Originally Posted by First Citizen Gallienus View Post
    Very nice! I only have Alexander on Steam though, will it work on there?
    I'm afraid I don't know, though the some of the units will be made available for the SAI-BI version.

    Quote Originally Posted by Julianus Flavius View Post
    Beautiful work!
    Am I right in assuming that any Armatus unit can be posted to field armies?
    If you wish.

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  12. #12
    julianus heraclius's Avatar The Philosopher King
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Have updated first post with screenshots.

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  13. #13

    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Wow, those look really neat and highly detailed. I like the new standard bearer behind the one holding the banner!


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    Diocle's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Yes also I like it.

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    Gäiten's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Nice.
    Look forward to see the revised Sassanians. If you want I could help you ...

    Invasio Barbarorum: Ruina Roma Development Leader - Art made by Joar -Visit my Deviantart: http://gaiiten.deviantart.com/

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    julianus heraclius's Avatar The Philosopher King
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Quote Originally Posted by First Citizen Gallienus View Post
    Wow, those look really neat and highly detailed. I like the new standard bearer behind the one holding the banner!
    Yes, that is one of the old Signifer banners for auxiliary units done by Razor for his MTW2 mod. I have used some of his helmets, standards and accessories with his permission of course. There is some conjecture around whether the signum was still in use in the 4th Century but since I am representing older units I have taken the assumption that the signifer would have still be used.

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  17. #17
    julianus heraclius's Avatar The Philosopher King
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Quote Originally Posted by Gäiten View Post
    Nice.
    Look forward to see the revised Sassanians. If you want I could help you ...
    Thanks. Joar has done a great job as usual with the sassanid textures but will keep you in the loop.

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  18. #18
    tomySVK's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Quote Originally Posted by julianus heraclius View Post
    Yes, that is one of the old Signifer banners for auxiliary units done by Razor for his MTW2 mod. I have used some of his helmets, standards and accessories with his permission of course. There is some conjecture around whether the signum was still in use in the 4th Century but since I am representing older units I have taken the assumption that the signifer would have still be used.
    Great news about importing Razor´s work to RTW engine! The standards in the screens are amazing!

  19. #19
    Gäiten's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: IB: SAI-ALEX Unit Roster Revisions

    Quote Originally Posted by julianus heraclius View Post
    Thanks. Joar has done a great job as usual with the sassanid textures but will keep you in the loop.
    Maybe in doing the unit cards?
    Remember the more helping hands the faster the game is finished

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