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Thread: Feedback: Elves

  1. #41

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    I'm in year 404.
    Dunland took out Rohan and half of RK, each turn a full stack of dunland troops attack in the east (town south of Lorien) these are easily held off by one general unit and 5 archer units with only 0-4 losses in the general and sometimes 1-2 losses to the archers from ranged weapons.

    Not got any complaint about being able to win comfortably but I should take some attrition losses. I think the issue is that dunland troops don't have the attack capability to get through the generals armor.

    Dale and Adunabar can get through the generals armor but even then they find it very hard work and any damage they do in one battle is healed by the next.

  2. #42

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Fred View Post
    I've played the elves for a bit now and I feel the elvish bodyguard is too large/powerful, especially as it picks up the experience points. The main challenge of the elvish campaign seems to be population management but you can just chuck the bodyguard into half a stack and always come about as victor with a free replenishments in the following turns.
    They are suppose to be the best troops the elven people have, which would make them the best troops in middle earth excluding the few remaining Noldor. If they where a cavalry unit then I think they would be overpowered but heavy infantry while strong is not in the same league as cavalry. The are an expensive unit to maintain which helps to offset their effectiveness, you can nearly field 2 units of lindon spears for the same upkeep as elven retainers or nearly 3-4 bow units.

  3. #43
    webba84's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Generals can die suddenly, which somewhat offsets their ability to auto retrain. Finish the campaign and let us know if it was too easy to win, I have a feeling you're going to need every general you can get your hands on.

  4. #44

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Sure the campaign is difficult and a refreshing change from any other way faction has played in other mods.

    Its just I would prefer the general unit not to the best.
    From a elvish recruitment accuracy (with few elves reaching the top level) it would make sense for a unit like Noldor swords which can be affected by attrition losses and have to managed carefully to preserve them.

    At the moment I'm using my generals recklessly and taking the greatest casualties to prevent losses to the weaker/cheaper troops. Which just seems wrong to me.

  5. #45
    webba84's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Noldor swords are better than the generals, though not against horse. Noldor Riders are flat out better and Lindon Guard are much better value for money.

    Elves have always led from the front, and with low population it makes sense for them to be reliant on the great deeds of heroes to carry the day. Gil-galad wasn't hiding in his tent while someone else took on Sauron.

    Elven BG has already been toned down from their initial stats, and we are happy with where they are now.

  6. #46
    Aikanár's Avatar no vaseline
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    I next to never use generals in battle since I find them way more valuable as governors.


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  7. #47

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    I like the Elven generals the way they are; they are expensive, and they seem much less OP once you are in the phase of a campaign where you are facing full stacks.

  8. #48

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    @Lord Fred

    If a campaign can be easily won without using the majority of your generals as governors then that may be an indication the economy is too easy. Can you give some account of how your finances and production is doing? Maybe some screen shots of the financial and production rankings with top 5 factions?

  9. #49

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Money is tight through the game (holding 25ish provinces with a starting profit of about 10K per turn) which is massively limiting where I can recruit units. I try and use the generals as governors but I ended up with all of them in the eastern section and only two in the west (I only adopted once in the west).

    Only got to use the Noldor Horse twice before they departed to the west which was a little disappointing.

    I'm using single generals in a stack to help hold a few strategic points though as was just mentioned they decided to depart at just the wrong time and caused a bit of crazyness.

  10. #50
    webba84's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    You got a bit unlucky with the Noldor riders there, generally they stick around for a while (seek out as many battles for them as you can find asap, basically)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Fred View Post
    I'm using single generals in a stack to help hold a few strategic points though as was just mentioned they decided to depart at just the wrong time and caused a bit of crazyness.

  11. #51

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Glorfindel starts at age 50 so you have around 20 turns before he departs.
    I think one of the problems with the elves and dwarves is that your generals tend to pile up in certain regions.

  12. #52
    Revelo's Avatar Decanus
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Quote Originally Posted by insolent1 View Post
    Glorfindel starts at age 50 so you have around 20 turns before he departs.
    I think one of the problems with the elves and dwarves is that your generals tend to pile up in certain regions.
    Agreed, sometimes I get a ton of characters in a specific region, meaning I have to spent many turns moving them to areas I need them in.

    Dwarf and Elf BG's are monsters in CC. I can send them out on their own knowing they won't get killed in combat, oh you brought 1500 Easterlings? Still not a fair fight

    The Fourth Age: Total War - Dwarf and Rhun beta tester.

  13. #53

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelo View Post
    Dwarf and Elf BG's are monsters in CC.
    I think the real power of these units is that the AI is unable to deal with them and will help you by not attacking the unit when you have it resting in between snacks.


    Anyone else unimpressed with elven foot archers?

    They always get targeted by AI archers and take heavy casulties in archery duels, they barely outrange some archer units(black bows).
    Don't get me wrong they do kill a decent amount but are a little unwhelming considering you have 5 different kinds.
    I found the galadhrim warriors to be the best due to their armour but at nearly twice the upkeep of greenwood bows.
    Maybe a slight range increase for elves and black bows need to have a range reduction, they shouldn't be better than royal/kings longbow.

  14. #54
    MasterOfNone's Avatar RTW Modder 2004-2015
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    The Elves have a +10 range over the Black Arrows.
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  15. #55
    webba84's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Not to mention that the Black Arrows are a T5 unit and very difficult to get to, whereas the elves get their archers at T2 and T3 and the Kings/Royal longbowmen are available to the Dunedain at T3 as well.

  16. #56
    Thangaror's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Archery duels are just a pretty bad idea. The RTW engine doesn't favor this kind of fighting, but usually you can't avoid it.
    I would rather have a memory that is fair but unfinished than one that goes on to a grievous end.

  17. #57

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfNone View Post
    The Elves have a +10 range over the Black Arrows.
    I'm talking about the black bows(cultic) they have a range of 170, elven foot archers have a range of 175

  18. #58
    webba84's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Do you mean Blackroot Vale Bowmen, Dark Bows or the Black Company (all units available to Adunabar). This discussion would be a lot easier to have if you could get the unit names right

  19. #59

    Default Re: Feedback: Elves

    Quote Originally Posted by webba84 View Post
    Do you mean Blackroot Vale Bowmen, Dark Bows or the Black Company (all units available to Adunabar). This discussion would be a lot easier to have if you could get the unit names right
    apologies

    I meant Dark Bows

  20. #60
    webba84's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: Feedback: Elves



    170 seems quite far for the Dark Bows who iirc arent even longbow troops and shouldnt be very good (the cult not being particularly interested in ranged warfare). Will check it out.

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