The Chat Thread (Read OP)

[Derpy Hooves]

By the way, is it true that you can legally shoot a Scotsman in York using a bow and arrow (or something like that)?

Britain has some of the most ridiculous legal systems I have ever seen. No wonder over 100 million Indians died under their occupation.

​How many of those died of old age

[lolIsuck]

Britain has some of the most ridiculous legal systems I have ever seen. No wonder over 100 million Indians died under their occupation.

Yeah, because any other nation would have easily prevented all those deaths in an underdeveloped and highly populated region. I doubt another coloniser would have caused significantly less deaths, the approach to how to handle your colonies was virtually the same for all, milk them and if someone throws a tantrum you shoot him. Not being colonised would probably mean continued internal conflict and missing out on modernisation with probably a similar death toll.

[Niles Crane]

People learn by observance and trial. It is possible she never saw anyone open a screw cap drink bottle properly, but come on, aren't the bottlecaps one of the most common things visible on earth?

Until I was 8 years old, I had never seen any other kind of bottlecap than the one you just mentioned. Simply because I never saw someone carrying a bottle of that kind.

Reminds me of the fact that despite being 17 and a half, I have not yet learned how to open a can of soft drink, or any can of any kind.

To be fair, there's a little more to opening a can than a bottle. Also, you've got servants to do it for you. I don't know, there's a lot more wrong with her. She's basically become entirely dependent on other people to do things for her, including getting food made for her when she comes home from school. I don't know understand why anyone wouldn't want to break out of that and actually be independent for once.

[General Maximus]

​How many of those died of old age

That figure is actually completely full of those who were 'put before the cannon' (tied to big guns and exploded as capital punishment), beaten to death by the government, intentionally starved to death in large man-made famines, executed by the British army, or those who were too unfortunate to be at home while the Brits sacked their cities left, right and center.

Also the bad conditions in prisons. Even the last (Mughal) Indian Emperor perished in a prison.

Yeah, because any other nation would have easily prevented all those deaths in an underdeveloped and highly populated region. I doubt another coloniser would have caused significantly less deaths, the apporach to how to handle your colonies was virtually the same for all, milk them and if someone throws a tantrum you shoot him. Not being colonised would probably mean continued internal conflict and missing out on modernisation with probably a similar death toll.

Actually, until 1858 the region wasn't undeveloped, it was only undeveloped in the modern, industrial theory of development. Although it wasn't as great as it had been under Mughal Empire until 1700 (extremely wealthy nation that sometimes had the largest GDP in the world), the traditional architecture was still there. There were still roads even after Mughal collapse, there were the ancient cities and urban culture, a booming agriculture that had been there for centuries, the system of crops that kept the people well fed as well as allowed trading, the internal trade routes were still fledging, a kind of 'household economy' system, guilds and hereditary trades, and so on. In other words, Indian economy had mostly been working fine like it had been in 17th and 18th century.

That traditional infrastructure soon broke down with the collapse of both Mughal and Maratha empires, whose 70-year longwar had costed a lot to India. The new British rulers were clueless about how the existing system worked in India (which was almost two millenia old by this time), resulting in a collapse of agriculture and start of famines. The fact that British were too busy exploiting the region, putting harsh taxes and armed goons as tax collectors, fighting for the breakaways of former Mughal territory (Afghanistan, Sikh Empire) in wars and generally suppressing the Indians.

The problem came with the style of rule. Until British, all foreign invaders had either left and went back to home with lots of loot, or got incorporated into India and didn't disturb the economy that had been working like that for two millenia straight, eventually turning into Indians themselves. Mughals were foreign invaders at first, but made India their home and decided not to touch the working economy here, only enhance it in traditional way.

Meanwhile, the British ruled India as a colony, with a complete disregard for traditions, way of doing things and existing systems here, and combined with greedy exploitation and extreme brutality, it eventually caused the collapse of the whole Indian economy that India has never managed to recovered from.

Also, I agree with the modernization violence thing. But also there is this thing to know - India was already much ahead in modernization compared to other powers of the Asia, say the huge Qing Empire or the Tokugawa Shogunate. That's because as soon as Europeans built colonial trading posts, Indian kings and emperors (both Maratha and Mughal) were quick to copy their military systems, as well as do a number of small internal reforms. Modernization wouldn't have resulted in too much violence, as people were used to the new technology already. At least as long as it didn't result in changes in culture and religion.

[Ybbon]

If you really want to have this discussion, why don't you take it to VV where it belongs and open a new thread "Are the British Directly Responsible for 100 million Indian Deaths" it would be a better fit there than as an add-on here in TD chat.

[General Maximus]

I know, and that's why I stopped there despite having lots of more facts. There was no point in continuing that discussion here.

[Markas]

That figure is actually completely full of those who were 'put before the cannon' (tied to big guns and exploded as capital punishment), beaten to death by the government, intentionally starved to death in large man-made famines, executed by the British army, or those who were too unfortunate to be at home while the Brits sacked their cities left, right and center.

Being put before cannon was an old mughal punishment adopted by the British as it was considered more humane than flogging to death and was more acceptable to the indian populace. I'm not sure what Britain would have to gain form intentionally starving people but I'm sure your upcoming thread in the VV will give me plenty of time to scrutinize it. Luckily I have a week off.

[General Maximus]

Being put before cannon was an old mughal punishment adopted by the British as it was considered more humane than flogging to death and was more acceptable to the indian populace. I'm not sure what Britain would have to gain form intentionally starving people but I'm sure your upcoming thread in the VV will give me plenty of time to scrutinize it. Luckily I have a week off.

Well, Bengal Famine was devastating and there were hundreds more man-made famines, although you won't see my thread in VV so soon. I'll have to do some more research and collect some more facts before I think I can create a thread for a healthy debate.

Anyone of you ever seen a good mixology? Particularly with all that acrobatic action?

[Lord Oda Nobunaga]

I don't even know what mixology means.

[Inkie]

I have heard of it, but never of it involving acrobatic action.

[mishkin]

Come back maximus, we need to know.

[Niles Crane]

I expect Maximus is busy putting down the latest serf revolt on his land. Give him time, guys.

[Derpy Hooves]

​I just had an unfair dream. I dreamed that someone who was my best friend until two years ago (when he stopped all communications with me for some reason) called me up and we had a long talk. ;_;

[Lord Oda Nobunaga]

Two of my friends went to different colleges and we haven't spoken since. That was in 2013.

[Mhaedros]

I haven't even seen my best friend of my high school in 2 years. (I think it's the equvalent of high school, too lazy to look it up). We were best friends for like 5 years, then suddenly we just stopped speaking for no good reason. Oh wait, it was about the same time I found TWC wasn't it...

[Lord Oda Nobunaga]

Same story here, after grade 11 I joined TWC but I really got more active in 2012 when all my friends ran off.

[Spartan999]

Pretty much the same story over here.

LOL, so instead of the world ending in 2012 it was our social lives

[Lord Oda Nobunaga]

So we misinterpreted the meaning of those Mayan texts.

[mishkin]

Was just the end of a cycle

[Ngugi]

I haven't even seen my best friend of my high school in 2 years. (I think it's the equvalent of high school, too lazy to look it up). We were best friends for like 5 years, then suddenly we just stopped speaking for no good reason. Oh wait, it was about the same time I found TWC wasn't it...

It's OK, you musn't blame youself for that friend not getting an account too