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Thread: Help needed: Command Structure of Napoleon's Grande Armée

  1. #1
    General A. Skywalker's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Help needed: Command Structure of Napoleon's Grande Armée

    Good day to you!

    There are a few questions I would like to ask to experts on the topic of command structure in the Napoleonic Wars and especially the French army.
    The questions are quite specific, detailed and somwhat "unhistoric" in that way, which is why I've decided to create a thread here and don't search in literature.

    Imma just start with a very specific question and whoever wants to anwer it or give any comment can feel free to do so!

    Question: Was there a rigid protocol for addressing officers? It seems obvious, that a common soldier would always refer to an superior officer by rank and/or a French equivalent to "Sir". The question therefore aims at superior officers adressing lower ranks. Example: Would a Capitaine have adressed a Lieutenant, Sergent or Corporal always (meaning: mandatorily) by rank or - according to personal preference - also by name... forename or nickname even maybe?

    I know it's a strange question, but just fire at will!

  2. #2
    Praeses
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    Default Re: Help needed: Command Structure of Napoleon's Grande Armée

    IIRC Napoleon himself adressed men by their ranks. Napoleon had vast files on his soldiers and loved to pull out little tidbits to impress the men such as inspecting a unit and saying "ah, Caporal Leblanc, you were with me at Jena were you not?".

    Napoleon's Army of Italy was noted for its elaborate uniforms (once they had looted enough to buy uniforms) and ranks. This compared with the austere and ideologically earnest Army of the Rhine (before Napoleon took over the State) with its plain uniforms and (IIRC) habit of addressing officers and men as "Citoyen".

    So I guess officers referred to inferiors by their ranks in Napoleon's grande Armee as they had in the Army of Italy.

    There miught be an exception to the men addressing superiors by rank in certain situations. The Old Guard (known as the Grumblers or Grognards) were allowed a lot of leeway in certain areas of discipline as they were asked to perfomr tasks on the battlefield beyond other units capabilities. I imagine an Old Gurad might speak frankly to a superior, so long as he did not disobey an order.

    Likewise in extreme moments the men might speak informally to a superior, eg at Waterloo when Wellington inspected his nearly shgattered army the next day he was spotted and che4ered with cries of "Nosey!" (he had a big nose).
    Jatte lambastes Calico Rat

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    Default Re: Help needed: Command Structure of Napoleon's Grande Armée

    Soldats de ma vieille Garde, je vous fais mes adieux. Depuis vingt ans, je vous ai trouvés constamment sur le chemin de l'honneur et de la gloire. Dans ces derniers temps, comme dans ceux de notre prospérité, vous n'avez cessé d'être des modèles de bravoure et de fidélité. Avec des hommes tels que vous, notre cause n'était pas perdue. Mais la guerre était interminable ; c'eut été la guerre civile, et la France n'en serait devenue que plus malheureuse. J'ai donc sacrifié tous nos intérêts à ceux de la patrie ; je pars. Vous, mes amis, continuez de servir la France. Son bonheur était mon unique pensée ; il sera toujours l'objet de mes voeux ! Ne plaignez pas mon sort ; si j'ai consenti à me survivre, c'est pour servir encore à notre gloire ; je veux écrire les grandes choses que nous avons faites ensemble ! Adieu, mes enfants ! je voudrais vous presser tous sur mon coeur ; que j'embrasse au moins votre drapeau !
    (Les adieux de Fontainebleau, 1814) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvgDbsKUG8E

    It is possible that mon(sieur) in front of the addressed rank designation of a superior had already been in use at that time (e.g. mon lieutenant) but I am not certain about.
    Last edited by NogaOsibisa; October 23, 2014 at 11:50 PM.
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    General A. Skywalker's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Help needed: Command Structure of Napoleon's Grande Armée

    Thanks to the both of you, that helped a great deal!

    Another question about a different topic: Atrocities in the Peninsular War.
    I've read that Napoleon literally ordered rape and looting against the Spanish at some point in the war... as revenge/repression-tactics of sorts. Looting makes sense because of the Napoleonic agenda of "the army living off the land".
    However, I don't remember where I read about the raping and killing civilians..
    Can anyone say something about that? Is it considered a historical fact? Was it an explicit order, or did he just accept it?
    Last edited by General A. Skywalker; October 26, 2014 at 04:56 AM.

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    Prince of Essling's Avatar Napoleonic Enthusiast
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    Default Re: Help needed: Command Structure of Napoleon's Grande Armée

    Quote Originally Posted by General A. Skywalker View Post
    Thanks to the both of you, that helped a great deal!

    Another question about a different topic: Atrocities in the Peninsular War.
    I've read that Napoleon literally ordered rape and looting against the Spanish at some point in the war... as revenge/repression-tactics of sorts. Looting makes sense because of the Napoleonic agenda of "the army living off the land".
    However, I don't remember where I read about the raping and killing civilians..
    Can anyone say something about that? Is it considered a historical fact? Was it an explicit order, or did he just accept it?
    Historical fact that this did happen - certainly do not recollect having seen an explicit order from Boney. It was not universal occurrence.

    References can be found in various memoirs (e.g. Memoirs of a Napoleonic Officer (J B Barres). Barres recalled an incident in march 1810 where a few grenadiers and suttler fell behind their unit and were murdered with refinements of cruelty. As a reprisal the battalion was marched to village in which they had been killed, and burned it to the ground, herded the menfolk together & began to shoot them one by one until they identified the killers. Four were executed before the fifth pointed out the guilty who were then killed.
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    Default Re: Help needed: Command Structure of Napoleon's Grande Armée

    Quote Originally Posted by Prince of Essling View Post
    Historical fact that this did happen - certainly do not recollect having seen an explicit order from Boney. It was not universal occurrence....
    Indeed, it seems that anyone that starts a war in Spain finds it gets dirty pretty quickly. Hannibal had a reputation for fierce discipline (he cut his teeth in Iberia of course), and the Romans in Spain were notorious for their cruelty. The Conquista and Reconquista were marked by ethnic and religious cruelty, and in the 20th century the Spainish civil war was yet another abominable episode. It seems Iberia is a pretty cruel place.

    I don't recall reading about atrocities during the War of the Spanish Succession in Spain itself, in fact I can't recall really studying it much. Anyone familiar with that?
    Jatte lambastes Calico Rat

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