Agonizing Loading Screen Crashes

[Turtler]

Let me say that this mod is one of my favorite things in the entire Total War franchise, and the time I have spent playing it is amazing, fun, and inspirational in equal measure. However, I've been crippled by an absolutely agonizing amount of CTDs when loading screens are around. I'd estimate it crashes somewhere around 50% of the time when it is supposed to go into a loading screen, and considering that it takes something like two loading screens to just get from startup to the main menu to gameplay this makes it torturous to start or resume a campaign.

I have looked through the prior threads here and elsewhere. I have done almost everything in them- from removing large swaths of the loading screens in folder to reinstalling- and none have given a solution to this problem. No other functional mod I have played has had this, so I ask for help.

Also, I can confirm that it is strictly tied to the loading screens (those that show a sketched drawing and pithy quote while the bar loads). Once In-game CTDs are nonexistant, even over on-map loading (IE when the flags/shields make their parade after End Turn).

I have this mod in a separate folder that does not overwrite one of the vanillas. I would like to keep it that way.

Please help. I beg of you.

M2TW.system.log.txt.7z

[beckyolt]

I also have a problem with this. The mod is exceptionally crashy. It comes to the point that I avoid fighting two battles in the same turn as to avoid as much as possible facing too many loadscreens in a single turn to prevent crashes that'll render my efforts irrelevant.

[Geoffrey of Villehardouin]

Crashes are understandably annoying especially after finishing a battle. We had pondered about this problem before and could not find a cause. It is intermittent (rare in my own experience) and not specific to our mod, but that does not make these crashes any less annoying. Overall it seems that complaints came more frequently from players who either had memory or hard disk space issues with their computers and/or non-standard setups, e.g. were running the mod from outside the Medieval II folder.

During loading screens, the game processes a ton of data and needs e.g. to calculate a path for the retreating defeated army and update the stratmap (or create a battle map). My guess is that, as with Windows crashes in general, computer memory can become overloaded.

There are some thoughts about what to try here:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...uot-workaround
and here:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...-weird-crashes

[Turtler]

Crashes are understandably annoying especially after finishing a battle. We had pondered about this problem before and could not find a cause. It is intermittent (rare in my own experience) and not specific to our mod, but that does not make these crashes any less annoying. Overall it seems that complaints came more frequently from players who either had memory or hard disk space issues with their computers and/or non-standard setups, e.g. were running the mod from outside the Medieval II folder.

During loading screens, the game processes a ton of data and needs e.g. to calculate a path for the retreating defeated army and update the stratmap (or create a battle map). My guess is that, as with Windows crashes in general, computer memory can become overloaded.

There are some thoughts about what to try here:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...uot-workaround
and here:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...-weird-crashes

Thank you for the feedback, and for the reference I have my sole Kingdoms content on Steam even though I do have Vanilla Medieval II elsewhere.

However, I can confirm that none of my other Medieval II mods- or other Total War games or their mods period outside of a very specific setting on the infamous Rome II- behave like this (or at least not in any way I have noticed). On my computer, it is exclusive to this. As for the reference to it needing memory or hard disk space issues, this does not strike me as likely. My hard drive still has several hundred GBs free. While I do find that my computer's memory and other data have a tendency to "run high" far more than I would like, "running high" still leaves a lot of space and memory and indeed it has not prevented me from playing this mod successfully. This is why it is my firm conviction this problem is localized to this mod.

I understand the loading screens involve massive data processing, but I do not think the amount of data processing alone explains it. I did a stress test by lifting FOW in the game and ending several "high game" turns on it, and while it did take it forever it did not result in crashes. Likewise, I have not had any problems with the example cited in that other thread, Empire.

Which is why I feel obliged to bring this up. Even if it is not strictly speaking unique to your mod, it is apparently one of the most prominent sufferers of it.

[Geoffrey of Villehardouin]

Thank you for the feedback, and for the reference I have my sole Kingdoms content on Steam even though I do have Vanilla Medieval II elsewhere.

However, I can confirm that none of my other Medieval II mods- or other Total War games or their mods period outside of a very specific setting on the infamous Rome II- behave like this (or at least not in any way I have noticed). On my computer, it is exclusive to this. As for the reference to it needing memory or hard disk space issues, this does not strike me as likely. My hard drive still has several hundred GBs free. While I do find that my computer's memory and other data have a tendency to "run high" far more than I would like, "running high" still leaves a lot of space and memory and indeed it has not prevented me from playing this mod successfully. This is why it is my firm conviction this problem is localized to this mod.

I understand the loading screens involve massive data processing, but I do not think the amount of data processing alone explains it. I did a stress test by lifting FOW in the game and ending several "high game" turns on it, and while it did take it forever it did not result in crashes. Likewise, I have not had any problems with the example cited in that other thread, Empire.

Which is why I feel obliged to bring this up. Even if it is not strictly speaking unique to your mod, it is apparently one of the most prominent sufferers of it.

I totally sympathise with you and wish there was a solution. Since not all players are plagued by such crashes, one has to conclude that part of the problem is something specific to players' setups, probably memory related, in combination with the unique features of this mod: the many special scripts and large map. I do not know how the engine works but what is happening during the loading screens is a massive processing of data. The moving bar or filling arrow at the bottom shows the progress with the data, a bit like the bar that shows progress with copying data or printing. It is clear that there is a lot going on. One does not see these kinds of delays in game turns or at any other time, except when loading the game itself. Some players have removed some of the loading screens or replaced them with vanilla ones but that made no observable difference. If you or anyone else has ideas what to test or change we can try them out.

[Gigantus]

I found inconsistencies in the numbering of the data\text\quotes file - this may be the underlying reason for the crashes. A fix for English and German each is provided.

[Turtler]

I found inconsistencies in the numbering of the data\text\quotes file - this may be the underlying reason for the crashes. A fix for English and German each is provided.

God, thank you for your help Gigantus. I appreciate the help deeply, and something tells me this is more likely the cause than overclocking in the PC (even if the latter might be a factor). But while I do think it helps a lot(at least from what I have seen), it does not seem to have fixed things completely.

I applied the files (again? I cannot fully remember) and it looks like it has cut down the number of crashes in a major way. I stress "looks like" because I have not done an intense study of it and it may very well be a placebo effect in my analysis or just lucky draws in what gets triggered, but now it seems to be mildly irritating rather than crippling. It helps me play again, and that alone is amazing.

That being said, it seems like there are still loading screen crashes. Likely from the same reasons as before. They seem a lot less prominent than they once were and it took a bit to get these examples for you, but I distinctly remember a couple back-to-back CTDs like in the bad old days. I figure it might help all of us.

PS: The Text-DE on your link seems to be a download link for the Text-EN instead. It's not a problem for me as an Anglophone, but I figure people would want to know regardless

Thank you again..

@Geoffry

I appreciate the sympathy and help again. It seems like the root of the problem lies with what Gigantus identified, so here's hoping!

[Gigantus]

Thank you for pointing out the incorrect link - it's fixed now.

For some reason I do not have a descr_transition file in my set up. But then it shouldn't be needed as the quotes do not exceed 120. Could you upload that file for me if it present in your set up?
After the loading screen (going back to the strategic map) the game loads faction symbols - I will have a look if there is a problem, but I doubt it as this wouldn't be random at all.

mods/1648_2/data/menu/symbols/FE_buttons_48/symbol48_england.tga

[Turtler]

Thank you for pointing out the incorrect link - it's fixed now.

It is the very least I could do. So no worries.

For some reason I do not have a descr_transition file in my set up. But then it shouldn't be needed as the quotes do not exceed 120. Could you upload that file for me if it present in your set up?

It was not present in my setup; I checked carefully myself with the search engine. However, I took the liberty of creating my own by importing a file of that from one of the other mods and then chopping it down to the number of quotes for 1648. It seems like the result was amazing.

I have not had an immense amount of time for me to test it, but since I made that edit I have not suffered a single CTD, even after I ran a stress test that featured me jumping through my dozen or so saves in one go and trying out some quick battles. Your prior remedy was already a major improvement over things before, but CTDs were sitll noticeable enough that I'm all but certain I'd have run into one by now even with luck of the draw. I don't know if this is the definitive answer that solved all CTDs, that it's merely downgraded them to "very rare but significantly more than vanilla", or whether I've just been obscenely lucky, and I can't discount the possibility of other factors being at play. However, I'll upload the descr_trans file I created and note that it has helped significantly for me.

After the loading screen (going back to the strategic map) the game loads faction symbols - I will have a look if there is a problem, but I doubt it as this wouldn't be random at all.

I appreciate it and encourage it. I'm not sure if it is at play, but if nothing else checking off everything could be a major help. Even if this remedy has completely cured mine (and i'm not entirely sure it has) it might work for others.

mods/1648_2/data/menu/symbols/FE_buttons_48/symbol48_england.tga

What about it?

[Gigantus]

I will keep the idea about the transition file - so far I had only thought that it was just providing a base for the quotes was only needed if the quotes exceeded the standard 120 entries.

Edit: it may explain why we never had problems in Rise of three Kingdoms - 159 quotes and 160 entries in descr_transition.

[Geoffrey of Villehardouin]

If it helps, I do not have descr_transition_screen in my data folder and have not replaced the quotes with the new file. I have no more loading screen crashes than in Stainless Steel or other mods. I probably have not had loading screen crashes in Three Kingdoms but I cannot see that file anywhere in my RoTK installation. In any case, I have added it to my 1648 installation and will do some tests.

[Gigantus]

The RotK transition file is dated July 2014 in my build - but I will edit it to have the same number entries as the quotes and include in the next RotK patch.

[k/t]

Gigantus is one of the best.

[Turtler]

Gigantus is one of the best.

Yes he Is!

I will keep the idea about the transition file - so far I had only thought that it was just providing a base for the quotes was only needed if the quotes exceeded the standard 120 entries.

Edit: it may explain why we never had problems in Rise of three Kingdoms - 159 quotes and 160 entries in descr_transition.

Interesting. Not sure what to say about that; especially since a lot of the others haven't had this sort of trouble. Just that it looks like it has worked for me (and I can proudly report I am still CTD free). Still, thank you for all the help, and + Red definitely.

If it helps, I do not have descr_transition_screen in my data folder and have not replaced the quotes with the new file. I have no more loading screen crashes than in Stainless Steel or other mods. I probably have not had loading screen crashes in Three Kingdoms but I cannot see that file anywhere in my RoTK installation. In any case, I have added it to my 1648 installation and will do some tests.

Good luck with it. Out of curiosity, how many loading screen crashes do you get on S-squared and other mods in comparison to Vanilla?

Also, thanks for you help, and + Rep.

Thanks for everything.

@Beckyolt Still there? Have these helped you ata ll?

[beckyolt]

Yo.

I downloaded this

I found inconsistencies in the numbering of the data\text\quotes file - this may be the underlying reason for the crashes. A fix for English and German each is provided.

and the game seems to be more stable even though I got one crash. I've just tested it a little though, so it's too early to tell if it made any large difference.

[Turtler]

Yo.

I downloaded this




and the game seems to be more stable even though I got one crash. I've just tested it a little though, so it's too early to tell if it made any large difference.

Glad to hear. Have you considered DLing the descr_transition, either that I put up or that Geof says he added into the general bit?

Has that had any effect ont hings?

[Geoffrey of Villehardouin]

Using the descr_transition_screen file resulted in two loading screen crashes in three evenings of playing a campaign. This is about normal for me except in the first few turns of a campaign, when loading screen crashes can be more frequent.

There may be a hint in that. Creative Assembly recommended the game is run from the SEGA/Medieval directory in Program Files. Most people who had reported loading screen crashes have either had space problems in their computer or had moved the mod outside that folder. If the engine is trying to update a default file and there are conflicts (e.g. the missing quote or some new text, size, address, whatever), it may crash at that point and may continue to crash on future loading screens as long as conflicts remain. Quote number 90 had been removed to position 111 because it was never coming up, so that is also suspicious (i.e. why was quote 90 never coming up just when it had that position?). If the mod installation has moreover been moved to the user area and if the relevant crucial files are in virtual store, updating the game files may be even trickier and the crashes may persist longer into the campaign, or may never stop. I am guessing of course - but certainly this is not a problem everyone is having, so it must have something to do with the way the mod is run on different computers.

I will continue testing the descr_transition_screens and screens and quotes but as I do not have this problem in the first place (or at least it is very rare) it may be better to post the file so those of you who have a problem can try it. It is on my Total War computer at home, so bear with me until this evening (Magdeburg DE time). If that fails to fix your problem, I would recommend you find a way to run your game from within the Medieval folder in Program Files/SEGA.

[Turtler]

Using the descr_transition_screen file resulted in two loading screen crashes in three evenings of playing a campaign. This is about normal for me except in the first few turns of a campaign, when loading screen crashes can be more frequent.

There may be a hint in that. Creative Assembly recommended the game is run from the SEGA/Medieval directory in Program Files. Most people who had reported loading screen crashes have either had space problems in their computer or had moved the mod outside that folder. If the engine is trying to update a default file and there are conflicts (e.g. the missing quote or some new text, size, address, whatever), it may crash at that point and may continue to crash on future loading screens as long as conflicts remain. Quote number 90 had been removed to position 111 because it was never coming up, so that is also suspicious (i.e. why was quote 90 never coming up just when it had that position?). If the mod installation has moreover been moved to the user area and if the relevant crucial files are in virtual store, updating the game files may be even trickier and the crashes may persist longer into the campaign, or may never stop. I am guessing of course - but certainly this is not a problem everyone is having, so it must have something to do with the way the mod is run on different computers.

I will continue testing the descr_transition_screens and screens and quotes but as I do not have this problem in the first place (or at least it is very rare) it may be better to post the file so those of you who have a problem can try it. It is on my Total War computer at home, so bear with me until this evening (Magdeburg DE time). If that fails to fix your problem, I would recommend you find a way to run your game from within the Medieval folder in Program Files/SEGA.

Thank you, though that post was mostly directed at beckyolt, in the interests of seeing if that change had had an effect. It certainly seems like it has fixed mine.

[beckyolt]

I have the mod inside the "mods" folder in the Medieval folder. Does that or you're saying it should be exactly in the Medieval folder?

[Geoffrey of Villehardouin]

The mod should be inside the mods folder.

Here is the descr_transition_screen file: descr_transition_screen.txt.

It should be placed in the data folder. Check how many quotes you have in the quotes file in data/text. If there are 113 quotes use it as it is. If there are 112 quotes, delete the last two lines from descr_transition_screen (refering to quote 113), i.e. the numbers should increment up to the exact number of quotes there are in the mod.

Let us know if the situation with the crashes has improved.