Version 4.0 Released

[Silven]

-----Version 4.0 Has Been Released!!-----

This release is fully compatible with CA Patch Live15, also known as The Emperor Edition. STEP has also been updated to Version 1.4 for equal compatibility.

-Updated For Perfect Compatibility with EE.

STIM 4.0 will now work with all 4 major campaigns and DLC.
This includes Grand Campaign, Caesar In Gaul, Hannibal At The Gates, and Imperator Augustus.

---Battle Behavior
-Fatigue Thresholds increased by roughly 10%.

This will increase the amount of time required to progress to each stage of fatigue, for both becoming more tired and recovering.

-Morale Formula reworked to be more fluid, dynamic, and responsive.

This part is honestly too complicated to explain in detail. Just know that morale performance should behave more intuitively.

-Transport Ship ramming damage reduced even further.

Original STIM ranges were between 94 and 129. They now range between 30 and 60.

-Slight Reduction to Charge Kill Rates, particularly in Cavalry.

Cavalry charges were a little too effective. This change in combination with the melee hit chance change should help prevent hammer and anvil tactics becoming tedious.

-Slight Increase in Melee Hit Chances.
-Reduced Falx_Inf spacings by 0.1.

---Unit Adjustments
-Global Reduction to Elephant Hitpoints by 200.

Part of the long-requested Elephant nerf. Looking for feedback on this.

-Changed all Melee Infantry rank depths from values ranging from 6 to 8, to a global 6.

Specialty units like Ambushers and Mobs remain at wider values like 5 and 4.

-Changed all Cavalry rank depths from values ranging from 2 to 6, to a global 4.

Will make Cavalry performance more uniform and Charge impact wider.

-Ignored EE patch unit ability changes, as it got crazy with ability removals.

Classic CA knee-jerk reaction.
STIM will maintain its removal of magic abilities, while continuing to make standard formations available to a larger range of units that make sense to have them.
(Shield Screen, Shield Wall, Testudo, Cantabrian Circle, Flying Wedge, etc.)

-Global Increase to Melee Defence by 10 for every unit in the game.
-Increased Ammo Pool for Cheiroballistra, Scorpion Artillery, and Polybolos Artillery.
-Global Decrease to Charge Value by 10 for all Cavalry units.
-Global Decrease to Charge Value by 5 for all Elephant units.

---Weapon Adjustments
-Added 2 new bow types introduced by EE.

Updated these new bow types to follow the same rules in damage models, flaming arrow damage models, and effective ranges.

-Removed Balkan Sword Bonus Vs Cav, Elephants, and Infantry.
-Removed Falx and Rhomphaia Bonus Vs Infantry.
-Increased Falx and Rhomphais Bonus Vs Cav and Elephants by 5.
-Increased all Pike standard damage by 4.
-Decreased all Pike Bonus Vs Cav and Elephants to 5, as the Pike Wall formation carries its own large bonus.
-Increased Mounted Heavy Shot effective range from 100 to 105.
-Artillery damage and AP damage values shuffled according to EE changes.
-Artillery reload times adjusted according to EE changes. (times either remained the same or were made faster.)
-Precursor Javelins reload times reduced (made faster) from 40 to 15.
-Increased Javelin Bonus Vs Cav and Elephants from 0 to 5 for all except _light and _wooden javelins.
-All Shields Defense Value reduced by 5.

---Campaign Behavior
-Small adjustments to several seasonal effects.

Some effects that altered movement range changed to instead affect unit morale.
Public Order penalties and agriculture bonuses and penalties received small tweaks.

-All agent "Manipulate" action success rates reduced.

Levels 1, 2, and 3 down from 10, 20, and 30 percent chance, to 3, 6, and 9 percent chance.

-Reapplied hidden faction income bonus to include new factions and reduced effects to STIM values.

Original Vanilla values ranged from 250 to 2000. STIM values now range from 200 to 600.

-Added 19 New Major Factions to Major Faction Survival Script, across 3 different campaigns.

CiG has 4 new factions in this list, HatG has 5 new factions in this list, and EE has 10 new factions in this list.

-Removed rom_roxolani, rom_massagetae, and rom_scythia from Scripts Major Faction Array.
-Increased Script bonuses during the circumstance of Major Attacker Vs Minor Defender.
-Increased Script bonuses during the circumstance of Rome Vs Major Defender.
-Improved Campaign AI budget spending and allocation policies.
-Very small reduction to land replenishment rate.

---Mod Patching
-Several redundant tables that no longer serve a purpose removed.

Includes building effect tables that referenced old building chains and keys.
Includes building unlock order of units.
Includes trigger_effects table that adjusted Roman Mad trait probability.
In most cases, these tables were removed as CA implemented their own fix with the new building chains or adjustments.

-Reimported scripting.lua and startpos.esf to adjust zoom limits and Turns Per Year.
-Army Cap increase carried over to EE campaign.
-All Daughters of Mars FLC units (20 in total) updated and now included.
-Matched Technology Research Times to EE changes, carrying over STIM time increases. (35 techs in total).
-Updated over 100 units armour, weapons, animations, and shields to match EE.



As an added bonus for those who are interested in modding and how I keep track of all my changes from patch to patch, I'm going to copy/paste my personal db changelog notes for STIM 4.0 here.
You don't need to read this, I just thought some of you might find it interesting to know what the non-laymen changelog notes look like and how many changes that don't get listed above are actually made to make things compatible with the current version of TWR2.

STIM 4.0 PFM Notes

Silven Total Improvement Mod - Rev. 4 Keys Reserved - 140000 - 145000 keys currently used - 140000 - 140499 (for garrisons armed_citizenry_units_to_unit_groups_junctions) 140500 - 140999 (for building garrison groups building_level_armed_citizenry_junctions) 141000 - 141499 (for unit rearrangement building_units_allowed) 143000 - 143999 (unit expansion buildings) 144000 - 144999 (unit expansion units) Patch 15 - Imperial Edition Version 4.0 campaigns/main_rome/scripting.lua reimported file changed scripting.game_interface:set_zoom_limit FROM(1.1, 0.8) TO (1.4, 0.3) campaigns/main_rome/startpos.esf reimported file changed CAMPAIGN_CALENDAR first value FROM 1 TO 4 campaigns/main_emperor/emp_start.lua changed cm:set_default_zoom_limit FROM (1.1, 0.65) TO (1.4, 0.3) _kv_fatigue_STIM increased all threshold_ values by roughly 10% active FROM 4900 TO 5400 winded FROM 10000 TO 11000 tired FROM 15500 TO 17000 very_tired FROM 21000 TO 23000 exhausted FROM 27000 TO 30000 max FROM 29000 TO 32000 _kv_morale_STIM_OT decreased extended_casualties_penalty_80 from -80 to -70 increased losing_combat_significantly from -10 to -15 decreased fighting_cavalry FROM -10 TO -5 added new max_routing_enemies_to_consider at 9 added new max_routing_friends_to_consider at 9 added new post_rally_no_rout_timer at 45 decreased recent_casualties_penalty_33 from -35 to -30 decreased recent_casualties_penalty_50 from -75 to -70 added new routing_enemies_effect_weighting at 1.2 added new routing_friends_effect_weighting at 2.5 increased total_casualties_penalty_40 from 0 to -5 increased total_casualties_penalty_60 from -30 to -35 increased total_casualties_penalty_80 from -80 to -85 increased total_casualties_penalty_90 from -160 to -170 decreased ume_concerned_attacked_by_artillery from -10 to -5 increased ume_concerned_captain_died_recently from -2 to -5 decreased ume_concerned_damaged_by_artillery from -15 to -10 increased ume_concerned_exhausted from -4 to -5 increased ume_concerned_flanks_exposed_multiple from -10 to -15 increased ume_concerned_very_tired from -3 to -4 increased ume_concerned_tired from -2 to -3 decreased ume_concerned_unit_frightened from -22 to -20 decreased ume_encouraged_flanks_secure from 15 to 10 decreased ume_encouraged_inspired from 30 to 20 decreased ums_broken_threshold_upper from 5 to -5 increased ums_shaken_threshold_lower from 15 to 10 increased ums_wavering_threshold_lower from 0 to -5 decreased ums_wavering_threshold_upper from 15 to 10 _kv_rules_STIM decreased collision_damage_armour_penetration_ratio FROM 0.75 TO 0.65 decreased collision_damage_maximum FROM 240 TO 160 changed melee_defence_direction_penalty_coefficient_rear FROM 0 TO 0.01 increased melee_hit_chance_min FROM 4 TO 8 increased melee_hit_chance_base FROM 8 TO 14 increased melee_hit_chance_max FROM 16 TO 22 decreased melee_matched_combat_percentage FROM 85 TO 80 battle_entities_STIM_elephant reduced elephant hitpoints from 800 to 600 reduced indian_armoured_elephant hitpoints from 1100 to 900 reduced indian_elephant hitpoints from 900 to 700 building_effects_junction_STIM_[barbfood, culture, foodpenalty] all 3 tables deleted and removed, no longer serve any purpose building_level_armed_citizenry_junctions_STIM OVERWROTE all building_level entries, so that new building keys are used instead of old otherwise, unit_group references and the units held within them remained the same building_level_required_technology_junctions deleted and removed table, no longer useful. potential table to revisit when unit unlock order shuffle becomes necessary again. building_levels reimported table, reapplied build time increases 1 to 2 100% 2 to 4 100% 3 to 5 66% 4 to 6 50% 5 to 7 40% 6 to 8 33% 8 to 11 37% 10 to 13 30% 12 to 16 33% building_units_allowed deleted and removed table, no longer useful. potential table to revisit when unit unlock order shuffle becomes necessary again. cai_personalities_budget_allocations_STIM reduced all army_funding_cap from 3500 to 1500 reduced all army_turns_of_inactivity_until_cap from 4 to 2 increased construction_percentage_of_pool_to_save_on_fail from 0 to 50 reduced diplomacy_funding_cap from 3000 to 1000 reduced diplomacy_turns_of_inactivity_until_cap from 15 to 2 reduced navy_funding_cap from 2500 to 1000 reduced navy_turns_of_inactivity_until_cap from 5 to 2 campaign_variables_STIM_replenish reduced replenishment_base_land from 5 to 4 character_skill_level_to_effects_junctions_STIM reduced agent_champion_authority_2_unity rom_agent_skill_action_mod_all_manipulate_persuade FROM 10, 20, 30 TO 3, 6, 9 reduced agent_champion_subterfuge_2_artifice rom_agent_skill_action_mod_all_manipulate_tempt FROM 10, 20, 30 TO 3, 6, 9 reduced agent_champion_zeal_2_strength rom_agent_skill_action_mod_all_manipulate_coerce FROM 10, 20, 30 TO 3, 6, 9 reduced agent_dignitary_authority_2_philosophy rom_agent_skill_action_mod_all_manipulate_persuade FROM 10, 20, 30 TO 3, 6, 9 reduced agent_dignitary_subterfuge_2_intrigue rom_agent_skill_action_mod_all_manipulate_tempt FROM 10, 20, 30 TO 3, 6, 9 reduced agent_dignitary_zeal_2_doom rom_agent_skill_action_mod_all_manipulate_coerce FROM 10, 20, 30 TO 3, 6, 9 reduced agent_spy_authority_2_collaboration rom_agent_skill_action_mod_all_manipulate_persuade FROM 10, 20, 30 TO 3, 6, 9 reduced agent_spy_subterfuge_2_clandestinity rom_agent_skill_action_mod_all_manipulate_tempt FROM 10, 20, 30 TO 3, 6, 9 reduced agent_spy_zeal_2_murder rom_agent_skill_action_mod_all_manipulate_coerce FROM 10, 20, 30 TO 3, 6, 9 effect_bundles_to_effects_junctions_STIM_fincome reimported rom_building_gdp_subsistence_faction_capital_hidden portion of new table included all entries found in new P15 table, but reduced all values FROM 250 - 2000 TO 200 - 600 effect_bundles_to_effects_junctions_STIM_seasons increased rom_faction_public_order_events FOR pun_season_autumn_dry FROM -1 TO -2 decreased rom_faction_public_order_events FOR pun_season_autumn_early FROM -2 TO -1 changed rom_force_campaign_mod_movement_range TO rom_force_unit_mod_morale FOR pun_season_autumn_late AT 5 changed rom_force_campaign_mod_movement_range TO rom_force_unit_mod_morale FOR pun_season_autumn AT 3 reduced rom_force_campaign_mod_movement_range FOR pun_season_summer_dry FROM -5 TO -4 reduced rom_force_unit_mod_morale FOR pun_season_summer_dry FROM -5 TO -4 reduced rom_force_campaign_mod_movement_range FOR pun_season_summer_harsh FROM -10 TO -8 reduced rom_force_unit_mod_morale FOR pun_season_summer_harsh FROM -8 TO -7 reduced rom_force_campaign_mod_movement_range FOR pun_season_winter_harsh FROM -15 TO -12 reduced rom_force_campaign_mod_movement_range FOR pun_season_winter_mild FROM -5 TO -4 increased rom_building_gdp_mod_agriculture_all FOR pun_season_winter_wet FROM -20 TO -25 increased rom_faction_public_order_events FOR pun_season_winter_wet FROM -2 TO -3 decreased rom_force_campaign_mod_movement_range FOR pun_season_winter_wet FROM -10 TO -8 increased rom_force_unit_mod_morale FOR pun_season_winter_wet FROM -7 TO -10 increased rom_force_campaign_mod_movement_range FOR pun_season_winter FROM -5 TO -8 decreased rom_force_unit_mod_morale FOR pun_season_winter FROM -10 TO -8 fame_levels_STIM_OT main_gaul increased army_cap from 9 to 10 @ lvl2 increased army_cap from 12 to 14 @ lvl3 increased army_cap from 15 to 18 @ lvl4 main_punic, main_emperor, and main_rome increased army_cap from 8 to 9 @ lvl3 increased army_cap from 10 to 11 @ lvl4 increased army_cap from 12 to 13 @ lvl5 increased army_cap from 14 to 15 @ lvl6 increased army_cap from 16 to 18 @ lvl7 land_units_STIM_artillery increased dismounted_melee_defence FOR all units FROM 4 TO 14 increased melee_defence FOR all units FROM 4 TO 14 increased all _Cheiroballistra and _Scorpion_Bastion ammo FROM 25 and 30 TO 40 increased all _Polybolos ammo FROM 15 TO 60 increased all _Polybolos_Bastion FROM 30 TO 80 increased all _Scorpion ammo FROM 15 TO 30 land_units_STIM_cavalry increased dismounted_melee_defence FOR all units by global increase of 10 increased melee_defence FOR all units by global increase of 10 changed Cel_Raiding_Horsemen primary_melee_weapon FROM rome_shortsword TO rome_celtic_hellenic_sword_cav " " armour FROM cloth TO light_padded changed Aux_ and Mer_ Scy_Armour_Horse_Archers armour FROM leather TO spolas changed Dac_Noble_Horsemen armour FROM scale TO scale_elite changed Aux_, Mer_, and Ill_Cav armour FROM cloth TO chest changed Gre_Companion_Cav armour FROM bronze TO bronze_elite changed Mer_, Afr_Numidian_Cav primary_missile_weapon FROM rome_javelin TO rome_javelin_improved changed Mer_, Afr_Numidian_Noble_Cav primary_missile_weapon FROM rome_javelin TO rome_javelin_improved changed Aux_Num_Cav primary_missile_weapon FROM rome_javelin TO rome_javelin_improved changed Aux_, Mer_Scy_Armour_horse_Archers primary_missile_weapon FROM rome_composite_bow TO rome_composite_bow_horse changed Aux_, Mer_, Ibe_Cantabrian_Cav shield FROM caetra_cavalry TO caetra changed all units rank_depth FROM 2-6 TO 4 added 4 new units (holdovers never completed during the DOM FLC) Ger_Riders_Hunt Mer_Ste_Amazonian_Riders increased charge_bonus FROM 4 TO 30 Ste_Amazonian_Riders increased charge_bonus FROM 4 TO 30 Ste_Noblewomen increased charge_bonus FROM 15 TO 33 changed all units with man_animation AT rome_man_javelin_cavalry TO rome_man_javelin_sword_shield_cavalry reduced charge_bonus GLOBALLY by 10 land_units_STIM_elephants reduced charge_bonus FOR all units by a global decrease of 5 increased dismounted_melee_defence FOR all units by global increase of 10 increased melee_defence FOR all units by global increase of 10 land_units_STIM_inf_melee increased dismounted_melee_defence FOR all units by global increase of 10 increased melee_defence FOR all units (EXCEPT PIKES) by global increase of 10 pike unit melee_defence remains the same from STIM 3.51 table in contrast to P15 reduction changed Gre_Silver_Shield_Pike armour FROM bronze TO bronze_elite changed Gre_Foot_Companions armour FROM bronze TO spolas changed Cel_Levy_Freemen primary_melee_weapon FROM rome_celtic_spear TO rome_celtic_spear_anti_cav changed Dac_Heavy_Spears primary_melee_weapon FROM rome_celtic_spear TO rome_celtic_spear_anti_cav changed Aux_Ibe_Sword, Gre_Levy_Thureos_Spears, Gre_Royal_Peltasts, Gre_Thureos Spears, Ibe_Lusitani_Guerillas, Ibe_Sword, Ill_Marines, Ill_Thureos_Spears, Mer_Gre_Thureos_Spears, Mer_Ibe_Sword primary_missile_weapon FROM rome_iron_javelin, rome_javelin_precursor TO rome_javelin_light changed Dac_Armoured_Spears shield FROM cavalry TO celtic all units with rank_depth set to 6-8 set to 6 (regular units) 5 remained 5 (mobs) 3 increased to 4 (Ger_Berserkers) added 12 new units (holdovers never completed during the DOM FLC) Ger_Hex_Bearers melee_defence increased by 10, melee_attack reduced by 3 to 47 Ger_Round_Shield_Sword melee_defence increased by 10, ammo reduced to 1 Ger_Spear_Wall ammo reduced to 1, Ger_Spearwomen ammo reduced to 1 Ibe_Lusitani_Swordswomen ammo reduced to 1 Mer_Ger_Spearwomen ammo reduced to 1 Mer_Ibe_Lusitani_Swordswomen ammo reduced to 1 Mer_Kushite_Shieldwomen Mer_Rom_Gladiatrices melee_attack reduced by 5 to 52, morale reduced by 5 to 60 Mer_Rom_Gladiatrices_Spear Rom_Gladiatrices melee_attack reduced by 5 to 52, morale reduced by 5 to 60 Rom_Gladiatrices_Spear changed all axe/club wielding units with man_animation AT rome_man_sword_shield TO rome_man_axe_shield land_units_STIM_inf_ranged increased dismounted_melee_defence FOR all units by global increase of 10 increased melee_defence FOR all units by global increase of 10 changed Aux_, Mer, Gre_Rhodian_Slingers armour FROM cloth TO light_padded changed Eas_Elite_Persian_Archers armour FROM cloth TO light_padded increased Gre_Agrianian_Axemen melee_attack FROM 22 TO 30 increased Aux_, Mer_, Thr_Peltasts melee_attack FROM 22 TO 28 changed Aux_Gre_Peltasts primary_melee_weapon FROM rome_kopis TO rome_shortsword changed Aux_, Mer_Gal_Gallic_Hunters primary_missile_weapon FROM rome_bow TO rome_bow_long changed Cel_Gallic_Hunters primary_missile_weapon FROM rome_bow TO rome_bow_long changed Dac_Heavy_Bowmen primary_missile_weapon FROM rome_bow TO rome_bow_long changed Thr_Skirm primary_missile_weapon FROM rome_javelin TO rome_javelin_improved increased Bri_Skirm reload FROM 8 TO 10 changed all units with man_animation AT rome_man_javelin TO rome_man_javelin_[axe, sword]_shield Bri_Ambushers changed to rome_man_sword_shield added 4 new units (holdovers never completed during the DOM FLC) Ger_Cimbri_Bowwomen Ger_Horse_Runners Gre_Gorgos_Skirmishers Mer_Gre_Gorgos_Skirmishers land_units_to_unit_abilites_junctions added all new units abilities, omitting magic abilities already removed by STIM also used STIM 3.51 table instead of new P15 table, as it got crazy with ability removals Ger_Riders_Hunt - form_wedge Mer_Ste_Amazonian_Riders - cantabrian_circle Ste_Amazonian_Riders - cantabrian_circle Ste_Noblewomen - cantabrian_circle Ger_Hex_Bearers - form_shield_wall, screech Ger_Round_Shield_Sword - form_shield_wall Ger_Spear_Wall - form_shield_screen Ger_Spearwomen - form_shield_screen, screech Ibe_Lusitani_Swordswomen - form_shield_wall Mer_Ger_Spearwomen - form_shield_screen, screech Mer_Ibe_Lusitani_Swordswomen - form_shield_wall Mer_Kushite_Shieldwomen - form_pike_square Mer_Rom_Gladiatrices_Spear - form_pike_square, frenzy Mer_Rom_Gladiatrices - frenzy Rom_Gladiatrices_Spear - form_pike_square, frenzy Rom_Gladiatrices - frenzy Ger_Cimbri_Bowwomen - none Ger_Horse_Runners - none Gre_Gorgos_Skirmishers - none Mer_Gre_Gorgos_Skirmishers - none removed Vigiles - form_pike_square added Afr_Numidian_Noble_Cav - cantabrian_circle added Bac_Royal_Guard - form_hoplite_phalanx added Ger_Wolf_Warriors - frenzy added Mer_Num_Noble_Cav - cantabrian_circle main_units_STIM_egy_inf added multiplayer_cap of 4 to Aux_ and Mer_ main_units_STIM_unitcaps changed Afr_Numidian_Noble_Cav weight FROM heavy TO medium changed Aux_Ind_War_Elephant weight FROM medium TO very_heavy reduced Gre_Royal_Guard multiplayer_cost and recruitment_cost FROM 1360 TO 1260 reduced Gre_Royal_Spartans multiplayer_cost and recruitment_cost FROM 1300 TO 1250 reduced Ind_Armour_Elephants recruitment_cost FROM 2100 TO 1800 increased weight FROM very_heavy TO super_heavy reduced multiplayer_cap FROM 2 TO 1 changed Ind_War_Elephants weight FROM medium TO very_heavy melee_weapons_STIM_CavNerf reduced rome_balkan_sword bonus_v_[elephants, cavalry, infantry] FROM 5 TO 0 changed rome_falx bonus_v_[elephants, cavalry, infantry] FROM [5, 5, 10] TO [10, 10, 0] reduced damage FROM 30 TO 25, ap_damage FROM 16 TO 14 changed rome_rhomphaia bonus_v_[elephants, cavalry, infantry] FROM [10, 10, 15] TO [15, 15, 0] reduced damage FROM 35 TO 30, ap_damage FROM 16 TO 15 melee_weapons_STIM_pikes increased rome_pike damage FROM 16 TO 20 increased rome_pike_elite damage FROM 20 TO 24 increased rome_pike_levy FROM 13 TO 16 decreased rome_pike bonus_v_[elephants, cavalry] FROM 10 TO 5 decreased rome_pike_elite bonus_v_[elephants, cavalry] FROM 15 TO 5 missile_weapons_to_projectiles added rome_bow_long TO arrow_flaming_long naval_ramming_events_STIM_trans reduced base_damage trn_heavy FROM 94 TO 30 trn_medium FROM 105 TO 40 trn_light FROM 121 TO 50 trn_trn FROM 129 TO 60 projectiles_STIM_arrow fixed placement of arrow_fighting_tower, arrow_tower, arrow_tower_upgraded in the table added 2 new entries, arrow_flaming_long and arrow_normal_long removed contact_stat_effect of flaming_projectiles FROM arrow_flaming_long decreased arrow_normal_long damage FROM 31 TO 23 ap_damage FROM 4 TO 2 increased arrow_flaming_long damage FROM 15 TO 22 ap_damage FROM 1 TO 7 increased arrow_normal_long effective_range FROM 125 TO 140 increased arrow_flaming_long effective_range FROM 125 TO 130 increased _horse_heavy variants effective_range FROM 100 TO 105 increased arrow_long damage FROM 18 TO 21 projectiles_STIM_artillery copied all P15 changes to damage and ap_damage to STIM table[mostly dam and ap shuffling] copied all P15 changes to base_reload_time to STIM table [times left the same or increased] projectiles_STIM_javelin reduced javelin_[iron, prec, heavy, light, normal] base_reload_time FROM 40 TO 15 increased bonus_v_[cavalry and elephant] FROM 0 TO 5 for all except javelin_[light, wooden] technologies_STIM decreased rom_carthage_engineering_siege_armoured_siege_engineers research_points_required FROM 1400 TO 900 decreased rom_carthage_engineering_siege_elephant_ram research_points_required FROM 2300 TO 1500 decreased rom_carthage_engineering_siege_siege_tower research_points_required FROM 800 TO 700 decreased rom_eastern_engineering_siege_elephant_ram research_points_required FROM 2300 TO 1400 decreased rom_eastern_siege_siege_tower research_points_required FROM 900 TO 700 increased rom_egypt_engineering_siege_ammunition_stores research_points_required FROM 700 TO 900 decreased rom_egypt_engineering_siege_armoured_siege_engineers research_points_required FROM 1600 TO 1400 increased rom_egypt_engineering_siege_central_grain_warehouse research_points_required FROM 600 TO 700 decreased rom_egypt_engineering_siege_siege_tower research_points_required FROM 800 TO 700 decreased rom_egypt_engineering_top_engineering research_points_required FROM 700 TO 600 decreased rom_roman_engineering_siege_ammunition_stores research_points_required FROM 900 TO 600 increased rom_roman_engineering_siege_armoured_siege_engines research_points_required FROM 900 TO 2100 decreased rom_roman_engineering_siege_battering_ram research_points_required FROM 700 TO 400 decreased rom_roman_engineering_siege_boiling_oil research_points_required FROM 700 TO 600 decreased rom_roman_engineering_siege_central_grain_warehouse research_points_required FROM 2100 TO 1200 decreased rom_roman_engineering_siege_improved_defensive_artillery research_points_required FROM 3100 TO 2900 increased rom_roman_engineering_siege_onager research_points_required FROM 1400 TO 2900 decreased rom_roman_engineering_siege_siege_tower research_points_required FROM 900 TO 800 increased rom_roman_engineering_top_engineering research_points_required FROM 700 TO 1400 decreased rom_roman_military_management_cohort_organisation research_points_required FROM 2500 TO 2100 decreased rom_roman_military_management_professional_soldiery research_points_required FROM 3500 TO 2900 added 14 new technologies; increased research_points_required accordingly technology_unit_upgrades added 8 new techs for Emp_Rom_ units trigger_effects_STIM deleted table and removed from STIM vanilla reduced chance from 75 to 0, where STIM reduced from 75 to 1 unit_shield_types_STIM_OT added missing shield type from previous patch, germanic_wall. reverted value to P14.1, then added global increase of 5 to shield_defence_value done to keep germanic_wall in line with all the other shields after testing, decided to reduce global shield_defence_value by 5. [P15 often traded roughly 10 defence less for 10 armour more] unit_spacings_STIM added falx_inf to table reduced falx_inf close_formation_spacing_horizontal FROM 1.4 TO 1.3 reduced falx_inf close_formation_spacing_variation FROM 0.6 TO 0.5 units_to_groupings_military_permissions reimported table to include over 200 new additions reapplied the single change to this table, which is deleting Gre_Slingers from seleucid lua_scripts episodicscripting.lua reimported table. added local improved_majors line. added OK, improved_empires = pcall(require, "lua_scripts.improved_majors") line export_triggers.lua deleted and removed from mod [was there to prevent mad trait from popping up, CA seems to have fixed it themselves] improved_majors.lua reimported changed Major Attacker v Minor Defender values FROM [1.2, 0.8, 0.8, 1.2] TO [1.2, 0.5, 0.8, 1.5] changed Rome v Major Defender values FROM [1.2, 0.8, 0.8, 1.2] TO [1.2, 0.8, 0.5, 1.2] removed following from Major Faction Array rom_roxolani rom_massagetae rom_scythia added following to the Major Faction Array gaul_rome gaul_arverni gaul_suebi gaul_nervii pun_carthage pun_rome pun_syracuse pun_lusitani pun_arevaci emp_octavian emp_antony emp_lepidus emp_pompey emp_iceni emp_armenia emp_dacia emp_egypt emp_marcomanni emp_parthia ui added fe_backdrop_coin, replacing image with STIM eagle removed all .pngs except fe_backdrop_boar fe_backdrop_eagle fe_backdrop_eagle_blood fe_backdrop_elephant

Enjoy STIM 4.0! Please post new threads with your feedback! Help me make this forum an active busy place again.

[cherryfunk]

Ooh ooh ooh! Looks like Christmas came early! Downloading!

[Reggum]

awesome, will try get on this after noon start testing it out. As of patch 15 vanilla, CAI normal difficulty was very passive, just wondering if stim has changed values there? (sorry if I missed something)

[Yarev]

Hooray

[Silven]

awesome, will try get on this after noon start testing it out. As of patch 15 vanilla, CAI normal difficulty was very passive, just wondering if stim has changed values there? (sorry if I missed something)

I think timid AI is a symptom of hardcoded normal-difficulty scripts. Give the campaign a go on Hard and see what you get.

[kiwimaster]

Thanks a lot, Silven. I usually don't post on the forums, but since I'm quite fond of your mod, I thought the least I could do is offer you some constructive feedback. These are my main impressions I had after testing for a good 2 hours in custom battles on normal difficulty.

1. Melee Defense is too high.
I noticed in your notes that you globally increased it by 10 and I feel that this has given the battles too much of a "DeI"-feel, for the lack of a better term. A lot of people seem to hold up longer battles on a pedestal here on twcenter, but there is big problem with this in the way it's done by most modders. It makes flanking with infantry practically pointless. Right now, when I have two melee infantry attacking a lone enemy infantry (doesn't really matter which kind) simultaneously from the front and the rear, I'll decisively win the engagement but it takes me anywhere between 6~8 minutes. Since I tested on normal difficulty, I can only imagine how much longer it'd take for me to win this engagement if I used hard difficulty.

However, instead of rear-attacking with infantry, if I just used a skirmisher unit (doesn't matter archer/slinger/javelin), I can decisively win that engagement in 2-3 minutes. With repeated charges from cavalry, 1-2 minutes. This means that I can easily take out an Athenian picked hoplite with a cheap combo of eastern spearmen+eastern archer in less than half the time than I could with much more expensive infantry units. I'm not bringing this example up to say missile units are overpowered, since they don't kill all that much shooting from the front and actually getting them placed behind enemy infantry can be a challenge due to enemy cav & skirmishers in a regular campaign battle. All I'm saying is that the extremely high melee defense are making battles longer at the cost of lowering the potency of melee infantry while increasing the potency of skirmishers and cavalry, regardless of how cheap or expensive any of these units cost. Good for eastern factions, but I can imagine infantry-focused factions not being too pleased. This also makes it impossible to pull off local superiority tactics when outnumbered (such as demonstrated by the Thebans in the Battle of Leuctra) with melee infantry, since it simply takes far too long to crush one enemy wing before the enemy's numerically superior forces outflanks you.

I can imagine your hesitance that lowering melee defense would bring us back to square one, in which fights are too short. I'm no modder and I'm sorry to say I have no definite solution. But I wonder if instead of globally increasing melee defense values, slightly increasing health values might not prevent battles from becoming too quick while still keeping the potency of an infantry flanking.

2. Unit Speeds.
The speed difference between medium cavalry and light cavalry seems too small for me personally. I would prefer light cavalry speed be increased slightly, so that javelin cavalry which have short missile range won't get caught so easily by enemy medium cavalry.

I have the same issue with infantry, as I think the speed difference between light and medium infantry is too small. I personally feel that light infantry should be just a little faster so they can keep away from medium infantry better. But perhaps this is intentional on your part, and you wished to differentiate these classes of units more through endurance and fatigue recovery rather than unit speed (I didn't really test these two factors), which is fine too.

3. Special Troops (Elephants, chariots, and pikes).
I think elephants are more or less fine. They run amok just fine when there are 2-3 javelin units firing on them but without javelins, they can cause absolute devastation. Chariots, on the other hand, I feel are overpowered. They seem to move too quickly and fluidly across the battlefields and through enemy units, racking up the kills. And unlike with elephants, there's no risk of them going berserk.

Pikes seem to have no problem engaging units, and they even have slightly faster kill rates in a frontal attack, which I like. However, I think they last too long even when attacked from the rear. The outflanked penalties should be harsher for pikes, but since I think the game only has global outflanked penalties, I'm not sure how you would go about fixing this. There is also the issue of pike kill rates increasing the faster you spam the attack button, but that has to do with the base game and I don't think either the devs or any modder has found a solution to that yet.


Aside from these 3 main issues, I think the battles are pretty good. There are also some minor issues regarding specific unit balance (ex. Roman Vigiles has a melee defense of 69, which is too high for such a low-tier, cheap unit at 69), but I won't touch upon that for now.

[Silven]

Hey Kiwimaster! Thanks for all the constructive feedback, I appreciate it!

There are a couple points to mention about your observations though. First and foremost, the global increase to melee defense of 10, is a mirror of a change made by EE. I often times copy over grand sweeping changes like this for consistency. It makes future modding simpler, as it's easier to trace back all the steps of what has been changed in the past. You'll also notice in the changelog that shield defense values were globally reduced by 5, which adds up to a net of only 5 melee defense increase for all units globally. In addition to this, you'll notice melee_hit_chance was increased from a range of 4 to 16, up to a range of 8 to 22. This value has a MUCH bigger impact on melee kill rates than defense. The defense stat is just a way to differentiate units from one another. Higher defense values also give a larger weight to the defense penalty coefficient that gets applied when being attacked from the flank (0.5) and from the rear (0.01), so higher values actually serve to make flanking maneuvers more damaging when compared to the baseline values of front vs front.

See, there are about 100 other factors that go into determining kill rates that all add up to a big picture. And that's the really important thing that has to always be kept in mind; The Grand Scheme of Things. A custom battle with 2 melee units surrounding 1 melee unit doesn't really tell you much of anything. All it really tells you is that when you DO find yourself in a real engagement with full balanced armies; you'll have x amount of time to maneuver extra units while that enemy unit is tied down, or if the situation is flipped, you know you have x amount of time to do something before that unit gets swallowed up. And this mod is all about giving you a reasonable amount of time to react and plan on those situations.

In a practical situation where other units and factors are influencing the outcome of the fight, the amount of time it takes for 2 units to kill each other 1 v 1 is never how long they will really last in a real battle. As you mentioned, things like flanking missile units and rear-charging cav can all make that 6-8 minutes become a much smaller time window, and they almost always will. Also, hopefully it goes without saying that you know to be using your spear units to lock other units in place, while you use sword units to do your actual killing (if you're using a melee infantry unit to do said killing). Surrounding enemy units with all spear units is definitely going to take longer to achieve the kill. Always pay attention to the Bonus V Infantry stat that I've made transparent for every unit in the game, and always compare weapon damage (damage and AP damage) and armour values. Again, the big picture.

So in summation, if your first point is that flanking melee infantry isn't potent enough compared to flanking cav and flanking missiles, then that is something to consider. But higher melee defense values are not the root or solution to your issue. I'd like you to run a real campaign with real armies and engagements, and come back and let me know what you observe. I HIGHLY doubt you'll find battles taking as long as DeI battles (which by the way, calling my mod the same as someone elses.... dem's fightin' words... ) Despite my counterpoints, user feedback and criticism are both VERY useful and too often people fail to bring followup observations after I ask them to try something out. So please come back with more after trying a real campaign.

In regards to your second point, increasing "light" classed unit speed might not be a bad idea. I know I've thought skirmishers could afford to be faster when performing skirmish behavior sometimes. It's important to note that there are several sub-classes of unit types though, so I'll need more specific information on what units you're talking about to make informed changes.
For example, with Cavalry alone, there are 6 different sub-classes in the "light category".

rome_horse_very_light
rome_horse_very_light_shock
rome_horse_very_light_missile
rome_horse_light
rome_horse_light_shock
rome_horse_light_missile

In all cases, shock is faster than normal which is faster than missile. And the underlying classes missile unit can always be speed matched by the overclasses shock unit.
(i.e, Heavy_Shock can move as quickly as Medium_Missile). This is for balance purposes otherwise missile cav would be very OP.

Finally, your third point. Glad to hear elephants feel right. And your report that chariots still feel a little strong is the first confirmation of my suspicion, which is that I might not have nerfed them hard enough. Waiting to hear more about them from others and then I might end up nerfing them a little more.


Thanks again SO much for your very detailed and well-put feedback!

[Reggum]

Should horses say noble horse for arverni get bonus vs infantry stat. As the rider is up higher and better chance to killing there foe oppose to infantry vs infantry... Cause my horses were getting smashed by Pretorian guard.. Just wondering thoughts

[Silven]

I'm actually glad you asked this because it led to me noticing something that I missed before. Patch15 got rid of Bonus V Infantry stats for all but 2 weapons, when it used to be on roughly 15 or more weapons.

I'll put these values back in, in the next update for STIM. The general pattern I want to follow is sword-wielding units with larger Infantry bonuses and spear-wielding units with larger Cavalry bonuses.

Also just as a side note, Praetorian Guard is like one of the best infantry units in the game, if not THE best. Wouldn't surprise me if they gave Noble Horse units a run for their money even after the bonuses get put back in.

[cherryfunk]

Finally had a chance to play a few battles and overall I think you nailed it Silven, the overall pace is excellent, and it's always great to see units break and then reform and rejoin the fight. It's possible that overall infantry-to-infantry melees feel a bit too long vs. the last STIM but I need to play more to get a better feel for it.

I do wonder if infantry movement rates are just a little bit too fast; a couple of times I thought I was on fast forward but wasn't. Curious what others think.

And has something changed about skirmish mode? My skirmishers didn't seem to be pulling back as capably as they used to. Or do they start the battle with it turned off and I just didn't notice?

[Reggum]

Yeah thanks for looking, yes this is true they are the best but I was hoping for my nobles to at least kill some of them in a hand to hand fight. I think I only killed them on the charge and they couldn't kill any after that so I had to get them out of them. The pace of the fight feels pretty good to me.

Really enjoying the main line slog feast and then me trying to out flank them our bust a hole in the guts to surround them. It has been fun. But will do some more testing as well. I like the fatigue. They recover at good pace and diminish in combat at good pace.(fatigue) I've played some mods and the stay fresh the hole time = S .

Hate that as I like to keep units that are fresh in reserve then pull back my tired units.

[yupper]

I am also finding the battles to be more sensible now. I see the 'frontal slug fests', but when I overwhelm and/or flank the enemy, I don't see the extended 'moral revival', and the amount of time waiting for those clear victories to reach their conclusion are drastically reduced. Good job Sylvan.

I do want to raise one issue though: I don't know if this is a result of changes introduced by EE, but the previous recruitment cap (at least for land units) are gone. I can now recruit up to 6 units in Italia in one turn, without any building or tech upgrades--this is before even controlling the entire province. Given that the mod is 4 turns per year, should the recruitment cap be reduced accordingly (I think in the previous version of Sylvan, I could only recruit 2 or 3 units in Italia until I've made some upgrades)? As of now, I find it far more expedient and easier to raise new units than to wait for old units to replenish if their numbers have been significantly depleted. The same applies to waiting for units to travel from far flung regions of your faction's holdings, especially with the removal of 'forced march' (which the AI never used properly), since you can now raise an almost-full stack in 3 turns

The second issue is regarding the decrease cavalry charge values: I am basing this not on my own faction's cavalry units (I haven't been able to raise any), but on my observations of the AI factions cavalry units. I have noticed that repeated cavalry charges from AI units used to be devastating against my Hastati units, for example, barbarian Noblehorse generals (I really hated those). Now...not so much. I find their effectiveness to be noticeably reduced against my Hastiti units (I imagine they would be even weaker once I can train legionnaires). I wonder if the changes were too drastic? Just putting it out for thoughts.

[Heytch]

I am also finding the battles to be more sensible now. I see the 'frontal slug fests', but when I overwhelm and/or flank the enemy, I don't see the extended 'moral revival', and the amount of time waiting for those clear victories to reach their conclusion are drastically reduced. Good job Sylvan.

I do want to raise one issue though: I don't know if this is a result of changes introduced by EE, but the previous recruitment cap (at least for land units) are gone. I can now recruit up to 6 units in Italia in one turn, without any building or tech upgrades--this is before even controlling the entire province. Given that the mod is 4 turns per year, should the recruitment cap be reduced accordingly (I think in the previous version of Sylvan, I could only recruit 2 or 3 units in Italia until I've made some upgrades)? As of now, I find it far more expedient and easier to raise new units than to wait for old units to replenish if their numbers have been significantly deleted. The same applies to waiting for units to travel from far flung regions of your faction's holdings, especially with the removal of 'forced march' (which the AI never used properly), since you can now raise an almost-full stack in 3 turns

The second issue is regarding the decrease cavalry charge values: I am basing this not on my own faction's cavalry units (I haven't been able to raise any), but on my observations of the AI factions cavalry units. I have noticed that repeated cavalry charges from AI units used to be devastating against my Hastati units, for example, barbarian Noblehorse generals (I really hated those). Now...not so much. I find their effectiveness to be noticeably reduced against my Hastiti units (I imagine they would be even weaker once I can train legionnaires). I wonder if the changes were too drastic? Just putting it out for thoughts.

I was just about to post this really. I'm still on the fence on the Cavalry. They may need a very slight buff. Cavalry -is much easier to deal with sword units now. Most of my armies are heavy on legionaries light on Triari and I can still deal with heavy cav armies fairly well. I find myself more comfortable raising armies without cavalry. They are still effective though.

Definitely agree on the Roman recruitment. The new +2 recruitment for Rome plus the new recruitment bonuses on certain buildings, you can effectively raise -atleast- 8 per turn in Italia. Not sure about other factions, only been playing Rome so far.

Excellent job though. Everything feels great.

[Silven]

It's possible that overall infantry-to-infantry melees feel a bit too long vs. the last STIM but I need to play more to get a better feel for it.

Ya, once I reiterate the Bonus V Infantry stats that were removed from all weapons by EE (i missed that in the 4.0 update) infantry-to-infantry melee should feel a bit better.

I do wonder if infantry movement rates are just a little bit too fast; a couple of times I thought I was on fast forward but wasn't. Curious what others think.

Lol kiwimaster above you commented that movement rates were just a little bit too slow. So I'm getting mixed feedback on this. Would help to know specifically which units you're talking about.

And has something changed about skirmish mode? My skirmishers didn't seem to be pulling back as capably as they used to. Or do they start the battle with it turned off and I just didn't notice?

This is related to the movement speed discussion. My suspicion is that increasing movement speeds of light troops or decreasing movement speeds of medium and heavy troops will help skirmishers do their job better. I don't want to mess up the overall balance of movement speeds though, so not quite sure what to do with it until I get more feedback. And to my knowledge, they always start the battle with skirmish mode turned on.

I do want to raise one issue though: I don't know if this is a result of changes introduced by EE, but the previous recruitment cap (at least for land units) are gone. I can now recruit up to 6 units in Italia in one turn, without any building or tech upgrades--this is before even controlling the entire province.

This change was brought on by EE. Probably an attempt by CA to make Rome perform a little better. I didn't think much of it until reading your post. It makes sense to reduce it back down to 3, maybe 4 tops, before upgrades/techs/etc. One of the new building chains grants an extra recruitment slot, and I think something else specific to Rome grants a bonus as well. I'll look into it, thanks for bringing it up.

The second issue is regarding the decrease cavalry charge values {...} I wonder if the changes were too drastic? Just putting it out for thoughts.

This goes back to the Bonus V Infantry stat that was removed. Once I return these stats to all the appropriate weapons, cavalry charges should be back in the sweet spot.

I was just about to post this really. I'm still on the fence on the Cavalry. They may need a very slight buff.
Definitely agree on the Roman recruitment.
Excellent job though. Everything feels great.

Thanks for confirming feedback. It helps to know these things aren't limited to one persons experience.

Rep for all!

[Yarev]

Just one question Silven regarding bonus vs infantry when are you going to do that ? It would be nice if you have time