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Thread: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

  1. #1
    Akhenaton's Avatar Decanus
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    Default HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    A few days ago, british actress Emma Watson held a speech before the UN about Gender equality, in which she tries to persuade men and boys to join the "HeforShe" campaign.

    Here is the speech



    and for those who can't understand it well, again in written text

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Today we are launching a campaign called “HeForShe.”
    I am reaching out to you because I need your help. We want to end gender inequality—and to do that we need everyone to be involved.
    This is the first campaign of its kind at the UN: we want to try and galvanize as many men and boys as possible to be advocates for gender equality. And we don’t just want to talk about it, but make sure it is tangible.
    I was appointed six months ago and the more I have spoken about feminism the more I have realized that fighting for women’s rights has too often become synonymous with man-hating. If there is one thing I know for certain, it is that this has to stop.
    For the record, feminism by definition is: “The belief that men and women should have equal rights and opportunities. It is the theory of the political, economic and social equality of the sexes.”
    I started questioning gender-based assumptions when at eight I was confused at being called “bossy,” because I wanted to direct the plays we would put on for our parents—but the boys were not.
    When at 14 I started being sexualized by certain elements of the press.
    When at 15 my girlfriends started dropping out of their sports teams because they didn’t want to appear “muscly.”
    When at 18 my male friends were unable to express their feelings.
    I decided I was a feminist and this seemed uncomplicated to me. But my recent research has shown me that feminism has become an unpopular word.
    Apparently I am among the ranks of women whose expressions are seen as too strong, too aggressive, isolating, anti-men and, unattractive.
    Why is the word such an uncomfortable one?
    I am from Britain and think it is right that as a woman I am paid the same as my male counterparts. I think it is right that I should be able to make decisions about my own body. I think it is right that women be involved on my behalf in the policies and decision-making of my country. I think it is right that socially I am afforded the same respect as men. But sadly I can say that there is no one country in the world where all women can expect to receive these rights.
    No country in the world can yet say they have achieved gender equality.
    These rights I consider to be human rights but I am one of the lucky ones. My life is a sheer privilege because my parents didn’t love me less because I was born a daughter. My school did not limit me because I was a girl. My mentors didn’t assume I would go less far because I might give birth to a child one day. These influencers were the gender equality ambassadors that made who I am today. They may not know it, but they are the inadvertent feminists who are. And we need more of those. And if you still hate the word—it is not the word that is important but the idea and the ambition behind it. Because not all women have been afforded the same rights that I have. In fact, statistically, very few have been.
    In 1997, Hilary Clinton made a famous speech in Beijing about women’s rights. Sadly many of the things she wanted to change are still a reality today.
    But what stood out for me the most was that only 30 per cent of her audience were male. How can we affect change in the world when only half of it is invited or feel welcome to participate in the conversation?
    Men—I would like to take this opportunity to extend your formal invitation. Gender equality is your issue too.
    Because to date, I’ve seen my father’s role as a parent being valued less by society despite my needing his presence as a child as much as my mother’s.
    I’ve seen young men suffering from mental illness unable to ask for help for fear it would make them look less “macho”—in fact in the UK suicide is the biggest killer of men between 20-49; eclipsing road accidents, cancer and coronary heart disease. I’ve seen men made fragile and insecure by a distorted sense of what constitutes male success. Men don’t have the benefits of equality either.
    We don’t often talk about men being imprisoned by gender stereotypes but I can see that that they are and that when they are free, things will change for women as a natural consequence.
    If men don’t have to be aggressive in order to be accepted women won’t feel compelled to be submissive. If men don’t have to control, women won’t have to be controlled.
    Both men and women should feel free to be sensitive. Both men and women should feel free to be strong… It is time that we all perceive gender on a spectrum not as two opposing sets of ideals.
    If we stop defining each other by what we are not and start defining ourselves by what we are—we can all be freer and this is what HeForShe is about. It’s about freedom.
    I want men to take up this mantle. So their daughters, sisters and mothers can be free from prejudice but also so that their sons have permission to be vulnerable and human too—reclaim those parts of themselves they abandoned and in doing so be a more true and complete version of themselves.
    You might be thinking who is this Harry Potter girl? And what is she doing up on stage at the UN. It’s a good question and trust me I have been asking myself the same thing. I don’t know if I am qualified to be here. All I know is that I care about this problem. And I want to make it better.
    And having seen what I’ve seen—and given the chance—I feel it is my duty to say something. English statesman Edmund Burke said: “All that is needed for the forces of evil to triumph is for enough good men and women to do nothing.”
    In my nervousness for this speech and in my moments of doubt I’ve told myself firmly—if not me, who, if not now, when. If you have similar doubts when opportunities are presented to you I hope those words might be helpful.
    Because the reality is that if we do nothing it will take 75 years, or for me to be nearly a hundred before women can expect to be paid the same as men for the same work. 15.5 million girls will be married in the next 16 years as children. And at current rates it won’t be until 2086 before all rural African girls will be able to receive a secondary education.
    If you believe in equality, you might be one of those inadvertent feminists I spoke of earlier.
    And for this I applaud you.
    We are struggling for a uniting word but the good news is we have a uniting movement. It is called HeForShe. I am inviting you to step forward, to be seen to speak up, To be the he for she. And to ask yourself if not me, who, if not now when.
    Thank you.


    The Speech itself is quite good with some valid arguments. It's kinda cute how her voice is so high during her oration, but it´s totaly understandable that she is so jittery, since she is speaking in front of the UN

    As always keep it somewhat civil
    Last edited by Akhenaton; September 23, 2014 at 01:31 PM.

  2. #2
    Himster's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    If the word isn't important as she said, then why not call yourself an egalitarian, rather than taking the inherently divisive word "feminist"? Well Ms. Watson?
    The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are so certain of themselves, but wiser people are full of doubts.
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  3. #3
    UselessPoster's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    So is emma a feminist or not ?.
    Q2 2015 ...

    Time to go on a killing spree in HATRED .

  4. #4

    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Where do I sign up?


  5. #5

    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Sadly, the world can't be put to rights by waving a wand around, though some tend to allow it to make decisions for them.
    Eats, shoots, and leaves.

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    Akhenaton's Avatar Decanus
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    the world can be put right by doing something. Seems to me, she got that part right.

  7. #7

    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    If women are paid less then men, why would anyone hire men?
    "When I die, I want to die peacefully in my sleep, like Fidel Castro, not screaming in terror, like his victims."

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    Akhenaton's Avatar Decanus
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    This revelation came to business men, when they first started hiring female instead of male secretaries

  9. #9
    hellheaven1987's Avatar Comes Domesticorum
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Quote Originally Posted by Phier View Post
    If women are paid less then men, why would anyone hire men?
    Well, there are jobs more suitable for men; but you are right, dirty capitalist hire women and children only because they can pay less salary to them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Markas View Post
    Hellheaven, sometimes you remind me of King Canute trying to hold back the tide, except without the winning parable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Diocle View Post
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  10. #10

    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Quote Originally Posted by Phier View Post
    If women are paid less then men, why would anyone hire men?
    same reason why they are paid less.
    they need/ask for more time off and get off work right on the clock.

    and lets not go through the whole maternal leave thing.

  11. #11

    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Quote Originally Posted by Himster View Post
    If the word isn't important as she said, then why not call yourself an egalitarian, rather than taking the inherently divisive word "feminist"? Well Ms. Watson?
    Why don't minority or LGBT rights activists call themselves "human activists"? Pretty dumb question tbh.

    Might have something to do with the fact that on average, women are still incredibly disadvantaged all over the world.

    Let's see, despite the age of enlightenment and us living in the 21st century, in most countries of the world women are: brutally oppressed, locked up, sold as slaves, genitially mutilated, aborted for being female, killed as babies, murdered when their husbands die, married against their will, kidnapped and gang raped. They have to obey their father, then their husband, are beaten daily and seen as beings of lower value.

    While things are better in the Western world, women are still easily the more disadvantaged gender. Compared to men, they are paid less, raped more, beaten more, sold into slavery more often, abused more, objectified more. Even today, in most families in the Western world, the woman has to put her husband's career before her own. The woman is the one who has to stay at home to take care of the child. If she doesn't, she'll be considered a terrible mother by many. If a woman sleeps around, she's a slut. If a man does the same thing, he's a ing boss.

    Nothing worse than young white males (such as myself) whining about being discriminated against. Boohoo, evil feminsts want to have equal rights, how dare they.

    Calling yourself an "egalitarian" makes sense -- once there's actually a semblance of real equality and not "well, we are equal before the law, but we still have to respect nature and women should do what women do". Newsflash: a piece of paper banning discrimination based on sex cannot end millenia of abuse and discrimination in a few years or decades.
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    Sir Adrian's Avatar the Imperishable
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    It's not a dumb question. Feminism historically has been interested solely in women's rights, much like LGBT activists are interested solely in LGBT rights. Until 30-40 years ago Feminism meant a struggle for equality because men had more rights than women but the point of rough equality was reached in the 1980s. From that point on feminism became a "even more rights for women" movement. Saying you are pro equality and calling yourself a feminist is like calling yourself a Pacifist Warlord or a racially tolerant fascist.

    Yhe rest of your post is pure arse, but I'll get to that tomorrow because I don't have time now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Akhenaton View Post
    This revelation came to business men, when they first started hiring female instead of male secretaries
    People hire female secretaries and personal managers because they're generally better at thise jobs than most men. In fact the only good male secretaries I have ever met were gay.
    Last edited by Sir Adrian; September 23, 2014 at 05:46 PM.
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Quote Originally Posted by Astaroth View Post

    Let's see, despite the age of enlightenment and us living in the 21st century, in most countries of the world women are: brutally oppressed, locked up, sold as slaves, genitially mutilated, aborted for being female, killed as babies, murdered when their husbands die, married against their will, kidnapped and gang raped. They have to obey their father, then their husband, are beaten daily and seen as beings of lower value.
    ...being a bit extreme, aren't we?
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Adrian View Post
    People hire female secretaries and personal managers because they're generally better at thise jobs than most men. In fact the only good male secretaries I have ever met were gay.
    I'm not sure if the sexism or homophobia of this post was greater than its ignorance.

  14. #14

    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Quote Originally Posted by Stavroforos View Post
    ...being a bit extreme, aren't we?
    I wish I was wrong.
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Quote Originally Posted by Astaroth View Post
    I wish I was wrong.
    I'm not familiar with the treatment of the women around the world, but surely "most" countries is an exaggeration?

  16. #16
    Akhenaton's Avatar Decanus
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Adrian View Post
    It's not a dumb question. Feminism historically has been interested solely in women's rights, much like LGBT activists are interested solely in LGBT rights. Until 30-40 years ago Feminism meant a struggle for equality because men had more rights than women but the point of rough equality was reached in the 1980s. From that point on feminism became a "even more rights for women" movement. Saying you are pro equality and calling yourself a feminist is like calling yourself a Pacifist Warlord or a racially tolerant fascist.
    I don´t think Mrs.Watson counts herself to the feminist taliban. Besides there is still a problem with women in our society, IMHO, e.g the hacking of private documents and publishing of nudes on the internet is an attack on the dignity of those women who are suddenly exposed, literraly in the open. There is also the topic of sexuality and please understand I like sexual or sensual things a lot and no this isn´t directed against HBO or videogames, but in general I think it has gone too far and become almost....banal\trivial in a way. I can see it especially in popculture where it is simply over the top and it's too much. I don't think it adds anything to the freedom or dignity of women, if they slam their asses against the camera.


    People hire female secretaries and personal managers because they're generally better at thise jobs than most men. In fact the only good male secretaries I have ever met were gay.
    You´re talking after the 50´s. I´m talking pre-39 or pre-14, not sure right now, but the matter of fact is, it used to be that only men would work as secretaries or assistants, since it wasn´t really seemly for a woman to write, especially in public, but when all the young dudes went to get their brains blown off for their nations, suddenly there weren´t enough around to fill the demand. And what do you know, apparently it does have benefits to have a female secretary and we never reverted back to the old system

    Quote Originally Posted by Stavroforos View Post
    I'm not familiar with the treatment of the women around the world, but surely "most" countries is an exaggeration?
    Unfortunatly it isn't. Take India. Gang rapes in the news all the time. Or africa, where thousands of girls are either mutilated, sold into marriage like cattle or in the case of Boko Haram even abducted from schools and then sold as sex slaves in the black market.

    China too. Having a girl was seen as terrible for a long time, because of the 1-child policy.

    There's more, but maybe Astaroth can help with that. Good post Astaroth, by the way


    In general, human rights or equality of gender is not something natural, but cosntructed by us and it lies on our shoulders to defend it, if we value it. Same goes for might makes right by the way. I don't view it as a natural order, just as something very easy to give into.
    Last edited by Aikanár; September 23, 2014 at 06:13 PM. Reason: -** +ss ;)

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    Påsan's Avatar Hva i helvete?
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Dunno if its worth a mention, but immediately after the speech a user on 4chan, fulfilling its role as the disgusting gutter it is, launched a threat to distribute nude pictures of Emma. "To prove she's just as much a whore as all other women" - 4chan user

    http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/...eaked-pictures


    So basically this just reinforces her cause.


    Oh and gender equality equals tons of money.
    Last edited by Påsan; September 23, 2014 at 07:50 PM.

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    hellheaven1987's Avatar Comes Domesticorum
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    How is posting nude picture relating with gender inequality? Are you suggesting it is fine to post nude pictures of men on internet?
    Quote Originally Posted by Markas View Post
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  19. #19
    G-Megas-Doux's Avatar Vicarius
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    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Reading the speech I thought it made a lot of valid points. It truly is sad that a lot of people let both sides down. I do have to say that every time I see an article about violence and abuse on most occasions it is a man committing these acts and it makes me feel ashamed to be a man. Perhaps this is why the stereotype of the man hating feminist exists because so many men do dumb as things like this. Ultimately the only way people can accept each other is to be able to judge people as individuals by their actions and character, this has to be so much harder to not pre judge or act in a certain way because of fear of wide spread behaviour.

    Regarding the most countries treating women like second class citizens. I would agree that is accurate. There are plenty of humanitarian reports out there that show various countries marginalising population demographics that would back this up.

    The egalitarian way of treating people is something that exists in a modern movement of Humanism which in itself is not that modern however it has been adopted by humanitarian groups.



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  20. #20

    Default Re: HeforShe - Emma Watson holds Speech about equality

    Quote Originally Posted by Astaroth View Post
    Why don't minority or LGBT rights activists call themselves "human activists"? Pretty dumb question tbh.

    Might have something to do with the fact that on average, women are still incredibly disadvantaged all over the world.

    Let's see, despite the age of enlightenment and us living in the 21st century, in most countries of the world women are: brutally oppressed, locked up, sold as slaves, genitially mutilated, aborted for being female, killed as babies, murdered when their husbands die, married against their will, kidnapped and gang raped. They have to obey their father, then their husband, are beaten daily and seen as beings of lower value.
    I'm pretty sure that mostly relates to North Africa or Gulf states, which definitely do not constitute "most countries of the world". Nice generalization thou.
    While things are better in the Western world, women are still easily the more disadvantaged gender. Compared to men, they are paid less, raped more, beaten more, sold into slavery more often, abused more, objectified more. Even today, in most families in the Western world, the woman has to put her husband's career before her own. The woman is the one who has to stay at home to take care of the child. If she doesn't, she'll be considered a terrible mother by many. If a woman sleeps around, she's a slut. If a man does the same thing, he's a ing boss.

    Nothing worse than young white males (such as myself) whining about being discriminated against. Boohoo, evil feminsts want to have equal rights, how dare they.

    Calling yourself an "egalitarian" makes sense -- once there's actually a semblance of real equality and not "well, we are equal before the law, but we still have to respect nature and women should do what women do". Newsflash: a piece of paper banning discrimination based on sex cannot end millenia of abuse and discrimination in a few years or decades.
    Now lets address this from logical perspective:
    Are women forced by law to prioritize their family life over their career? No. They only do that because they chose to do so.
    Do women have less rights then men? No. In fact, there are various "affirmative action" policies in both government and private companies which enforce "positive" discrimination, which is just as wrong. Thus, the only group that really ends up discriminated are white heterosexual males. But of course, we are inherently all evil and deserve it because we are somehow responsible for "millenia of abuse".
    And yes, equality before the law is real equality. Which is why modern feminism is a joke, unless it addresses places where discrimination of women is real, such as Saudi Arabia or Somalia.
    Last edited by Tiberios; September 24, 2014 at 02:39 AM. Reason: ToS violation removed

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