Maintaining order in newly conquered cities as Rome (M/M)

[qwertykov]

Newly conquered cities are using up my best governors and I dont have enough high influence level characters to keep up thus severely limiting my expansion despite me having the resources to do so.

I'm playing as Rome SPQR @ turn 60 (M/M)

I've tried low taxes and having full stack garrisons in Segesta and Fulvia but order level still at RED. So i had to resort to sending my Faction leader and top members to these low level cities instead of having them govern the money making cities like Rome and Arretium thus impeding my empire's cashflow. Plus they will make the occasional trip back to Rome for elections will leave the cities again back in the Red zone. I cant go on expanding into Patavium and Medio when its so difficult to maintain order in Segesta and Fulvia and every newly conquered city. What should I do?

The only solution I could think of is to incite a civil revolt by setting highest taxes and then reconquering and exterminating them a second time but it doesnt seem a very fair/humane option for a ruler. And I am sure it will lead to my characters getting ridiculous traits like Bloodthirsty, Maniac, Sadistic or Butcher which I am very keen to avoid.

I actually conquered Tarentum and Rhegion before going into northern Italy and it seems the Southern cities are easier to manage than the Northern ones. They seem to quieten down much faster. Now I need only to place about 5 stacks and low taxes (w/o governor) to maintain YELLOW and a steadily increasing pop. Might be due to the south having similar cultures with the Romans but what do I do if they dont?

PS: Bravo to the EB2 team. It is a game that speaks to my heart.

[Ballpoint202]

It takes time.

Keep a high-influence leader handy to suppress revolts.

Build happiness and law buildings.

Keep a spy in each of those cities to catch enemy spies who will cause unrest.

Remember that 40% is the maximum happiness boost from a garrison, and the smaller the city the fewer troops it takes to get it. You don't need to keep an entire army there.

They never seem to get into the green without a good leader even after a hundred turns (of course that's only 25 years in EBII). You get used to it. I'm happy if they are yellow, but sometimes you have to live with them red and with the occasional riot (which you will suppress with the aforementioned high-influence leader before it becomes a revolt).

eta: After the Marian reforms (which are not yet in the game) you will be able to colonize regions outside of Italy, so that may help.

[QuintusSertorius]

Use an Allied Government of some form at first. Yes, you may have to change it later, but in those early days the public order boost is worth it.

Use governors in new provinces, troops alone have a negligible impact.

Take your time integrating your new conquests before moving on to somewhere new. You might have to spend 15-20 turns getting Rhegion and Taras bedded down before considering somewhere else to go.

[Hummer]

It's because of the culture of the area and culture public order penalty. It makes the game so much more realistic. Subjugating people is and was difficult.

In places that are a different culture than your own like (for example, Forest Tribalism, compared to your own Western Mediterranean Polities), you want to impose an allied government for the 1st 50 years(approx. 200 turns, this could vary a lot from city to city) to keep the citizens happy. Then, build happiness and law buildings to improve public order. Eventually, destroy the allied government and build your own government. This simulates the conversion of people's from their own ways to yours.

Remember Rome conquered the world over the course of 3 to 400 years. In the game that's over 1000 turns. You don't have to do it all in the first 1 or 200 turns.
Patience is a virtue.... Cheerio

[danielc]

I do it on VH/H by:

- When first conquer, exterminate the population
- Then pacify, and create Roman province, or Soccii
- Then build first, and second level temple
- Then garrison buildings
- After that, it becomes a bit easier

[qwertykov]

Hey guys thanks for the advice. I made temples(lvl 1 and 2) and law buildings the priority instead of building roads and they did help maintain order. I left spies in each of the new cities for good measure too.

And i tend to choose Allied Democracy instead of Allied Oligarchy as Oligarchy will net lesser gain to law and happiness compared to Allied Democracy. However I'm not sure of the long term consequence of choosing AD over AO. Anyone knows the long term consequences of choosing AD or AO? Whats the main difference between the two systems?

Realized this is a long game and patience is needed to see the effects take place. Fortunately my Academy in Rome is churning out FMs with high influence which will help in governance(which i think is the most important stat in the game). I built it around turn 70 to ensure i get decent FMs. High quality FM are so important in this game.

[QuintusSertorius]

Anyone knows the long term consequences of choosing AD or AO? Whats the main difference between the two systems?

Law (Oligarchy) or happiness (Democracy), though the same public order bonus. A shared pool of 3-5 regional units which are the same regardless and 1-3 better quality ones which are either infantry (Democracy) or cavalry (Oligarchy).

[qwertykov]

Law (Oligarchy) or happiness (Democracy), though the same public order bonus. A shared pool of 3-5 regional units which are the same regardless and 1-3 better quality ones which are either infantry (Democracy) or cavalry (Oligarchy).

Between the Roman Allied State and Regional Pacification of Lilibeo, there are some differences.

Roman Allied State:
Public order bonus due to Happiness: +5%
Public order bonus due to Law: +5%
Net bonus: +10%

Regional Pacification:
Public order bonus due to Happiness: -20%
Public order bonus due to Law: +10%
Net bonus: -10%

So Roman Allied State govt is adds more to Order than Regional Pacification govt?

[Hummer]

Between the Roman Allied State and Regional Pacification of Lilibeo, there are some differences.

Roman Allied State:
Public order bonus due to Happiness: +5%
Public order bonus due to Law: +5%
Net bonus: +10%

Regional Pacification:
Public order bonus due to Happiness: -20%
Public order bonus due to Law: +10%
Net bonus: -10%

So Roman Allied State govt is adds more to Order than Regional Pacification govt?

Correct, but there are 2 allied states. Either an allied Democracy or an allied Oligarchy.

[Ballpoint202]

Regional pacification doesn't lead anywhere, that's the problem with it. You can't recruit with it and you can't develop it outside of Italy, except in Illyria or where you have at least 40% Western Med or Hellenistic culture -- there you can build the Free City govt (which is very nice).

So in Celtic and Germanic etc lands, you should go with Allied States, at least until we find out what happens after the Marian reforms. I mix them up between Demo and Oligarchic for recruiting purposes.

BTW, the Free City gvt never shows up on the building browser. Where it's available it just shows up as buildable after you've built Regional Pacification.

[QuintusSertorius]

Correct, but there are 2 allied states. Either an allied Democracy or an allied Oligarchy.

Indeed, I'm not talking about Regional Pacification/Military Government at all, but the two different types of Allied Government.

[qwertykov]

Law (Oligarchy) or happiness (Democracy), though the same public order bonus. A shared pool of 3-5 regional units which are the same regardless and 1-3 better quality ones which are either infantry (Democracy) or cavalry (Oligarchy).

Does that mean there is not much of a difference when it comes to a choice between Democracy and Oligarchy?

Also what do u mean by the "shared pool of 3-5 regional .... either (Democracy) or cavalry(Oligarchy)" ?

[QuintusSertorius]

Does that mean there is not much of a difference when it comes to a choice between Democracy and Oligarchy?

Also what do u mean by the "shared pool of 3-5 regional .... either (Democracy) or cavalry(Oligarchy)" ?

Not really much, though Law is more useful than Happiness. What I mean is both types of Allied Governments provide 3-5 regional units, then you'll get another few extra units dependent on type. For example both Greek AGs allow you to recruit Toxotai, Akontistai, Hoplitai Haploi and Hippakontistai. An Allied Democracy will also give you Hoplitai, but an Allied Oligarchy will give you Hippeis instead.