ISIL War in Iraq and Syria

[Odenat]

ISIS controls about a 250km stretch. Maybe 350km. Your map is nice to include a scale. So your mythical 900km border war doesn't sound correct. And if Turkey can't guard a simply 350km of its territory against attack, the turkey has no chance of even harming the ISIS.

I did my military service at the Turkish Syrian border. I was at Ceylanpınar, just opposite Resulayn. I was responsible on the security of just 6 kms of the border and believe me ; that's a lot of land to secure. All along Turkish Syrian border, there are valleys, hills, forests. For every troop you posted there, there will be huge logistic problems. These soldiers need to eat, drink, need polaces to bath etc.

At the security of the room, when you look to the map, things can seem very easy to you. Don't forget that all of E.U. is helping Greece and they can not secure Turkish-Greece border whicj is only 125 km ! USA is spending billions and have the most technological equipments, and still USA-Mexico border can not be secured.

Vermin? The many innocent Kurds now stuck in ISIS territory are not vermin. Your country is leaving thousands of people to die and to face slavery and oppression at the hands of the ISIS.

And the peace teaks are most certainly not dead. I haven't heard the Turkish government or the PKK saying the talks have failed or were over.

The innocent Kurds already escaped to Turkey and are living here thanks to our taxes. Their brothers are burning and plundering our schools, hospitals etc in the name of "protests".

E.U. and USA are welcome to help them. Have you seen anyone mentioning US troops ? Or, English, French armies taking action ? Nope, everybody is waiting, nobody is sending help, why will Turkey take action? Right now, Turkish interests lie with waiting. You say that "Your country is leaving thousands of people to die and to face slavery and oppression at the hands of the ISIS", well, YOUR country is exactly doing the same.

[snuggans]

E.U. and USA are welcome to help them. Have you seen anyone mentioning US troops ? Or, English, French armies taking action ? Nope, everybody is waiting, nobody is sending help, why will Turkey take action? Right now, Turkish interests lie with waiting. You say that "Your country is leaving thousands of people to die and to face slavery and oppression at the hands of the ISIS", well, YOUR country is exactly doing the same.

how strange that countries on the other side of the planet who have SF on the ground and are launching airstrikes preventing daesh from taking several different locations across a vast region are somehow portrayed as being equally idle as the next-door neighbor who has tanks spectating Kobane with binoculars.

[Stavroforos]

how strange that countries on the other side of the planet who have SF on the ground and are launching airstrikes preventing daesh from taking several different locations across a vast region are somehow portrayed as being equally idle as the next-door neighbor who has tanks spectating Kobane with binoculars.

How strange that a nation that is thousands of miles away and separated by oceans can launch air strikes with little fear while a nation that borders ISIS and will likely sustain many attacks and casualties is more hesitant.

[Principe Alessandro]

Well well, seems that FSA fighters are in Kobane fighting with YPG against ISIS, those poor sods don't understand that by doing so have become PKK terrorists:

[snuggans]

How strange that a nation that is thousands of miles away and separated by oceans can launch air strikes with little fear while a nation that borders ISIS and will likely sustain many attacks and casualties is more hesitant.

as if oceans and distance immunizes western nations from potential terrorist attacks. Turkey won't even allow use of air bases or territory for other countries, so it's not some fear of suffering casualties themselves, they just don't want to indirectly help Assad or the Peshmerga. their inaction is leverage that can be used to get others involved in the fight against Assad and it's honestly sickening that they'd rather do nothing to one evil while being in the perfect position to do so, in order to draw attention to the other less radical and more compartmentalized evil(s).

[white-wolf]

One wise being said that once : "if you see your enemies fighting do not interrupt them".

[Principe Alessandro]

Well, Turkey has employed simply the same strategy that has used years ago when its proxies in Syria attacked Ras al-Ayn. It was a long time strategic goal for Turkey to destroy the autonomous Kurdish cantons, you have to only look at my previous post to understand the nature of the Turkish strategy in Syria:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...1#post14145658

[caratacus]

One wise being said that once : "if you see your enemies fighting do not interrupt them".

Turkey is faced with a situation, do they act now with their large well equipped army and secure a buffer zone within Syria. Or do nothing and have a new neighbour called IS. An autonomous Kurdish state on the border may be unpalatable prospect to many Turks. But Islamic State will be a far worse neighbour and won't simply leave Turkey alone. The Kurds thought that and look what is happening now after IS consolidated their grip in Syrian and Iraq.

If Erdogan is genuinely waiting for Obama to commit American ground forces, he will be waiting a long time. If Turkey move now, then they will take IS at its weakest on the offensive. Delay and IS forces will bed down into towns like Kobane and it will be hellish to get them out. Erdogan seems to view IS as being of lesser importance than getting rid of Assad but that would be a very grave miscalculation indeed. A plague welcomed upon an enemy, very seldom confines itself to that enemy and will eventually come visiting at your door.

[Odenat]

Turkey is faced with a situation, do they act now with their large well equipped army and secure a buffer zone within Syria. Or do nothing and have a new neighbour called IS.

Actually Kurds say they are against buffer zone too. They just want Turkish army going in, clear ISIS warriors via house by house fighting and when the last IS warrior is dead, leave the area.

Yep, they are asking us to lose maybe hundreds of our soldiers for nothing, isn't it cute ? And as Turkey is not crazy enough to accept this, they are accusing us of supporting terrorists. (Altough both sides of the conflict are terrorists but Kurdish militants have international support right now as IS is beheading people)

[white-wolf]

Actually Kurds say they are against buffer zone too. They just want Turkish army going in, clear ISIS warriors via house by house fighting and when the last IS warrior is dead, leave the area.

Yep, they are asking us to lose maybe hundreds of our soldiers for nothing, isn't it cute ? And as Turkey is not crazy enough to accept this, they are accusing us of supporting terrorists. (Altough both sides of the conflict are terrorists but Kurdish militants have international support right now as IS is beheading people)

No. Not even that. PKK/YPG does not want any Turkish military intervention as I posted earlier. What they want from us ammunations and heavy guns. They want heavy guns and ammunation from the state which they have been killing her citizens. Disgusting. Their insanity does not know bounds.

[caratacus]

Actually Kurds say they are against buffer zone too. They just want Turkish army going in, clear ISIS warriors via house by house fighting and when the last IS warrior is dead, leave the area.

Yep, they are asking us to lose maybe hundreds of our soldiers for nothing, isn't it cute ? And as Turkey is not crazy enough to accept this, they are accusing us of supporting terrorists. (Altough both sides of the conflict are terrorists but Kurdish militants have international support right now as IS is beheading people)

But its not in Turkey's interests to have Jihadist state as a neighbour. Turkey have tanks and heavy weaponry right there on the border ready. Does any Turk want this to be a long term zone of violence, right there on the border.To have thousands of Kurdish refugees permanently living inside the Country. IS fighters will need to be confronted eventually why not now!?

Anyway, this is also a NATO matter since Turkey is a NATO member and I don't entirely blame Turkey. NATO members are reluctant to act save for bombing and Lord knows how much that is costing, to eliminate a bunch of violent armed thugs who are terrorizing the whole region. It's a real mess and extremists are exploiting it to the full. I really don't subscribe to Western politicians saying that there needs to be a coalition to defeat IS, it will never happen. A strong power needs to get into Iraq and Syria and kick their assess and liberal minded western politicians wouldn't be able to agree the tactics to do it. "Fight fire with fire" and all that". They walked away from Iraq too dam quick and were too eager to hand over to a bunch of fools and now IS were lasted reported less than 5 miles outside Baghdad. No, I'm afraid that if Turkey really doesn't want decades of violence on their doorstep with all the consequences that will bring in terms of overspill, they need to act now to create that buffer zone, with or without the Kurds blessing..

[Tureuki]

An arrested Turkish guy is so angry breaks the police car's window with his head :d

http://webtv.hurriyet.com.tr/2/70140...a-atarak-kirdi

[white-wolf]

An arrested Turkish guy is so angry breaks the police car's window with his head :d

http://webtv.hurriyet.com.tr/2/70140...a-atarak-kirdi

The guy is a Turk. He is saying "I am a Turk, a Turk". I think it is from an operation that police had been protecting pro-PKK Kurds from angry Turks.

[Principe Alessandro]

No. Not even that. PKK/YPG does not want any Turkish military intervention as I posted earlier. What they want from us ammunations and heavy guns. They want heavy guns and ammunation from the state which they have been killing her citizens. Disgusting. Their insanity does not know bounds.

Neither this, the peshmerga are the one that want to give weapons and ammo to the Kobane resistance.

[Request a new user name]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...ed-Kobane.html

Backtrack the feed, it takes forever, but its over. Final holdouts destroyed by a truck bomb and an offcourse USAF bomb that hit a YPG Sniper Position (IS tweeted its thanks with love and ask the USAF to bomb more YPG positions by mistake). The Tawheed Flag now flies in Kobane's Center and West as seen in the video.

The crew was then forced to leave as Turkey tightened security. No doubt to ensure YPG/PKK terrorists don't just join the protestors.

Turkey is wise to stay out of this mess till NATO is all in. IS won't bug them as they have bigger fish to fry, most of whom also happen to be Turkey's enemies, so why break up that fight?

[white-wolf]

Neither this, the peshmerga are the one that want to give weapons and ammo to the Kobane resistance.

ISIS and PKK/YPG. the supporters of ISIS and PKK/YPG. They have been killing Turkish citizens and why Turkey allow it?

[Principe Alessandro]

ISIS and PKK/YPG. the supporters of ISIS and PKK/YPG. They have been killing Turkish citizens and why Turkey allow it?

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...1#post14146080

Even those guys are ISIS or PKK?

[DarthLazy]

You say that as if it makes even the slightest sense that Turkey should intervene on behalf of whatever is left of the Syrian revolution, but even then the Turks have already said they will if the goal is to take out Assad along with all the rest of the crap.

[Vanoi]

I did my military service at the Turkish Syrian border. I was at Ceylanpınar, just opposite Resulayn. I was responsible on the security of just 6 kms of the border and believe me ; that's a lot of land to secure. All along Turkish Syrian border, there are valleys, hills, forests. For every troop you posted there, there will be huge logistic problems. These soldiers need to eat, drink, need polaces to bath etc.

At the security of the room, when you look to the map, things can seem very easy to you. Don't forget that all of E.U. is helping Greece and they can not secure Turkish-Greece border whicj is only 125 km ! USA is spending billions and have the most technological equipments, and still USA-Mexico border can not be secured.

Turkey has forces stationed all along its border. It has the 4th largest army in NATO. The ISIS only control around a 350km stretch of border land with Turkey. To say turkey couldn't guard its border is ridiculous. Like i said, if Turkey can't guard 350km stretch of land its military has no hope of facing the ISIS.

Meanwhile the US-Mexico border is 3168km long. Not a good comparison on your part.

The innocent Kurds already escaped to Turkey and are living here thanks to our taxes. Their brothers are burning and plundering our schools, hospitals etc in the name of "protests".

E.U. and USA are welcome to help them. Have you seen anyone mentioning US troops ? Or, English, French armies taking action ? Nope, everybody is waiting, nobody is sending help, why will Turkey take action? Right now, Turkish interests lie with waiting. You say that "Your country is leaving thousands of people to die and to face slavery and oppression at the hands of the ISIS", well, YOUR country is exactly doing the same.

US has sent troops to Iraq to combat the ISIS and is conducting airstrikes.

[Principe Alessandro]

You say that as if it makes even the slightest sense that Turkey should intervene on behalf of whatever is left of the Syrian revolution, but even then the Turks have already said they will if the goal is to take out Assad along with all the rest of the crap.

The only long term strategy of Turkey in Syria is to suppress the Kurdish cantons, to achieve this objective they firstly supported a coalition of Islamist groups in northern Syria were ISIS and al-Nusra were included, this coalition proved totally unreliable, and ineffective and some of those groups preferred to reach an agreement with YPG instead of fighting a pointless war against the Kurds which I remember declared themselves neutral in the war between the rebel and loyalists.

Turkey has found a new reliable proxy in the ISIS which is the most extremist group fighting in Syria but is also far more reliable in carrying the task of suppressing the Kurdish cantons.