ISIL War in Iraq and Syria

[PointOfViewGun]

How about an awesome idea: Turkey goes back to negotiate with the PKK on the subject of a peace deal? Oh wait Erodgan won't do that since he wants to maintain political dominance.

Why would any government do that when PKK used the last negotiation period to continue attacks and dug in explosive under roads?

[Vanoi]

What guarantee is there that PYD won't help PKK more actively once the hostilities in Syria is over?

Whats the reason to fight in the first place and not cooperate? There's no reason why the PYD is going to give up their amazing gains for a war with Turkey.

There are also articles on how PYD figthers are talking about them having no distinction between being a PYD member or a PKK member, that one day they fight under one name and the other they fight under an other. So, even the "not causing any damn trouble for Turkey" is questionable. Turkey's hate for PYD does not really primarily coming from having a Kurdic state on the border. In the past, Kurds from Syria participated a lot in PKK. At one time, the group had more Kurds from Syria than it had from Turkey. Turkey's cooperation with northern Iraqi Kurdic autonomous state is proof enough that this isn't merely about having Kurds on the border as a state.

Youtube videos are the best you got? The PYD make cooperate with the PKK but the PKK's war with Turkey is of its own. The PYD also enjoys US support, and i don;t think they will sacrifice that for a war with Turkey.

[Odenat]

Turkey should tolerate the PYD because its the most effective fighting force in Syria against the IS, is not causing any damn trouble for Turkey, and even cooperates with the FSA which Turkey itself supports.

The PYD may be connected to the PKK, but only one group is actually targeting Turkish soldier and is an actual threat to Turkey. Turkey's hate foe the PYD comes from them not wanting a Kurdish state on their border.

Wait, then why West does not tolerate Al-Nusra who is fighting against IS? You know, Al Queda is fighting against IS too. If we tolerate terrorists, then so do you! Or is it because PKK/PYD is killing Turkish people and they are worthless?

How about an awesome idea: Turkey goes back to negotiate with the PKK on the subject of a peace deal? Oh wait Erodgan won't do that since he wants to maintain political dominance.

How about an awesome idea: West negotiate with the ISIS on the subject of a peace deal at Syria? Oh wait, Western leaders won't do that since they need an excuse to bomb Muslims and sell more weapons.

It's funny to see that the same people who ask to us to negotiate with terrorists say they won't negotiate with the terrorists.

[PointOfViewGun]

Whats the reason to fight in the first place and not cooperate? There's no reason why the PYD is going to give up their amazing gains for a war with Turkey.

Youtube videos are the best you got? The PYD make cooperate with the PKK but the PKK's war with Turkey is of its own. The PYD also enjoys US support, and i don;t think they will sacrifice that for a war with Turkey.

Actually, I had an article in mind from a highly accepted media source, not YouTube videos. Wall Street Journal, in fact:

“It’s all PKK but different branches,” Ms. Ruken said, clad in fatigues in her encampment atop Sinjar Mountain this spring as a battle with Islamic State fighters raged less than a mile away at the mountain’s base. “Sometimes I’m a PKK, sometimes I’m a PJAK, sometimes I’m a YPG. It doesn’t really matter. They are all members of the PKK.”

[Abdülmecid I]

an example of Shia majority sectarian radicals, terrorists, and state proxy group all rolled up into one, with ties to or roots in Iran:

"Every major power (like Iran, Saudi Arabia, USA and Russia) uses terrorist organisations as proxies to achieve its goals in the Middle East. More news at 11."

[Vanoi]

Actually, I had an article in mind from a highly accepted media source, not YouTube videos. Wall Street Journal, in fact:

A random soldier's opinion is still not a reliable source. Why aren't we seeing mass movement of PYD between Turkey and Syria if there is apparently no different between them and the PKK? why aren't we seeing a lot of dead syrian kurd sin the Turkish military strikes?

Another boogeyman made by turkey. At least the US is smart enough not to fall for it.

[Niall101x]

It's heartening to see some good news from Syria again after so many terrorist victories this year, makes me think there might be hope for Syria after all.

[PointOfViewGun]

A random soldier's opinion is still not a reliable source. Why aren't we seeing mass movement of PYD between Turkey and Syria if there is apparently no different between them and the PKK? why aren't we seeing a lot of dead syrian kurd sin the Turkish military strikes?

Another boogeyman made by turkey. At least the US is smart enough not to fall for it.

Do we get detailed reports on identities of every single person that crosses the border or those that get killed? Not really. So, it's not like you have any evidence to argue against what I'm saying. YPG relationship with PKK being close is something that became common knowledge in the past year or so. Pretty much every article that cover those groups touch upon. While you implied that I was using YouTube videos, without having any evidence to support that mind you, I managed to provide an article from Wall Street Journal which cites a YPG/PKK member talking about the close relationship. Yet, you call it a boogeyman made by Turkey. Amazing. There are many Turkish and Kurdic sources that touch upon how people and materials go between the two groups. It's hard to find English sources talk about them but there are some as I've already provided. Meanwhile, you have nothing to show against.

But yeah. USA is not falling for it... As if supporting the non-terror related guys have always been an ammo of USA. Come on. That high horse have been dead for decades. It's all about supporting the guys that benefit them the most regardless of the methods.

[Odenat]

Assad is running out of men. Syrian army force the citizens of Damascus to conscript.

Meanwhile, yesterday, Russian planes bombed Idlib and murdered more than 70 civilians. The Syrian Network for Human Rights says that Russian attacks killed 570 civilians, including 152 children until now.Russians destroyed at least 13 hospitals and medical clinics since October.

And one note, Shia militias near Aleppo is actually Afghan Shias brought by Iran!

http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...-on-the-ground

[snuggans]

Iraqi special forces in Ramadi

(contains graphic content)




i'm looking for a 40+ minute amateur video that was in the news, of forces clearing out buildings in Ramadi, anyone know where to find it?

London-based IHS analysis shows that daesh incurred a net loss of 14% of their territory this year alone, or about 5,000 square miles. if you add this to their losses from 2014, you get somewhere around 30-45% loss of max claimed territory. don't let any republican presidential candidate or Defense secretary Ash Carter tell you that daesh is not largely contained, the 60% of poll participants who think Obama is doing a bad job are merely uninformed masses who want to see Baghdad being lit up again like it was 2003, while they cluelessly cheer from their sofas.

these figures would be higher of course if Assad, Iran, and Turkey were seriously fighting daesh, which they have not been doing.

however daesh is not 100% contained as long as they hold a border with the AKP government in Turkey, despite the kurds having largely reduced that border connection.

it's actually pretty enraging that daesh is mostly contained everywhere except with the border of a NATO country. which is unfortunately why they have to be ejected from NATO or at the very least threatened with ejection





as you can see, most of daesh's gains have been largely assad territory, in some cases he voluntarily withdrew his heavy forces without much of a fight such as in Palmyra. the russian bombing of the FSA also likely made it easier for daesh to take territory from them and generally expand westward.

factions that cannot be trusted in this fight:

Assad
Iran
Russia
AKP government
China (funneling weapons through Iran, contrarian voting record at the UNSC mimics Russia's)

what do they mostly have in common? they have been focusing on other factions and largely ignoring daesh or even supporting them.


one more thing: some people seem to think that the evidence of daesh not being contained is their attacks abroad like the paris attacks. it's the opposite, it is BECAUSE daesh is contained in iraq and syria that they are fleeing the battlefield and returning to the west to end themselves in a crowd of civilians instead.

they are starting to see the futility of their caliphate, they can't act like a potent military force anymore that takes large amounts of territories in just 3 days, they are gradually returning to the underground.

and what's worse is... no western country deployed an occupation like daesh wanted them to. they're getting rolled by the locals fighting back. embarrassing, getting eaten by a cat on a Vice News video


List of dead daesh leaders/officers

• Abu Musab al-Zarqawi (founder; killed in 2006)[26]
• Abu Ayyub al-Masri (killed in 2010)[27]
• Abu Abdullah al-Rashid al-Baghdadi (killed in 2010)[28]
• Abdelmajid Al-Atibi Al-Sabti, religious emir (killed in 2014)[29]
• Abu Ala al-Afri (Deputy leader of ISIL; unconfirmed reports he was killed in 2015)[30][31][32][33]
• Akram Qirbash (top ISIL judge; killed in 2015)[32]
• Abu Sayyaf (senior leader overseeing ISIL's gas and oil operations killed in May 2015 in a special United States Army Delta Force operation in eastern Syria)[34]
• Fadhil Ahmad al-Hayali (also known as Abu Muslim al-Turkmani, Haji Mutazz and Abu Mutaz al-Qurashi), Deputy leader in charge of Iraq; killed by US military strike 18 August 2015
• Abu Taisir (Al-Zarqawi's top Lieutenant, killed in 2003)[40]
• Abu Anas al-Shami (Strategist, and Al-Zarqawi's adviser, killed in 2004)[41]
• Abu Azzam (killed in 2005)[42]
• Abu Omar al-Kurdi (captured in 2005)[43]
• Abdul Hadi al-Iraqi (captured in 2006)[44]
• Sheik Abd-Al-Rahman (killed in 2006)[45]
• Hamid Juma Faris Jouri al-Saeedi (captured in 2006)[46]
• Abu Yaqub al-Masri (killed in 2007)[47]
• Haitham al-Badri (killed in 2007)[48]
• Khaled al-Mashhadani (captured in 2007)[49]
• Mahir al-Zubaydi (killed in 2008)[50]
• Mohamed Moumou (killed in 2008)[51]
• Huthaifa al-Batawi (killed in 2011)[52]
• Abu Abdulrahman al-Bilawi (killed in 2014)[53]
• Omar al-Farouk al-Turki (ISIL Governor of Al-Hasakah Governorate, killed in 2014)
• Douglas McCain (killed in 2014)[54]
• Abd al Basit (Military emir in Iraq, killed in 2014)[55]
• Abu Ahmad al-Alwani (Member of military council, killed late 2014)[56]
• Abu Ayman al-Iraqi (Head of Military Shura, killed in late 2014)[4][57]
• Radwan Talib (Mosul Governor, killed in 2014)[55][58]
• Hassan Hassan Saeed Al-Jabouri (replacement Mosul Governor, killed in 2014)[58]
• Hazem Al-Saeedi - Jarf Al-Sekhar region, Southern Iraq (killed in 2014)[59]
• Haji Bakr (Strategic head and top deputy in Syria, killed in 2014)[60]
• Abu Maria - Top ISIL commander in Tikrit[61] (killed in 2015)
• Tariq bin al-Tahar bin al-Falih al-'Awni al-Harzi (emir of suicide bombers, fundraiser,[62] killed in 2015)
• Abu Malik (co-Emir of the Kharbadan front, killed in 2015)[63]
• Abu Abdul-aziz (co-Emir of the Kharbadan front, killed in 2015)[64]
• Abu Abdullah, media coordinator for Mosul area; killed near Mosul by US military strike 18 August 2015[35]
• Denis Cuspert (also known Abu Talha al-Almani), (German recruiter; killed 16 October 2015 near Raqqa in US air strike)
• Mohammed Emwazi, nicknamed "Jihadi John" (participant in beheading videos; reportedly killed 12 November 2015 near Raqqa in US air strike)[65]
• Abu Aiman (governor, killed in 2015)[66]
• Abu Hadi (governor, killed in 2015)[67]
• Abu Nabil al Anbari, Leader of ISIL Libya Provinces (killed in an air strike in November 2015)[18]
• Mullah Abdul Rauf (Deputy Leader of Wilayat Khorasan; killed in 2015)[19][20]
• Hafiz Wahidi (Replacement Deputy Leader of Wilayat Khorasan; killed in 2015)[21]
• Abdul Rahim Muslim Dost (Recruiter for Wilayat Khorasan)[22][23]
• Ahmed al-Ruwaysi or Abu Zakariya al-Tunisi (killed in 2015)[24]
• Selim Suleiman al-Haram (a leader of Egypt branch, killed in 2015)[25]

pretty hilarious that Russia and Russia-supporters were taking credit for 'mass routing' daesh, just another lie to accompany the one told at the UN that they were going after daesh. but this also makes Trump and Trump-supporters look that much more idiotic when they say "let Russia bomb isis" while Donald exchanges cute texts with his new BFF Putin

[Costin_Razvan]

How about an awesome idea: West negotiate with the ISIS on the subject of a peace deal at Syria? Oh wait, Western leaders won't do that since they need an excuse to bomb Muslims and sell more weapons.

It's funny to see that the same people who ask to us to negotiate with terrorists say they won't negotiate with the terrorists.

Last I recall the PKK isn't crucifying people, using chemical weapons, assaulting a major European capital, destroying priceless historical relics, enslaving entire ethnic minorities and working to wipe out every single non-sunni religious group and unlike ISIS the PKK is willing to negotiate.

[PointOfViewGun]

it's actually pretty enraging that daesh is mostly contained everywhere except with the border of a NATO country. which is unfortunately why they have to be ejected from NATO or at the very least threatened with ejection

Care to tell me the point in lying about a situation while posting a map that refutes your claims?

[snuggans]

how does the map contradict me? just because there's no dark gray daesh area painted inside of turkey doesn't mean they aren't passing through

and for the tenth time, Turkey is firing on anybody that tries to attack daesh west of the euphrates around manbij or jarabulus. if that isn't supporting daesh i don't know what is. that's some extremist crap right there.

and i was giving Turkey the benefit of the doubt before when people were accusing them of supplying al-nusra, but now im not so sure. its suddenly become really believable

AKP is an extremist government in cahoots with daesh and possibly al-nusra, and it is a serious disservice to have them in NATO, it seriously undermines the integrity of NATO as an organization

lets not forget that Turkish officials cry and moan and curse when Kurds take over a town from daesh, like Tal Abyad

like seriously... wow. Turkey can't be trusted at all, in fact i think that sharing bases with them is some sort of security risk, they could be spying on us and sharing intel with others, it's no wonder that US-allied forces entering from the turkish border get ambushed by somebody who happens to just know the time, date and location. something's going on here

[PointOfViewGun]

how does the map contradict me? just because there's no dark gray daesh area painted inside of turkey doesn't mean they aren't passing through

and for the tenth time, Turkey is firing on anybody that tries to attack daesh west of the euphrates around manbij or jarabulus. if that isn't supporting daesh i don't know what is. that's some extremist crap right there.

and i was giving Turkey the benefit of the doubt before when people were accusing them of supplying al-nusra, but now im not so sure. its suddenly become really believable

AKP is an extremist government in cahoots with daesh and possibly al-nusra, and it is a serious disservice to have them in NATO, it seriously undermines the integrity of NATO as an organization

Topping a lie with a lie amazing... No, the map doesn't show ISIL being contained in anywhere except the Turkish border. In fact, technically, the biggest loss from ISIL is on the Turkish border. Other than that, ISIL is clearly in control of important places like Mosul, Raqqa, Palmyra and Deir al-Zour. Again, no, Turkey is not firing on anybody that tries to attack ISIL west of the Euphrates around Manjib or Jarablus. That's an awfully deceptive way of saying Turkey doesn't want YPG, a group with material ties to PKK, to cross the Euphrates to form a state with the western regions under Kurd's control. Somehow it's a disservice to have Turkey in the NATO because they don't want terror linked groups in the long run on their border but it's ok to support a group that could and likely does hurt a NATO member. The double standards remain well alive!

[snuggans]

In fact, technically, the biggest loss from ISIL is on the Turkish border.

.... thanks to the Kurds, ... whom you don't want to attack daesh, because they're going to have more territory in a country that is not Turkey.

absolutely nuts this line of logic


you are in fact demonstrating that you'd rather prefer daesh and al-nusra on your border over kurds, and this is exactly why Turkey does not belong in NATO. AKP has gone rogue

No, the map doesn't show ISIL being contained in anywhere except the Turkish border.

lmao

Somehow it's a disservice to have Turkey in the NATO because they don't want terror linked groups in the long run on their border but it's ok to support a group that could and likely does hurt a NATO member.

when Turkey actually gets a competent government that isn't sectarian, the kurds will talk.

when is daesh or al-nusra going to talk?

checkmate

[PointOfViewGun]

.... thanks to the Kurds, ... whom you don't want to attack daesh, because they're going to have more territory in a country that is not Turkey.

absolutely nuts this line of logic

you are in fact demonstrating that you'd rather prefer daesh and al-nusra on your border over kurds, and this is exactly why Turkey does not belong in NATO. AKP has gone rogue

lmao

when Turkey actually gets a competent government that isn't sectarian, the kurds will talk.

when is daesh or al-nusra going to talk?

checkmate

By your logic Turkey supported YPG for years as YPG took over majority of the border with Turkey... Say something logical and coherent please. Right now, you're merely shooting in air. Your lack of intelligible responses are a sign of that. Remember, "lmao" is not a proper response to give when you're shown to be wrong... Talks with PKK yielded dozens of people dead and bunch of explosives dug under roads. It's not exactly a good outcome. Talk doesn't automatically equal positive progress. Just because ISIL won't talk doesn't mean Turkey has to tolerate YPG either. Groups like ISIL and al-Nusra will go. They're not here to stay and only present a danger in the short run. What YPG represents, on the other hand, is decades of conflict. Why should Turkey help create a safe haven for PKK to get members from and train in? Turkey want's to fight ISIL, but through other groups.

Remember. Say something logical and coherent. Please.

[Costin_Razvan]

I want to share this report, and I very strongly recommend people read it:

http://www.lrb.co.uk/v38/n01/seymour...ry-to-military

Essentially top US military and intelligence brass thought that removing Assad was a moronic idea, that it would cause more chaos and instability in Syria and get a lot of people, especially minorities killed. It also mentions that the Saudis are amenable to the idea of negotiating but that Erdogan isn't due to his delusions of restoring the Ottoman Empire.

Very big point of this: Martin Dempsey and other figures in the military worked to help Assad remain in power by giving him intelligence and ensuring the supplies the US was sending to the rebels were useless, they didn't quite succeed but still. They sent intel through Germany, Israel and Russia.

Oh and by the way: Turkey armed Al-Qaeda in Syria.

[Abdülmecid I]

factions that cannot be trusted in this fight:

That looks more like a list of factions that an American patriot wouldn't be very fond of. I wouldn't trust most of the rebels either. Let's not forget that the Syrian Army was forced to retreat from Palmyra, because in the same time, the rebels of NW Syria launched one of their largest offensives. I have a feeling that this helped ISIL slightly more than the Russian bombing against both ISIL and the "moderate" islamists in Aleppo.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northw...93June_2015%29

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmyr...%28May_2015%29

Meanwhile, just off the top of my head, I can think of two offensives against ISIL in Palmyra, one in Hasakah and another one in Aleppo. How many offensives has the trustworthy FSA made against ISIL?

[Odenat]

Last I recall the PKK isn't crucifying people, using chemical weapons, assaulting a major European capital, destroying priceless historical relics, enslaving entire ethnic minorities and working to wipe out every single non-sunni religious group and unlike ISIS the PKK is willing to negotiate.

PKK is murdering civilians, bombing hospitals, burning schools. But you still don't say they are terrorists because they do not kill Europeans! Tell me, does the life of a Turkish civilian have any value for you?

Europeans are arming PKK terrorists! Then you come here and say Turkey is supporting terrorists! So much hypocrisy is sickening.

[Costin_Razvan]

Tell me, does the life of a Turkish civilian have any value for you?

Does the life of any civilian have value for Erdogan? Seeing as he armed Al-Qaeda.

But hey those 100 people killed in Ankara were probably not civilians to you. Or wait the PKK did it...by killing the people that supported them.