Medieval Kingdoms Total War Screenshots and Videos Thread

[paleologos]

Weren't the crests (ususlly heraldic/decorative tops) only part of parade pieces?
Or for the tournament?

Edit:
I mean, explain to me the combat or recognition utility of the crests in the Codex Manesse.
Example Ulrich Von Lichtenstein:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Notice the three rounded prongs on the tip of the lance in the upper-left corner of the illustration, this is a "de-weaponized" lance.

[+Marius+]

No, they are present in battlefield depictions all over the place, until greathelms faded out in fashion;

http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...-5_gallery.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...-6_gallery.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/3dHiIm3.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...-1_gallery.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...-3_gallery.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/YY4sc8x.jpg

It has nothing to do with practicality, it is about status and striking fear into the enemy.
Just as they made their spurs and gauntlet gilding in pure gold and put God knows what other amount of jewelry into their equipment.

The first reason is a statement: "I am rich, therefore I had multiple martial arts training instructors since I was 5, stay away from me."
The other statement is: "I am rich, do not kill me, my family has loads of cash and will ransom me."

In short, what is more scary to you, this;

http://games.necrosys.com/pix/weapon...great_helm.jpg

or this;

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ury,_front.jpg

Imagine you are a superstitious commoner soldier that did not see anything beyond a mile of surrounding forest while you are at it.

[Dontfearme22]

Good point, in general I often see a lot of military equipment portrayed in contemporary art derided as "not practical." I think people vastly underestimate the other factors that went into warfare besides pure utilitarian slaughter.

Its like when archeologists find strange objects from prehistoric cultures and assume its religious, military historians find 'outlandish' armor and weapons, and say its ceremonial.

[paleologos]

You could be right at least partially.
I do remember seeing an illustration of a knight whose crest was a caged songbird, hardly scary.
The image of the horned great helm is captioned in wikipedia as "Funeral helmet of the von Pranckh family, 14th century, with the crest of two bullhorns."
In the rest of the images you provide links for, the sight of such helmets on the battlefield remains a rarity.
It was certailny not a raity to illustrate them as they were more likely to catch the eye of the heralds and therefore make it to the record of the battle and the chonicles.
Perhaps we have the answer right there.
A knight who could afford to be ransomed would probably care more about his name making it to the anals of the battle.
The others would probably like to keep a low profile.
The richer one looked on the battlefield the more likely it was to draw the attention of professionals who made a livelyhood of ransoming defeated adversaries.

[+Marius+]

The image of the horned great helm is captioned in wikipedia as "Funeral helmet of the von Pranckh family, 14th century, with the crest of two bullhorns."

There are basically no remains of such decorative helms so I put that one just to illustrate how it might have looked like IRL.

In the rest of the images you provide links for, the sight of such helmets on the battlefield remains a rarity.

Rarity, but an often recurring rarity;

http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...12_gallery.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...13_gallery.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...19_gallery.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...25_gallery.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...-9_gallery.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...-8_gallery.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...26_gallery.jpg
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...29_gallery.jpg

They are even more present in dueling depictions, tournaments(as you already stated) and other themes such as mythology;

http://manuscriptminiatures.com/medi...-4_gallery.jpg

It was certailny not a raity to illustrate them as they were more likely to catch the eye of the heralds and therefore make it to the record of the battle and the chonicles.

Does not change the fact that they were there and that they look amazing and thus...should be ingame

[The Despondent Mind]

Why do we take those medieval illustrations so seriously, I mean I saw some depictions of "crusaders and saracens" as men with full plate armor on both sides and not even remotely resembling battles in crusades, probably because artists know or care jack about authenticity.

[the lightning legion]

Why do we take those medieval illustrations so seriously, I mean I saw some depictions of "crusaders and saracens" as men with full plate armor on both sides and not even remotely resembling battles in crusades, probably because artists know or care jack about authenticity.

one thing i can never get over is the psychopathic smiles on everyones faces even when being cut in half.

[warman222]

Well when you're about to die sometimes you feel like doing something special.

Anyways, we do have some stuff I can try and use for decorations though we aren't exactly full of them. I'm working on some additional units for the factions I've done already, England, France and Burgundy, basically designed for around the early 1300s. I made this decision because some of the later units are too late for the timeframe they're supposed to be in plus we kinda skipped the period where Great helms were most prominent. So things are going to be adjusted a bit, most of it is just playing with what's already completed so don't worry about me getting bogged down. Especially since I finally finished the unit specific banners. Also there's other things I've been working on for MK as well, some campaign related things... Suffice to say, I've not been idle. But I will be out of town from Wednesday to Saturday. And I can't wait til you guys know why.

[helmersen]

So excited to hear from you! So we'll hear from you in a week?

[+Marius+]

Why do we take those medieval illustrations so seriously,

Because they are a clear representation of what the artist saw.

I mean I saw some depictions of "crusaders and saracens" as men with full plate armor on both sides and not even remotely resembling battles in crusades, probably because artists know or care jack about authenticity.

That is irrelevant.
The reason why you saw such depictions is because they were made during the era of plate armor and thus, the artists pictured what they knew at the time.
What you fail to realize is that the armor they pictured is very often absolutely authentic, just for their own time frame and not for the crusades.

Also, every single image I provided is from a manuscript that was contemporary to the timeline when greathelms were in use.
Every single one is from the 13th/14th century and is absolutely authentic.

People back then weren't even capable of making out equipment out of their imagination, out of 1000s of images you will find very few items of equipment that are a product of imagination rather than something the artist actually saw himself.

[warman222]

I am going to try and get some other stuff done between now and Tuesday afternoon, so I won't be idle but things will stop come Wednesday.

[Slytacular]

I kinda screwed up on the culverin again because I forgot the axle is located inside that bottom box. It is still yet to be textured. Here it is so far.

https://skfb.ly/HWCV

[the lightning legion]

thats awesome!

will the basilisk be in it too? i've always had a little bit of fanboyism for the basilisk.

[The Despondent Mind]

Because they are a clear representation of what the artist saw.



That is irrelevant.
The reason why you saw such depictions is because they were made during the era of plate armor and thus, the artists pictured what they knew at the time.
What you fail to realize is that the armor they pictured is very often absolutely authentic, just for their own time frame and not for the crusades.

Also, every single image I provided is from a manuscript that was contemporary to the timeline when greathelms were in use.
Every single one is from the 13th/14th century and is absolutely authentic.

People back then weren't even capable of making out equipment out of their imagination, out of 1000s of images you will find very few items of equipment that are a product of imagination rather than something the artist actually saw himself.

I just have a hard time imagining a medieval painter or artist going to the barracks to research and study all the equipment and how it was used, so all we have is his perception, and as we know most of human beings don't have a clear photographic objective memory. I'm not saying all of them are flawed sources, but that we should take it with a grain of salt as they were ARTISTS, I can't stress enough how much these people don't care about authenticity if it conflicts with their own vision or work, which is ok since they are not expected to be scientists and chroniclers.

[+Marius+]

I just have a hard time imagining a medieval painter or artist going to the barracks to research and study all the equipment and how it was used, so all we have is his perception, and as we know most of human beings don't have a clear photographic objective memory. I'm not saying all of them are flawed sources, but that we should take it with a grain of salt as they were ARTISTS, I can't stress enough how much these people don't care about authenticity if it conflicts with their own vision or work, which is ok since they are not expected to be scientists and chroniclers.

I agree to a point, but only in the sense that they could play with the design of already existent equipment, not make up completely new stuff.

The artists probably did see all that equipment up close, during that time, it was impossible not to.
From all the manuscripts that I saw, nothing led me to believe that the artists simply "winged it" and painted whatever they wanted, the artistic style in the period demanded to paint what you see and how it is(unless you are painting fiction ofc).

[Slytacular]

I think its more of a situation where the artist walks by the same five to ten guards every day for almost every year. Some places in Europe, people get commemorated or pay to be commemorated by having their image of them depicted as a carving, illustration, or stained glass. I think a lot of the medieval art that is preserved is for the purpose of passing down knowledge to future generations. Even in bible illustrations, I think people wanted images of themselves on the scene and that is why historians can believe there is a lot of truth in illustrations besides finding actual artifacts that represent the items associated in an illustrated scene.

[The Despondent Mind]

I agree to a point, but only in the sense that they could play with the design of already existent equipment, not make up completely new stuff.

The artists probably did see all that equipment up close, during that time, it was impossible not to.
From all the manuscripts that I saw, nothing led me to believe that the artists simply "winged it" and painted whatever they wanted, the artistic style in the period demanded to paint what you see and how it is(unless you are painting fiction ofc).

Yes I am sure most of artists were pretty close and some of them downright accurate 99%, but I guess I wanna say that we shouldn't always have them the last say, unless we know the artists background and his relation to the event in question.

[Arifian]

Thanks everybody! I was playing around in the mod a bit, and I found a perfect chance and took some a couple of screens of the Pavisiers unit that France gets later on. With the new metal textures sights like below look very striking.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

It looks nice but it looks to clean like it was just made in a factory and sended in the batttlefield(sorry if it sounds negative)

[+Marius+]

It looks nice but it looks to clean

This may come as a shock to you, but unlike hollywood would like you to believe, people in the Middle Ages weren't covered in mud, dirt and various feces of unknown origin.

Cleanliness, bathhouses and regular bathing/washing never really went out of fashion...especially with people whose equipment would rust with contact with anything not completely dry.

[Arifian]

Its not the armor or the people that got mine attention but the schields