Windows 8.1 compatibility

[mtwfan1990]

Dear fellow Total War fans !

I am very sorry if it is another topic of its kind, but I have to try ! I have been searching all over the internet to figure a way to make Medieval Total War (the first one) compatible and playable on windows 8. Unfortunately I could not find anything whatsoever that actually worked. The furthest I've got was to make it to the intro movie, but only to see it crash back to my desktop :'(.

So after some more searching I've found an active topic on this great forum about MTW Redux. I was very suprised to see fellow fans still active on my favorite game of all time. My question there is: Is there any possibility to make MTW work and playable on windows 8?

I would really hope that someone has found a possibility

[Tango12345]

Moved to MTW forum.

EDIT-and merged with other thread on same topic. This is a general issue with MTW/Win 8, and putting it in tech help would not solve the issue.

[Diocle]

Even before changing my machine (now I'm running Win 8) at some point I couldn't play Med1 anymore, after some search here and there and after having tried all the ways to run the game, I discovered that it's a issue created by DirectX, that is, at some point of the evolution of DirectX (DirectX 9?) the game has become incompatible and in practice you have no hope to run it.

Nevertheless, I do hope being wrong, because actually Med1 (especially Viking Invasion) and Shogun1 were great, great, great games.

[roy_d_merkel]

Even before changing my machine (now I'm running Win 8) at some point I couldn't play Med1 anymore, after some search here and there and after having tried all the ways to run the game, I discovered that it's a issue created by DirectX, that is, at some point of the evolution of DirectX (DirectX 9?) the game has become incompatible and in practice you have no hope to run it.

Nevertheless, I do hope being wrong, because actually Med1 (especially Viking Invasion) and Shogun1 were great, great, great games.

Yes and no. That's part of the problem is that directx has changed so much but it's also because whomever wrote this software did something I was explicitly told not to do when I was still working in the video game industry: mixing gdi, directx, and native windows api calls (yeah we cheated from time to time, but generally this was something I was told not to do except under extreme circumstances.)

The reason? There's no guarantee of long term compatibility if you mix gdi + directx or native windows api + directx (as we are seeing here, and by the hacks I had to use when I get it to work temporarily, I suspect they did all three at the time)

On the other hand (getting off my soap box) on occasion, programmers have to do some kind of dicey/shaky things (yes, even in dx 9, though not like Dx 1-8) to make the software work efficiently.

So basically, in the end, you either have to get lucky, someone has to update the source code for the game, or we have to hope that someone comes up with a new updated compatibility or windowing wrapper that works. (potentially someone with aptitude could debug Dxwnd, as the source is available, but I think that's above my aptitude level.)

[El Chupanibre]

I wish they'd release source code, or update it to some sort of HD version but we all know it will never happen. CA doesn't want you playing their old vastly superior titles, they want you buying shiny new ones that get a little less bad every year so you think it's worth paying for, a sort of planned obsolescence.

[ZELS]

Hy, where is the save folder in this system?

[roy_d_merkel]

Hy, where is the save folder in this system?

Depends on your version of windows (and whether or not you overcame the default settings.)

Oh and whether or not you turned off uac/went arround it by installing outside of <drive>:\Program Files*\ (I was going to find the UAC install folder on my laptop, only to realize that I intentionally installed to c:\Program Files (uac)\ to make it not go to a save folder.)

What version of windows you using, and are you running the game as administrator, or as a regular user (if you run as administrator, I think it still installs to c:\Program Files*\Medieval Total War)

[roy_d_merkel]

Oh and I have dxwnd working again on my windows 8.1 64 bit laptop under version v2.03.21 using the following settings:



I also attached a link to the .dxw file, which can be imported into dxwnd (though you have to update the program location to match your program location.)

Prince of Judah and chrissher123, could you try with new settings under dxwnd version v2.03.21 and let me know if it's still being wonky for you?

1. Main: Hot patch (obfuscated IAT) - on
2. Direct x: by default set no ALPHACHANNEL - on
3. Direct 3d: texture Handling - None (don't know if this is neccessary or not, the default setting is no radio buttons set.)
4. Libs: GDI: Emulted Device Context
5. Libs: Kernel: Extended Hook
6. Compat: Limit Available Resources

Attachent: http://googledrive.com/host/0B56OMvU...alTotalWar.dxw

[El Chupanibre]

Oh and I have dxwnd working again on my windows 8.1 64 bit laptop under version v2.03.21 using the following settings:



I also attached a link to the .dxw file, which can be imported into dxwnd (though you have to update the program location to match your program location.)

Prince of Judah and chrissher123, could you try with new settings under dxwnd version v2.03.21 and let me know if it's still being wonky for you?

1. Main: Hot patch (obfuscated IAT) - on
2. Direct x: by default set no ALPHACHANNEL - on
3. Direct 3d: texture Handling - None (don't know if this is neccessary or not, the default setting is no radio buttons set.)
4. Libs: GDI: Emulted Device Context
5. Libs: Kernel: Extended Hook
6. Compat: Limit Available Resources

Attachent: http://googledrive.com/host/0B56OMvU...alTotalWar.dxw

I tried this, and just got "unable to initialize Direct3d" and closes. Without dxwnd I can at least watch the intro movie.

[roy_d_merkel]

I tried this, and just got "unable to initialize Direct3d" and closes. Without dxwnd I can at least watch the intro movie.

Try changing DirectX: Emulation to "Hybrid mode", though it would significantly slow down emulation. Are you using teh current head?

Also did you import .dxw file, and tweak it's runtime path?

[El Chupanibre]

Try changing DirectX: Emulation to "Hybrid mode", though it would significantly slow down emulation. Are you using teh current head?

Also did you import .dxw file, and tweak it's runtime path?

Well hybrid mode got the game to launch, but it's all black, I can hear myself clicking menu stuff and exiting but it's all black.

[roy_d_merkel]

Well hybrid mode got the game to launch, but it's all black, I can hear myself clicking menu stuff and exiting but it's all black.

Curses... Foiled again So are you using a 32 bit or a 64bit machine? (If you are using a 32 bit machine, then I might need to see if I can install a 32bit version of windows on this laptop so I can get to the bottom of why it works on this laptop but on noone else's.)

[El Chupanibre]

Curses... Foiled again So are you using a 32 bit or a 64bit machine? (If you are using a 32 bit machine, then I might need to see if I can install a 32bit version of windows on this laptop so I can get to the bottom of why it works on this laptop but on noone else's.)

Windows 8.1 64-bit. I've tried tweaking stuff but nothing successful, I might try contacting the creator of dxwnd.

I want to try something: could you upload your Medieval.cfg file? I want to see what will happen if I paste your config over my install.

[El Chupanibre]

A possible solution?

I also like to play an old game called Take No Prisoners, which runs fine in Windows 8.1 64-bit but only in software mode, not D3D. Until I found a program on VOGONS called dgVoodoo2, it's a hacked dll wrapper that emulates old Voodoo API (I think? I'm not too sure about this stuff) Anyway dgVoodoo2 doesn't help at all with MTW, but I'm on the lookout for similar API wrappers that can emulate older directx environments. What version of directx did MTW run on exactly? What dlls did it use? Again I don't know a whole lot about this so if someone could explain it to me it would help, don't be afraid to get technical.

[roy_d_merkel]

Sure, sorry missed your reply.

Attached: http://googledrive.com/host/0B56OMvU...c/Medieval.Cfg

[roy_d_merkel]

A possible solution?

I also like to play an old game called Take No Prisoners, which runs fine in Windows 8.1 64-bit but only in software mode, not D3D. Until I found a program on VOGONS called dgVoodoo2, it's a hacked dll wrapper that emulates old Voodoo API (I think? I'm not too sure about this stuff) Anyway dgVoodoo2 doesn't help at all with MTW, but I'm on the lookout for similar API wrappers that can emulate older directx environments. What version of directx did MTW run on exactly? What dlls did it use? Again I don't know a whole lot about this so if someone could explain it to me it would help, don't be afraid to get technical.

I haven't dug deep enough. I think it's a mix of DX7. 8. and 9 calls (by what version of the api they make you install for each upgrade -- from base which is 7 to 8 for some of the upgrades to 9 for viking invasion. I think DXWND links in DX9 mode, though I don't know if that's the correct mode to override or not, maybe we need a solution that hits api calls for all three levels)

I can also tell you by what allows it to work on my machine that they mix in GDI (native windows api calls -- yeah you can, under controlled circumstances, use native gdi calls on a DX9 surface though you can run into the kind of incompatibilities that we are seeing, which is why I was told not to do it).

[El Chupanibre]

A Shiny Gold Doubloon for whoever can explain this to me

I have no clue why this worked, but I was browsing the mtw board on the total war forums and in the FAQ I was reminded of the skip intro trick: create a blank text file in your game folder called skipcredits.txt, when I did that the game started up! No crash. The resolution is still stuck at the lowest, the framerate is HORRID both in the menus and in battle. I tried a custom battle and it was playable but at pretty low FPS. When I tried to quit back to the menu it hard crashed. Still, that's progress. DXWND still results in a black screen or a "failed to initialize direct3d yada yada". Now to try fiddling with these hacked dlls. Maybe I can play some MTW before directx 12 comes out and breaks everything again!

[roy_d_merkel]

A Shiny Gold Doubloon for whoever can explain this to me

I have no clue why this worked, but I was browsing the mtw board on the total war forums and in the FAQ I was reminded of the skip intro trick: create a blank text file in your game folder called skipcredits.txt, when I did that the game started up! No crash. The resolution is still stuck at the lowest, the framerate is HORRID both in the menus and in battle. I tried a custom battle and it was playable but at pretty low FPS. When I tried to quit back to the menu it hard crashed. Still, that's progress. DXWND still results in a black screen or a "failed to initialize direct3d yada yada". Now to try fiddling with these hacked dlls. Maybe I can play some MTW before directx 12 comes out and breaks everything again!

Yeah I'm not really sure what to recommend, at this point. Maybe use my method if it works, otherwise someone will have to find yet another method for those that don't work. (you're Voodoo api idea is a good one, if you can make it work, there are other windowers out there too like the old D3DWindower, maybe one of them work?)

For me, by itself, skipcredits works to get to the main menu, but then the game crashes a second time when I try to start the game (with or without button fix.)

As for the resolution, I think someone put a hacked dll on the board, somewhere, that allows the game to get into bigger resolutions without all the stuff my solution sticks in there (or, if that doesn't work, and you don't mind booting specifically for this game, you can restart your computer with a memory cap of 2 gigs -- there's instructions on the board for that too -- which would be a pain if you have to do it a lot.)

[myself]

The game is coming to steam very soon. Hopefully, it will work with windows 8 natively.

[El Chupanibre]

The game is coming to steam very soon. Hopefully, it will work with windows 8 natively.

I just saw. Yeah! Let's hope they put a little effort into making them more compatible with modern systems so I can stop fussing over this.