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Thread: SSHIP - General Discussion

  1. #4501

    Default Re: How do you guys play without losing reputation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dekhatres View Post
    use a submod
    which one?

  2. #4502

    Default Re: How do you guys play without losing reputation?

    Quote Originally Posted by kingofportugal View Post
    which one?
    search in the mini mods section, i know there was talk about it a while ago but cant remember the name, alternatively make one yourself

    looking right now in export_descr_buildings.txt (located in data folder of the mod) hospitaller knights for example have "and event_counter order_recruitment_enabled 1" as requirement, i dont know exactly if that's the culprit since i have a diferent version but i think deleting that requirement should do the trick
    You know you've played too much Stainless Steel when in every other mod you play you think cavalry is too weak.

  3. #4503

    Default Re: How do you guys play without losing reputation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dekhatres View Post
    search in the mini mods section, i know there was talk about it a while ago but cant remember the name, alternatively make one yourself

    looking right now in export_descr_buildings.txt (located in data folder of the mod) hospitaller knights for example have "and event_counter order_recruitment_enabled 1" as requirement, i dont know exactly if that's the culprit since i have a diferent version but i think deleting that requirement should do the trick
    Yes that allows you to recruit those units, but it uses your reputation #, it doesn't actually affect it.

  4. #4504

    Default I quit this mod. Reputation mechanic doesnt work for a proper gameplay.

    I played a few games and there is no way to win a war without losing reputation.

    I actually enjoyed the fact that even occupy makes you lose reputation.

    But then the diplomacy won't allow for the conflict to be solved by battles on the field, and that would be the proper way to do the mod.

    Instead you are left fighting against the Ai, beating him constantly, only to sign a cease fire that never goes below balanced, unless you conquer their settlements, which will lower your reputation.

    So basically the only way to play this mod, is to steamroll everyone in your way, and dont give two s about reputation because you are going to lose it anyways. Sack everything and exterminate everything. Because if you occupy you lose it anyways.

    Terrible mechanic. But if you fixed that, it would actually be a good mod.

    If you could somehow make the reputation recover in other ways. But like i said, you would still need to be careful in not occupying in the enemy towns, the only alternative is to make the diplomacy more flexible and make the AI accept terms without you having to totally destroy him, which means conquering all its cities, which means losing all reputation.

    You could also create a script where the player can obtain towns via for example diplomacy if winning a war.

    I found myself playing as a minor faction, and just stayed on the defensive because i didnt want to conquer new towns because i didnt want to lose reputation.

    This is a major issue. Because if it is not for the reputation, nothing is stopping you from just exterminating or sacking every single town. At least make the occupy null effect in reputation. AT least. But then you lose your mechanic of punishing expansion of big empires.

    This is my only issue with this mod. Everything else is great and i would say even better than Titanium. However titanium is a bit too arcadey, but at least the reputation is not broken, and the diplomacy actually works.

    Good luck SSHIPers, i will try this mod again in a few years.

  5. #4505

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    try just copying the file called descr_diplomacy.xml from titanium data folder to SSHIP's. dimplomacy should now be like in titanium

    as for reputation i think i've located the file in question, it's called descr_faction_standing.txt if you wanna tweak stuff, just scroll down and you should start seeing things like rep loss when at war, when executing prisoners etc
    if you want it to work like in titanium you would just open both files and copy the values from titanium's descr_faction_standing to SSHIP's
    You know you've played too much Stainless Steel when in every other mod you play you think cavalry is too weak.

  6. #4506
    Jurand of Cracow's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: I quit this mod. Reputation mechanic doesnt work for a proper gameplay.

    Quote Originally Posted by kingofportugal View Post
    I played a few games and there is no way to win a war without losing reputation.

    I actually enjoyed the fact that even occupy makes you lose reputation.

    But then the diplomacy won't allow for the conflict to be solved by battles on the field, and that would be the proper way to do the mod.

    Instead you are left fighting against the Ai, beating him constantly, only to sign a cease fire that never goes below balanced, unless you conquer their settlements, which will lower your reputation.

    So basically the only way to play this mod, is to steamroll everyone in your way, and dont give two s about reputation because you are going to lose it anyways. Sack everything and exterminate everything. Because if you occupy you lose it anyways.

    Terrible mechanic. But if you fixed that, it would actually be a good mod.

    If you could somehow make the reputation recover in other ways. But like i said, you would still need to be careful in not occupying in the enemy towns, the only alternative is to make the diplomacy more flexible and make the AI accept terms without you having to totally destroy him, which means conquering all its cities, which means losing all reputation.

    You could also create a script where the player can obtain towns via for example diplomacy if winning a war.

    I found myself playing as a minor faction, and just stayed on the defensive because i didnt want to conquer new towns because i didnt want to lose reputation.

    This is a major issue. Because if it is not for the reputation, nothing is stopping you from just exterminating or sacking every single town. At least make the occupy null effect in reputation. AT least. But then you lose your mechanic of punishing expansion of big empires.

    This is my only issue with this mod. Everything else is great and i would say even better than Titanium. However titanium is a bit too arcadey, but at least the reputation is not broken, and the diplomacy actually works.

    Good luck SSHIPers, i will try this mod again in a few years.
    Interesting opinion and do share the some opinions (I've complained about it in the past).

    However, I had a different experience with it. Have a look at a longer report here. I've played as Poland and managed the game very well despite the reputation problems. Hungary started a war with me instantly. I was careful enough not to attack them, let them come and attack me. I won and after while they accepted peace, with little money gift from my side. I've started the war with Lithuanian and it was easy to pick it out. Then I had a war with Novgorod. During this time my main worry was HRE - they're very eager to attack you, and they're big (until they're torn with a civil war or a conflict with the papacy, as I had seen in my game). So I kept on giving money to them, a 2-3 hundreds a turn. It worked - I was never attacked.

    So I don't agree with your final conclusion - despite flaws in reputation mechanics, this is a very good mod from the gameplay perspective. And in comparison to the other mods - the best imho.

  7. #4507

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    I was thinking how Greece is really underdeveloped, there is no Athens, no Rhodes, only Smyrna on the Asia Minor coast. Its really dull if you play as a faction there.

  8. #4508

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by The Despondent Mind View Post
    I was thinking how Greece is really underdeveloped, there is no Athens, no Rhodes, only Smyrna on the Asia Minor coast. Its really dull if you play as a faction there.
    The problem is that the settlement limit has been reached. Sadly.

  9. #4509

    Default Re: I quit this mod. Reputation mechanic doesnt work for a proper gameplay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jurand of Cracow View Post
    Interesting opinion and do share the some opinions (I've complained about it in the past).

    However, I had a different experience with it. Have a look at a longer report here. I've played as Poland and managed the game very well despite the reputation problems. Hungary started a war with me instantly. I was careful enough not to attack them, let them come and attack me. I won and after while they accepted peace, with little money gift from my side. I've started the war with Lithuanian and it was easy to pick it out. Then I had a war with Novgorod. During this time my main worry was HRE - they're very eager to attack you, and they're big (until they're torn with a civil war or a conflict with the papacy, as I had seen in my game). So I kept on giving money to them, a 2-3 hundreds a turn. It worked - I was never attacked.

    So I don't agree with your final conclusion - despite flaws in reputation mechanics, this is a very good mod from the gameplay perspective. And in comparison to the other mods - the best imho.
    You still ended the conflict with you paying for it. I played as portugal. Had war with both the moors and the spanish. The moors accepted a white peace after i conquered 3 of their cities. Then Spain accepted a cease fire only after i conquered two of their cities, with inevitable loss of reputation from my side. Then the moors declared war again. And i beat them over and over again, without conquering their settlements. But still they would not accept a cease fire. So there is no way to win a conflict without entering their settlements, and if you are going to do it you might as well just expand.

    So if this mod intends to discourage expansion, it is actually encouraging expansion by not giving you a chance of not expanding. In titanium, you can and benefit from not expanding. You can defeat armies and sign a cease fire, or you can just occupy enemy settlements and abandon them later, then sign cease fire. In this mod if you want to win a war you need to conquer enemy settlements.

    Its a shame because i loved the mod, and would say if it was not for that then its the best M2TW mod, regarding everything else.

    Fix this and its the best mod.

  10. #4510
    Jurand of Cracow's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: I quit this mod. Reputation mechanic doesnt work for a proper gameplay.

    Quote Originally Posted by kingofportugal View Post
    Fix this and its the best mod.
    You may try minimod "Quiter AI" - I've just checked and it's still available on-line.

    The problem with fixing the very SSHIP is three-fold:
    1. people have different preferences - what you prefer could be against tastes of somebody else;
    2. there're unforeseen consequences of the changing one or few parameter for the AI - it may work for a better experience for Portugal, but it many be detrimental for the experience for Denmark or Kiev or Rum, who knows?
    3. there's no experienced AI moder around. z3n of the EBII announced once that he would do an alternative AI but it has not realised. And, frankly speaking, having experienced very friendly, peaceful and passive AI in the EBII I wouldn't chose that one (but maybe for Portugal it would be alright). But I admit it would be great if the AI would accept peace after a decisive battle while he is militarily weak and in some other situations - but I don't know if it can be done properly.

  11. #4511

    Default Re: I quit this mod. Reputation mechanic doesnt work for a proper gameplay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jurand of Cracow View Post
    it would be great if the AI would accept peace after a decisive battle while he is militarily weak and in some other situations - but I don't know if it can be done properly.
    doesnt SavageAI already do that ? i remember an SS6.4 campaign where i took only 1 settlement from AI but destroyed most of his military, i kept starting war then ask for peace for money every turn and he kept paying all the time cause he had little military left, though not 100% that was the reason
    You know you've played too much Stainless Steel when in every other mod you play you think cavalry is too weak.

  12. #4512
    Jurand of Cracow's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: I quit this mod. Reputation mechanic doesnt work for a proper gameplay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dekhatres View Post
    doesnt SavageAI already do that ? i remember an SS6.4 campaign where i took only 1 settlement from AI but destroyed most of his military, i kept starting war then ask for peace for money every turn and he kept paying all the time cause he had little military left, though not 100% that was the reason
    I've got no idea. That's indeed very interesting. Maybe somebody else has also observed this?

  13. #4513

    Default Re: I quit this mod. Reputation mechanic doesnt work for a proper gameplay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jurand of Cracow View Post
    I've got no idea. That's indeed very interesting. Maybe somebody else has also observed this?
    tricky thing i noticed, after inflicting a major military defeat on the AI then asking for money in exchange for peace the AI says it's too damanding, then i make a gift of 100-200 florins, he accepts, i propose casefire for money again and it's Very Generous now, doesnt always work, propose/demand map information works too, basically you need to get a deal of any kind, it's as if the AI updates when you succesfully conclude one

    that said i think the majority of the time it works without having to do this, same with the vassal thing, AI is left with 1 settlement and almost no army and he keeps refusing to become a vassal, i make a deal that he accepts then when i propose again to become a vassal he finds the offer balanced and usually accepts, i always add a thousand florins just to be sure
    You know you've played too much Stainless Steel when in every other mod you play you think cavalry is too weak.

  14. #4514
    Jurand of Cracow's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: I quit this mod. Reputation mechanic doesnt work for a proper gameplay.

    Yep, an initial gift may switch the attitude into Pleased and this help, true.
    Sometimes something prevents the AI from accepting the Generous offers too. You may greatly improve your relations by keeping on proposing such an offer. I even have a home-rule (no. 10) to prevent you from abusing this mechanism.

  15. #4515

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Can we expect RC2.0 integration into this mod ? ?

    Its very annoying to switch between mods just to play campaigs because different mod has strenghts

  16. #4516
    Lifthrasir's Avatar A Clockwork Orange
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    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Already asked 2 weeks ago. Check here.
    Under the patronage of Flinn, proud patron of Jadli, of the Imperial House of Hader



  17. #4517

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    I honestly dont know why Total War doesnt implement something as simple as Kingdom Power from Knights of Honor. That basically would make the game 10x better. Its like reputation but it actually affects the economy of the faction and public order.

    Knights of Honor still the only game that can compete with Total War... What a shame nothing else was done...

  18. #4518

    Default Re: I quit this mod. Reputation mechanic doesnt work for a proper gameplay.

    Quote Originally Posted by kingofportugal View Post
    You still ended the conflict with you paying for it. I played as portugal. Had war with both the moors and the spanish. The moors accepted a white peace after i conquered 3 of their cities. Then Spain accepted a cease fire only after i conquered two of their cities, with inevitable loss of reputation from my side. Then the moors declared war again. And i beat them over and over again, without conquering their settlements. But still they would not accept a cease fire. So there is no way to win a conflict without entering their settlements, and if you are going to do it you might as well just expand.

    So if this mod intends to discourage expansion, it is actually encouraging expansion by not giving you a chance of not expanding. In titanium, you can and benefit from not expanding. You can defeat armies and sign a cease fire, or you can just occupy enemy settlements and abandon them later, then sign cease fire. In this mod if you want to win a war you need to conquer enemy settlements.

    Its a shame because i loved the mod, and would say if it was not for that then its the best M2TW mod, regarding everything else.

    Fix this and its the best mod.
    I have to agree on this, if this is 'corrected' it can be easly best mod, with couple else things implemented. Im aware of history stuff, but its game. There need to be balance between gameplay and history, not just history. And when i say gameplay, not just for player, but also AI.

  19. #4519
    kostic's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    I agree

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