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Thread: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

  1. #101
    chesser2538's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    i plan on playing into the democratic parties desires and wants in such a way that i get things done, but not be an extremist like Lamar, probably more moderate with democratic tendencies. At this time in Texas history their were a lot of politicians who were fence sitters. I plan to draw them in by appearing sympathetic to their cause while still supporting my democratic principles. I don't intend on making this easy on you. Aggy just wondering, what college are you at?

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  2. #102
    Pericles of Athens's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Wallace of Georgia


    "Honor, Loyalty, Love."

    The Wallace Family in America

    Name: Fredrick H. Wallace
    Date of Birth: June 11th 1710
    Date of Death: March 8th 1766
    Spouse: Melisa Wallace

    Name: Melisa Wallace (Freemen)
    Date of Birth: July 18th 1719
    Date of Death: July 17th 1781
    Spouse: Fredrick Wallace


    Children

    Name: William F. Wallace Sr.
    Date of Birth: May 6th 1741
    Date of Death: Late 1777
    Spouse: Rosaline Wallace

    Name: Rosaline Wallace (Jefferson)
    Date of Birth: January 12th 1754
    Date of Death: March 17th 1821
    Spouse: William F. Wallace Sr.

    Children

    Name: William F. Wallace Jr.
    Date of Birth: December 21st 1771
    Date of Death: October 13th 1812
    Spouse: Samantha Wallace (Johnson)

    Name: Samantha Wallace (Johnson)
    Date of Birth: February 27th 1780
    Date of Death: February 3rd 1813
    Spouse: William F. Wallace Jr.

    Children

    Name: William F. Wallace III
    Date of Birth: April 4th 1798
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Magdalene Wallace (Bannerman)

    Name: Magdalene Wallace (Bannerman)
    Date of Birth: January 12th 1809
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: William F. Wallace III

    Children

    Name: Edward Wallace
    Date of Birth: November 17th 1829
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None

    Name: William F. Wallace IV
    Date of Birth: June 6th 1835
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None



    Name: Nadia Cory (Wallace)
    Date of Birth: January 1st 1800
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Lucas Cory

    Name: Lucas Cory
    Date of Birth: June 1st 1797
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Nadia Cory (Wallace)

    Children

    Non-Wallaces


    Name: Abaddon Wallace
    Date of Birth: January 1st 1800
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None


    Name: Richard Wallace
    Date of Birth: June 8th 1802
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse:
    Augusta Wallace (Thomas)

    Name: Augusta Wallace (Thomas)
    Date of Birth: August 25th 1809
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Richard Wallace

    Children
    fill in with kids


    Name: Thomas Wallace
    Date of Birth: December 3rd 1805
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse:
    Emilia Wallace (Cruz)

    Name: Emilia Wallace (Cruz)
    Date of Birth: January 1st 1819
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Thomas Wallace

    Children
    fill in with the kiddos


    Name: Alexander Wallace
    Date of Birth: July 19th 1806
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse:Jane Wallace (Jackson)

    Name: Jane Wallace (Jackson)
    Date of Birth: June 15th 1817

    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse:
    Alexander Wallace
    Children
    fill in with children


    Name: Andrew Wallace
    Date of Birth: August 10th 1807
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Olivia Wallace (Curtis)


    Name: Olivia Wallace (Curtis)
    Date of Birth: August 20th 1816
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Andrew Wallace

    Children

    Name: Adam Wallace
    Date of Birth: September 12th 1831
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None

    Name: Diana Wallace
    Date of Birth: June 6th 1835
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None

    Name: Daniel Wallace
    Date of Birth: December 11th 1838
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None




    Name: Lorisa Robertson (Wallace)
    Date of Birth: October 31st 1774
    Date of Death: December 19th 1844
    Spouse: Robert Robertson

    Name: Robert Robertson
    Date of Birth: March 15th 1767
    Date of Death: July 3rd 1840
    Spouse: Lorisa Robertson

    Children

    Non-Wallaces


    Name: John Wallace
    Date of Birth: October 31st 1774
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Alexa Wallace (Brown)

    Name: Alexa Wallace (Brown)
    Date of Birth: July 8th 1795
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: John Wallace

    Children

    Name: Aaron Wallace
    Date of Birth: November 21st 1813
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Hailey Wallace (Dalton)

    Name: Hailey Wallace (Dalton)
    Date of Birth: July 7th 1820
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Aaron Wallace

    Children

    Name: Adolf Wallace
    Date of Birth: September 1st 1834
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None

    Name: Madison Wallace
    Date of Birth: October 10th 1837
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None



    Name: Ramsey Wallace
    Date of Birth: September 1st 1817
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Eudoxia Wallace (Ambrosia)


    Name: Eudoxia Wallace (Ambrosia)
    Date of Birth: March 6th 1820
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: Ramsey Wallace

    Children

    Name: Gabriel Wallace
    Date of Birth: September 1st 1834
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None

    Name: Thomas Wallace
    Date of Birth: August 10th 1839
    Date of Death: N/A
    Spouse: None




    Name: Henry F. Wallace
    Date of Birth: March 9th 1743
    Date of Death: May 6th 1815
    Spouse: N/A

    Name: Robert Wallace
    Date of Birth: October 3rd 1745
    Date of Death: July 3rd 1759
    Spouse: N/A

    Name: Richard Wallace
    Date of Birth: October 3rd 1749
    Date of Death: February 5th 1755
    Spouse: N/A

    Name: Roberta Hidalgo (Wallace)
    Date of Birth: July 12th 1742
    Date of Death: May 27th 1820
    Spouse: Francisco Hidalgo

    Name: Francisco Hidalgo
    Date of Birth: November 1st 18740
    Date of Death: May 31st 1820
    Spouse: Roberta Hidalgo (Wallace)

    Children

    Non-Wallaces

    Name: Abigail Wallace
    Date of Birth: Jun 3rd 1750
    Date of Death: April 9th 1830
    Spouse: N/A




    John Wallace



    Name: John Wallace
    Date of Birth: October 31st 1774
    Ethnicity: Tuckahoe
    Religion: Anglican
    Occupation: Gentlemen
    Position: Georgian Senator
    Home State: Georgia
    Allegiance: Dixie (USA too)
    Faction: Democrat Party

    Personality: Boisterous, prideful, and stubborn to no end John is a frank man who makes no attempts to hide his personal beliefs or tastes. Hotheaded and contemptuous of his political enemies in Concordia, John has earned himself the long time nickname "The Cast-Iron Man" for his inability and unwillingness to adapt. He has gone to great lengths to portray himself as the quintessential Southern Gentleman his father was outside the political arena, an endless fount of courteously to his fellow planters and their bells (even to the wealthy Yankees he shares Concordia with) and a caring friend to the poverty stricken Cohee across the South; a certain amount of kindness is even extended to the Negros. He is an unshakable and uncompromising supporter of slavery, vehement in his defense of the Peculiar Institution as a positive good, and a true believer in his own rhetoric that slaves need the master to guide and teach them. Though he doesn't support its inclusion of any whites or other non-Negros, as when given the chance he can make fast friends with the hard working Cohee and can even come to respect Yankees, Immigrants, and even Papists to a lesser extent. If John is anything he's sincere and as such he sticks to his beliefs, expressing no sexual interest in his slaves, unlike many of his more dubious counterparts.

    Issues:

    Central Government: Weak Federal Government Except to Defend/Expand slavery
    Religious Relations: Establishment of an Episcopalian National Church (Protection for Catholics and other non-Mormon Protestant sects)
    Tariffs: No Tariffs
    Slavery: Expansion of Slavery into the Frontier
    Immigration: Heavily Restricted Immigration
    Military: Mix of Federal, Volunteer, and State Forces
    National Bank: The Bank Must Die
    Foreign Relations: Expansion for Slave States


    Andrew Wallace


    Name: Andrew Wallace
    Date of Birth: August 10th 1806
    Ethnicity: Tuckahoe
    Religion: Anglican
    Occupation: Lawyer
    Position: President
    Home State: Georgia
    Allegiance: USA
    Faction: Democrat Party

    Personality: In his youth Andrew was a charming and seductive young lad, his fellows envied him and the dames loved him, and even as he enters his later years he can still play the part of the dashing Southern Cavalier when he wishes to. Light hearted and spirited, Andrew sees himself as a gentleman, minus some of the more monotonous formalities that go along with that title. His marriage was one of necessity, not love, and Andrew makes no secret of his distaste for the arrangement. Rumors abound that he rarely passes up on the opportunity to break his marital vows, be they married or unmarried, rich or poor, even engaging in relations with Papists. Like his uncle Andrew fancies himself a populist and despite his high birth and current wealth his down to earth manner and lack of formality has endeared him to many of the more common folk around the country, particularly the rural poor of the South and Mid-West. Unlike many in his family before him he generally tries to find middle ground in most political issue. But when it comes to getting his way when he truly believes in something, like slavery or expansion, he has a tendency to unilaterally disregard the political opposition if at all possible.

    Issues:

    Central Government: Sweeping Federal Powers, Commitment to Defend and Expand Slavery
    Religious Relations: Strict Neutrality
    Tariffs: Low Tariffs
    Slavery: Expansion of Slavery to the Territories
    Immigration: Heavily Restricted Immigration
    Military: Mix of Federal, Volunteer, and State Forces
    National Bank: The Bank Must Die
    Foreign Relations: Expansion for Manifest Destiny's Sake


    Other Member's of the Wallace Family

    Andrew's Family:
    • Olivia Wallace (Curtis), b. August 20th 1816 wip
    • Adam Wallace, b. September 12th 1831 wip
    • Diana Wallace, b. June 5th 1835 wip
    • Daniel Wallace, b. December 11th 1838 wip


    John's Family:

    • Alexa Wallace (Brown), b. July 8th 1795 wip
    • Aaron Wallace, b. November 21st 1813 First born son and heir-apparent to John Wallace, the unspoken patriarch of the Wallace family. A tall lean man with handsome brown hair and cool green eyes. An avid world traveler Aaron has seen over three dozen nations across the Americas, Europe, Africa, and even Asia. When he isn't over seas this member of the Wallace family can often be found with his family. He like many Wallaces lives by a strict code of honor, making a point to treat everyone he meets politely, even the poor, the powerless, and the genetically undesirable.
    • Hailey Wallace (Dalton), b. July 7th 1820 wip
    • Adolfo Wallace, b. September 1st 1834 wip
    • Madison Wallace, b. October 10th 1837 wip
    • Ramsey Wallace, b. September 1st 1817 An uninteresting young man of average height with a plain beardless face, and eerie pale gray eyes distinctly Un-Wallace in nature. His voice is soft as a spider and his skin a sickly pasty white. The man is simply put a genius, graduating top of his class with a PhD in chemistry. Seemingly a cold and aloof man Ramsey is in truth a bonafide psychopath, not only unwilling but unable to feel pain, love, or emotion of any kind for others.
    • Eudoxia Wallace (Ambrosia), b. March 6th 1820 wip
    • Gabriel Wallace, b. September 1st 1834 wip
    • Thomas Wallace, b. August 10th 1839 Too young to be notable in any regard


    William F. Wallace III: A hard military man with steely determination and a professional military man's pure grit, he isn't one who attends social events by personal choice but he is well versed in the finer points of polite society. A Legionville graduate he joined the military out of familial-commitment, after all every other William F. Wallace served, and died, in one of America's great wars and he cant very well be the first to disregard tradition. He's of a regal height with hard green eyes, a lean build, and a handsome well-kept handle-bar mustache goatee combo. Currently serving as a Colonel in the United States Army.
    • Magdalene Wallace (Bannermen), b. January 12th 1809 wip
    • Eddie Wallace, b. November 17th 1829 wip
    • William F. Wallace IV, b. June 6th 1835 wip


    Richard Wallace: A lean man with dark brown hair and bright green eyes that shift to a pale blue in the correct lighting. A William and Mary graduate and self-proclaimed political philosopher Richard is a firm believer in slavery, justifying the Peculiar Institution in his own self coined Richardian way. He casts aside his uncle's idea that slavery is a positive good instead embracing the idea that slavery is good for "all the wrong reasons", and further enforcing that idea with his own ramblings that should be grateful for slavery because its been their "people's" ticket out of the proverbial hell hole that is the Dark Continent. A gentlemen-elitist, not all too rare a sight in the Southern states these day, he enjoys hobnobbing with fellow elites at high profile social events and sipping sweet tea on warm Georgian summer evenings.
    • Augusta Wallace (Thomas), b. August 25th 1805 wip
    • Charles Wallace, b. November 1st 1825 Uncharacteristically stocky for a Wallace and barrel-chested Charles is equal parts fat and muscle, with short kept hair military hair and unimaginative green eyes. Mean as he is un-lean Charles overtly aggressive with friends and family alike, to a degree strange even for a young man his age. Sadly he isn't as caring as most of his family, but more unfortunately he's just as short tempered as them. A Legionville graduate like his uncle before him, currently serving as a Major in the US Cavalry.
    • Kevin Wallace, b. April 14th 1827 A much smaller boy than his older brother Charles, with perpetually messy dark hair and bright imaginative green eyes. Kevin is friendly but introverted and disorganized, at times he can even seem scatter brained. An intellectual by nature Kevin can spend days at a time simply reading books losing himself in the pages, particularly those on ancient and contemporary history. An Oxford graduate with a PhD in Cultural and Archaeological studies Kevin is fluent in over a dozen langues, never mind that nearly half of those are dead. Currently travelling to the far corner of the world, in order to study these distant and (he believes) misunderstood peoples, taking a bit of their history back in the form of texts or artifacts of any kind. Along his travels he has visited the original homeland of the Negros, and he claims that though primitive in their natural state they aren't as animistic and self destructive as the slavocrates would have their fellow southerners believe, these letters are of course quickly discarded and their words forgotten by his highly conservative and authoritarian father.


    Thomas Wallace: Lanky and wiry, with a scraggly beard, unkempt dark Wallace hair, and fiery green eyes. Being rather liberal, for a Wallace at least, Thomas believes in religious and ethnic, though certainly not racial, harmony across the nation. Though it isn't unheard of for Wallaces to engage in relations with Papists he is the first to ever go and marry himself to one, much to the chagrin of his family and their Southern allies. Other than his Papist fetish he seems a normal Southern, well a normal Tuchahoe anyhow, and takes some pains to show himself as such to minimize his scandalous existence. A graduate from the University of South Carolina Thomas is an accomplished musician and playwright having penned a number of musical hits famous across Dixie and a number of his plays have even made it up north and across the sea.
    • Emilia Wallace (Cruz), b. January 1st 1817 wip
    • Roberto Wallace, b. March 9th 1835 A young boy with his mother's jet hair and dark Spanish skin. Free wheeling and free spirited he enjoys adventure and the rudimentary dueling training he has experienced. His father is attempting to raise him up as the proper gentlemen any Wallace should be, with a proper education encompassing historical, literal, social, and practical knowledge, but he has done so to little avail.
    • ​Isabella Wallace, b. June 19th 1839 Too young to be notable in any regard


    Alexander Wallace: Barrel-chested and muscular with a regal stature, Alexander keeps his dark distinctly-Wallace hair perfectly coiffed and his face clean shaven, handsomely complimenting his fierce leaf-green eyes. He isn't much of a thinker, in fact he's mentally little more than a living wall, but he is one of the greatest duelists in the entire state of Georgia, and perhaps even the greater South as a whole. He's taken it upon himself to become a high profile enforcer of sorts, keeping the enemies of his family in line through intimidation and backing up his words by very literally beating his families foes back into line when they break ranks. He might be a slight too mentally thick and brutish for polite society but that doesn't mean he cant make friends for himself, in fact he makes friends quite well, particularly with those outside the aforementioned polite society.
    • Jane Wallace (Jackson), b. June 15th 1819 wip
    • Roberta Wallace, b. October 31st 1840 Too young to be notable in any regard
    • Kenneth Wallace, b. September 13th 1842 Too young to be notable in any regard
    • Julia Wallace, b. November 17th 1845 Too young to be notable in any regard


    Abaddon Wallace: A tall slender women with porcelain skin and huge almond shaped green eyes, she might look the perfect southern Belle but in truth she's really a wily temptress. To date she's had three husbands all of which have died within two years of marrying her. Outside of her short term and unhappy marriages she's a free spirited and free loving women, despised by Southern Clergy and quietly questioned by the Planter elites across the South, always out of Wallace earshot of course.

    Nadia Cory (Wallace): wip



    Bohannon of Kentucky

    Brandon Bohannon



    Name: Brandon Bohannon

    Date of Birth: September 1st 1809
    Ethnicity: Cohee
    Religion: Southern Baptist
    Occupation: Soldier
    Position: Brigadier General
    Home State: Kentucky
    Allegiance: USA
    Faction: (Nominally) Democrat Party

    Personality: Spiteful, loud, ill-mannered, ornery, and vehemently racist Brandon is a Bohannon's Bohannon, even known to carry two revolvers on his person at all times, and the definition of a stereotypical "Red-Neck" Cohee. Born the second son of the 1812 War Hero/Villain Willy Bohannon, himself the second son of the Revolutionary War Hero/Villain Shawn "the Butcher" Bohannon, Brandon inherited his father's collection of rifles, revolvers, and simple explosives (as his elder brother inherited his father's land) and was forced to enter the military, like his father and his father before him, in order to make ends meet. He don't like Jews much or native folk, Catholics, Muslims, Homosexuals, Yankees, Foreigners, and Immigrants neither, but above all the rest he cant stand the . He also doesn't like reading, writing, mathematics, science, acting, bathing, or other eggheaded activities better suited to the effeminate upper ups and their ilk. Despite this unhealthy amount of hate he holds for most everyone and everything he does love his family and his kin, going to great lengths to empower and protect those people he deems "like him". He's an avid drinker, storyteller, strategist, banjo player, brawler, marksmen, and hunter. Brandon is a tall lean man, weathered and rough around the edges with a thick mop of dark hair atop his head and a matching beard to compliment it.

    Issues:

    Central Government: Weak Federal Government
    Religious Relations: Active Discrimination Against non-Protestants
    Tariffs: No Tariffs
    Slavery: No Abolition
    Immigration: No Immigration
    Military: Reliance on State Militias and Volunteers
    National Bank: The Bank Must Die
    Foreign Relations: Expansion for Manifest Destiny's Sake


    Others Bohannons

    Brandon's Family

    • Kaylee (Cohee), b. June 9th 1811 Kaylee is a tall, full-lipped and shapely woman in her early thirties, with thick auburn hair and big dark eyes. A tomboy by nature years of hard Kentucky living have turned her into the women she is today. She is never afraid to speak what's on her mind, much to the chagrin of the polite society of the Tide Water Planters and Yankee Tycoons alike. Even after all these years Brandon is still deeply in love with his darling girl, having killed a number of men in duels over her honor.
    • Shawn(y) Bohannon, b. September 19th 1826 The eldest of the Bohannon boys is a brawny barrel chested man with his mother's thick auburn hair and a matching unruly beard. He has enlisted in the US armed forces like his father before him, and his father before him, and his before him, currently serving as a Sergeant. Crude in mannerisms and speech Shawn is, for all intensive purposes, illiterate in fact he is barely able to sign his own name. A scrapper by nature when he was younger he fought his brothers and the neighboring children regularly, as a young adult Shawn is always spoiling for a fight.
    • Cullen Bohannon, b. June 17th 1827 Cullen is taller and leaner than his older brother, with his father's dark hair and thick five-o-clock shadow in place of the traditional Bohannon beard. Cullen is a military man just like his older brother and father, serving as a Private. He is a boisterous "Red Neck" who takes great pride in his Cohee blood and social status, always willing and able to fight, drink, hunt, or dance an entire evening away.
    • Diana Bohannon, b. December 21st 1829 A shapely girl with fiery red hair, she is the spiting image of her mother at her age. Unlike the rest of her siblings Diana is intellectually inclined, an introverted person and an unproductive worker with "her nose in them damn books" as her father often says.
    • Tillie Bohannon, b. January 3rd 1832 Inheriting her mother's facial structure but her father's lean frame and hair, Tillie is an unusually happy girl. A tomboy by nature she equally enjoys working the fields and wrestling with her younger brothers.
    • Dicky Bohannon, b. August 8th 1833 Unusually tall for his age, scrawny with a wiry strength to him, and seemingly too young to exhibit the trademark Bohannon beard. The elder of the Bohannon twins is infinitely more laid back than his younger half, though he is often dragged along for the ride despite his numerous protests. He is a skilled musician, particularly adapt at signing.
    • Dixon Bohannon, b. August 8th 1833 Like his older twin Dixon is unusually tall for his age, scrawny with a wiry strength to him, and seemingly too young to exhibit the trademark Bohannon beard. The younger of the Bohannon twins is a hyperactive and, some say, overly aggressive prankster-scrapper-adventurer, with a passion for all things chaotic. Fun loving and spirited his jokes have a mean streak to them but he isn't one to hold grudges without cause and he usually doesn't mean anything by it. He shares his brother's musical talents, being a particularly adapt banjo player.
    • Mary Bohannon, b. May 17th 1836 The youngest of the Bohannon siblings, in a nut shell Mary is a younger and far more content version of her older sister Diana. Though a big mouthed girl who enjoys to hear herself speak above all else, Mary is actually quite sweet and lovable at times, but she can really get on her siblings nerves after an hour of nonstop chit chat about everything from the weather to the latest gossip.


    Last edited by Pericles of Athens; May 14, 2014 at 12:24 AM.


  3. #103
    Watercress's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Hey chaps, sorry for my inactivity recently. Will probably not be able to frequent these fourms much until the end of June, due to exams. Nonetheless, I would be eager to stake a claim for the Lamberths as one of these major political families. I would imagine them as a bastion of Southern Federalism, increasingly conservative in their social and racial policy but still advocates of strong government, most remaining in Virginia, and a few vagabonds of the family possibly moving further West. As for Vice-President Edward, I think we would be an excellent fit for the second POTUS, once Poole's two terms are concluded.
    Last edited by Watercress; April 19, 2014 at 11:07 AM.

    "Only Connect!...Only connect the prose and the passion, and both will be exalted, and human love will be seen at its height. Live in fragments no longer."

  4. #104
    Agamemnon's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by chesser2538 View Post
    i plan on playing into the democratic parties desires and wants in such a way that i get things done, but not be an extremist like Lamar, probably more moderate with democratic tendencies. At this time in Texas history their were a lot of politicians who were fence sitters. I plan to draw them in by appearing sympathetic to their cause while still supporting my democratic principles. I don't intend on making this easy on you. Aggy just wondering, what college are you at?
    Well considering that you're fighting the hero of the revolution who is descended from another hero of the revolution and a hero of an even greater revolution, don't expect a cakewalk either. As to college, I'm a high school junior in Southeastern Michigan.

  5. #105
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    @Chesser Since the driving wedge that is the Union/Independence issue has been split up pretty nicely, I'd imagine the issues Texan neutrals would be concerned over are slavery, the economy and directions of expansion. They can fall either way on slavery (hardcore abolitionists will go Federalist and hardcore slavers will go Democrat), might be pro-Bank but anti-tariff or vice versa and generally don't like extensive government intervention in the economy (building a few national roads & canals is fine, shelling out tons of dough to railroad moguls is not) and support expanding out West (generally the Federalists will support peaceful or no expansion + staying on good terms with the Indians, the Democrats will support expanding as far south as possible - maybe all the way to Panama - for moar slave states + kicking Indians off their lands or outright killing them all). These neutrals will also be pro-expansion into Indian territories, but can be talked out of it more easily than Democrats by either you or Aggy, especially if you can offer them a release valve of sorts in those claimed lands currently held by Mexico.

    @MMM No prob, the game isn't set to go up until late May/early June anyway. I've also added Lamberth's name to the poll for the seat of Federalist #1, 1797-1805.

    @Everyone who's put up a family summary so far I'm liking what I'm seeing, keep it up. I'll get a list of ethnicities, religions etc. up for y'all later today after I finish writing up the timeline 1841-45.

  6. #106
    Agamemnon's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    What are we considering the Texan border? The Rio Grande or Nueces? Also, are the Texan parties going to be Unionist and Nationalist or Democrat and Whig? Because the Eggers family have always been Democrats (though as slavery has gotten bigger they've become more moderate), but Chesser's char would definitely be considered the democrat here. Basically we have a moderate dem vs a slightly less moderate dem, and by the way Chesser is setting up his char it seems the only dividing factor is unionization. I honestly would propose that Chesser be my VP instead of Lamar, as we aren't very far apart.

  7. #107
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Your claims are historical, so I suppose the Rio Grande would be the border most Texans would insist on. Anyway, the Texan parties at the start of the game will be the Nationalists and Unionists, though you can call them whatever; Liberal/Conservative, Populist (People's Party) or American, etc. He can't be your VP yet, since 1) Nationalism/Unionism is THE big driving wedge here, it's only one issue but for 1845 Texas it's almost their equivalent of slavery in 1860 and 2) otherwise we have no players to represent the Nationalist viewpoint Though I suppose you two could work together after (if) Texas joins the Union.

  8. #108
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    And here it is, the last leg of the timeline, 1841-5:

    TL
    1841: The case of the Amistad, a Spanish slave ship bound for Cuba whose human cargo had taken over in a revolt and gotten the ship steered to New York by accident (they were hoping to return home but were tricked by the surviving crew) two years prior, is finally settled when the US Supreme Court ruled that since the slaves were taken illegally (as Spain had outlawed slavery in 1811, but allowed the keeping of slaves who were born slaves before 1820) they were all free. With the help of American abolitionists and missionaries, the Africans were returned home by 1844.

    The Creole case breaks out as illegally-bought slaves aboard the Creole, bound for Charleston, revolt against the crew much as the Amistad did and steered the ship to British Nassau, where they were immediately considered free and the surviving crewmen, despite being American citizens, were condemned as pirates operating in violation of both British and American law (for both had long banned the slave trade). Southerners were outraged at this loss of property, while abolitionists from the North and West pressured the Federalist administration of X9 to let the case go.

    The liberal, urban-based and heavily Protestant Radical Party takes a majority of seats in the Swiss Confederation's Tagsatzung (confederal council) and immediately tried to enact their agenda of centralizing power. They are opposed by the rural cantons, but most fiercely the Catholic and aristocratically-run cantons of Uri/Schwyz/Nidwalden/Obwalden/Lucerne/Zug/Fribourg/Valais, which joined forces to proclaim the Sonderbund ('separate alliance') to defend their interests. The Liberals obviously did not approve of this new coalition, and the country fell into civil war. Louis XVII, seeing a chance to restore some of his prestige after being forced out of Argentina by Britain, immediately declared support for the Sonderbund, moved troops to the Swiss border and warned the Liberals to back down. They were joined in this by Austria, whose Prime Minister & de-facto ruler Prince Metternich (due to Emperor Ferdinand being a mentally unstable wreck) was an arch-conservative statesman sympathetic to the aims of the Sonderbund. Britain warned Louis and Austria that they would intervene to support the Liberals if either power backed the Sonderbund, but while Metternich immediately developed second thoughts, the Winter King remained unmoved; as far as he was concerned, Argentina was a world away across oceans that Britain was rightly master of, but Switzerland was right in his backyard and the British had no right meddling there. He brokered an alliance with Prussia's Frederick William IV, yet another hard-nosed continental conservative; in exchange for his military intervention, France would recognize him as the rightful Prince of Neuchatel, where his monarchical position was threatened by the possibility of Switzerland becoming a federal state. When Louis called Britain's bluff and sent 50,000 Frenchmen to cross the border in support of the 40,000 Prussians who had freshly arrived at Neuchatel to bail out the crumbling Sonderbund, the Liberals - who had been winning up to that point - ended up decisively crushed beneath the Allied army at Murten and were forced to stand down. In a peace mediated jointly by Metternich and Britain's Foreign Secretary Lord Palmerston (as a minor face-saving concession Louis had allowed to the British) the Sonderbund was dissolved, but in the name of 'preventing further anarchy' no further amendments to the Swiss constitution were permitted, making the the 1815 Federal Treaty into Switzerland's permanent constitution in all but name.

    Map of the Sonderbund War

    On the other side of the planet, Rosas' army breaks the Unitarian siege of Cordoba in a surprise attack on the besiegers' camp, killing some 2,000 Unitarians on the field of battle and capturing 2,000 others (who were all immediately hanged, and left to rot from trees between Cordoba and Buenos Aires in true Rosista fashion); critical to the Rosista victory was the 'Regimiento de Halcones' (Regiment of Hawks), an elite 1500-man infantry unit personally drilled and commanded by the rapidly-promoted totally-not-a-French-officer Thierry Watteau 'Johnny Lamarck' & equipped with the contents of the last French shipment to arrive before the British blockade came down. While the Unitarians fled back to the Sierras Grande in disarray, with Bonaparte's cavalry acting as their rearguard, Rosas neglected to seriously pursue them - because now he was busy massing his forces for an invasion of Uruguay in support of the Blanco faction, which came to be in July. Quick-marching overland with 15,000 Rosista soldiers (including the Hawks) and 70 cannons, 'Lamarck' joined forces with Manuel Oribe to mount a head-on assault on Montevideo, which had withstood Blanco forces for three years by this point with the help of British supplies transported by sea. This time, not even their provably skilled and valiant defenders could withstand Rosas' attack, and the city fell in a three-day battle that left most of it a smoking ruin. President Rivera himself was killed in the fighting, but his right-hand man Joaquin Suarez managed to escape with the Royal Navy, the entirety of Uruguay's own fleet and about a thousand loyal Colorados. Manuel Oribe was now President of a heap of ashes, a wrecked country and a traumatized people; but like Rosas, instead of rebuilding the country he instead pledged himself a friend to France, and for his part the Winter King sent a convoy loaded with both relief goods and military supplies to Montevideo (much of which will find their way into Rosas' hands later) before ordering his ships to pass provocatively close to the British blockade of Buenos Aires on their return voyage.

    The Sonderbund War and now the ascendancy of the pro-French bloc of Rosas & Oribe in Latin America greatly worried the British, whose resources were increasingly being strained by their commitments to Ottoman Empire, pro-British Latin American states like Peru-Bolivia and the ongoing Afghan & Opium Wars. Their ability to control the restive population of the Canadas was now becoming extremely limited - thereby presenting just the opportunity President X9 had been hoping for. Moving troops over to the northern border to create some pressure, he secretly contacted Westminster to request they sell Canada to him, pointing out that since the Rebellions of 1837 were suppressed far too harshly and responsible government denied to the locals they had lost popular support among both French and Anglo-Canadians - and that it would be awfully expensive to contain not just fast-mounting Canadian dissent but also American forces with so many other commitments around the world to attend to and their position as the planet's top dog in peril. Britain conceded the point after Louis XVII's latest provocations, but warned that it would only let its last major colony on the North American continent go if the people of both Canadas truly rejected Westminster's rule in favor of Concordia's, and a referendum was organized with the Americans' agreement. The results came in Christmas Week that year, showing that 53% of Upper Canadians favored joining the United States and 65% of Lower Canadians as well as 55% of Maritime Canadians did as well - with the caveat that not only would the Canadian provinces be integrated speedily as states and that their cultural and (barring the monarchy for obvious reasons) political traditions, from the French-Canadians' Catholicism to their seigneurial system and the Church lands in Upper Canada, be respected. Thus on New Year's Eve, President X9 had the extreme pleasure of announcing that the Federalists had accomplished with the stroke of a pen (and some 15 million dollars, plus five million extra for Prince Rupert's Land) what their ancient Democratic-Republican rivals utterly failed to do with military force in the Rogers-Ashburton Treaty of 1841 - get Canada to join the United States. Celebrations broke out all over the country as even Southerners showed their joy at finally controlling 2/3rds of the North American continent, from the freezing Arctic to the hot Gulf down south, and in their joy few noticed the Federalist administration quietly dropping the Creole case as another part of its deal with Britain.

    1842: As per their agreements with the Canadians, the former Canadian provinces are placed on the fast track to statehood by X9's administration. Upper and Lower Canada are first to join the Union as the free states of Canada (yes, just Canada) and Quebec, respectively. The realization that all of the former Canadian provinces would join as free states immediately puts a damper on the Southerners' celebrations of this latest great acquisition, and they began lobbying for an invasion and conquest of all of Mexico & in some cases, even the rest of Central America to balance out the slave state-free state ratio. As far as the South was concerned, Canada becoming a bunch of free states was an unfortunate development, but would easily be balanced out by the inclusion of the much more populous Mexican and Central American provinces as slave states (what with being south of the Missouri Compromise line and all).

    Commonwealth v. Hunt results in unions and strikes being found as legitimate organizations and tactics.

    General Jesus Huerta raids Texas with 1,000 cavalrymen on orders from Emperor Agustin, who believed that the Texans were supporting republican insurgents in the Rio Grande area (some private citizens were indeed crossing the border to volunteer their services to the Republican cause, although the Texan government itself may or may not have actually backed them), and ends up burning down San Antonio before going home. Texas reacted by X. Although the Southern lobby called for a US annexation of Texas and invasion of Mexico in the aftermath of this raid, X9 remained unmoved, leading Southern leaders to accuse the Federalists of only being interested in expanding when they could get free states out of the deal.

    The near-total annihilation of a British Army column of 16,000 in Afghanistan, save for exactly one survivor, is not at all welcome news in a Britain that had just lost Canada plus massive amounts of prestige in Switzerland and Argentina. To reassert their primacy, the British not only launched an 'Army of Retribution' to lay waste to Afghanistan, raze Kabul to the ground and kill thousands of Afghans in retaliation before immediately vacating the devastated country, but also began to tighten their grasp in Argentina. The squadrons blockading Buenos Aires bombarded the city's port facilities and sank the entire Argentinian navy in port without warning in May, killing some 800 Rosistas and civilians, days before before the Foreign Office told Rosas that they had done what they did as payback for his surprise invasion of Uruguay...a year late. Finally, British Major John Darling came with a batch of supplies shuttled through Peru-Bolivia to join Lavalle's Unitarians as a military advisor in Salta; by the end of the year, 60 more British officers would follow (with Lieutenant-Colonel James Gordon assuming formal command of the mission) to help train the Unitarian army along European lines, advise their commanders on how to fight the war, and paradoxically work together with the son of their nation's archnemesis earlier in the century to make sure the pro-Bourbon Rosas wouldn't survive the decade. Louis XVII protested this blatant British hypocrisy, considering that they had demanded he stop doing this exact thing a few years ago, but did nothing else as he still believed Argentina to not be worth a military confrontation.

    1843: The Indiana gubernatorial election features a rematch between Democratic incumbent Alexander Dunning and re-running Whig candidate Benjamin Pugh. Dunning, noting that Pugh had recreated the exact same coalition that nearly brought him to victory three years earlier, figured he should do one better than what he also did last time and have his goons burn down some Maroon communities to really hammer home the message of 'don't think you can vote, Negro scum'. But Pugh was ready for his dirty tricks this time, and so were the Maroons - in a portentous speech in late September, Maroon leader Scipio Halfhand (another descendant of the Hardtack Half-Hand, this time through his seventh son's second son) thundered to his fellow Maroons, "Why should we, whose ancestors won their and our freedom out of the barrel of a gun, run and hide like rats when Dunning's bastards come around again? Did our ancestors run from the British? Perhaps the first time, and the second, but eventually they stopped running - and so shall we. Now; now, we are done running."

    On the night of September 10th, some 400 'Coal Burners' (as Dunning's men started calling themselves, since their job was to burn 'black stuff') marched into Indianapolis's Maroontown, which they expected to only be the first stop on their campaign of terror - only to run into prepared barricades manned by armed Maroons, given weapons by Pugh's Whigs or New England companies, and trained by their fathers and grandfathers who had fought against the Northwest Indians and in the War of 1812 (and who, in some cases, stood with them). The Coal Burners were unable to break through, and ended up surrendering after they were attacked from behind and the flanks by three columns of 'Ragheads' (Pugh's own mob of armed white supporters, so nicknamed after their candidate's poor origins); 7 Coal Burners, 13 Maroons and 6 Ragheads died in the chaos, and up to 100 injuries total were reported. All over the state the same incident played out in other towns and cities as Coal Burners and Ragheads battled for access to the polls, and when the ballots were counted, Pugh had finally defeated Dunning with 54.8% of the vote; in the months to come, Dunning was arrested and found guilty of charges of embezzlement and murder, and his fate was sealed when his former hitmen came out to testify against him (totally without Pugh offering them generous amounts of his own money in secret, how could you think that). Though in the end this was only one gubernatorial election, and the Maroons (as all blacks) continued to face intensive discrimination across the other Midwestern states excepting Ohio (which permitted a limited black franchise, again restricted to descendants of Maroon soldiers in the Revolution) the 'Night of the Barricades' had sent a message from the Maroons to the rest of America - they were truly done 'running' into the West or New England just to escape racial violence, and they were indeed willing to fight for their freedoms and rights, to the last man if need be.

    Nova Scotia and New Brunswick gain statehood.

    Now backed by British supplies and advisors, and reinforced with freshly-trained volunteers and conscripts alike, the Argentine Unitarians sally forth again from the Sierras Grande. Cordoba is taken after a shorter, more successful siege personally directed by Lavalle and Gordon, while Bonaparte was able to defeat Rosista relief columns at Rio Ceballos and La Para. As the war had by now raged for 12 years, Lavalle challenged Rosas to fight a single decisive battle, with the loser surrendering all of his forces and leaving the country; Rosas, always one with a penchant for flamboyant stunts that could go down in history, agreed and concentrated his surviving field armies with a swarm of fresh conscripts called up in the last few months into an army of 21,000 men (many of whom were inexperienced conscripts given dated uniforms and substandard equipment, due to the economic damage caused by Britain's lengthy blockade) and 65 cannons, with which he meant to fight the smaller but much more experienced Unitarian army of 17,000 and 90 guns (most of them provided by Britain or Peru-Bolivia) at Miramar. The battle was a complete disaster for Rosas: the Rosista infantry attack was a disorganized mess that started to fall apart even before it got blown to pieces by the Unitarian artillery and sharpshooters, their cavalry was routed by Bonaparte's gauchos and especially his brand-new lancer corps, and the chief Rosista commander Lucio Mansilla (also Rosas' brother-in-law) was killed by his own routing conscripts while trying to exhort them to keep fighting. The only Rosista unit to fight reasonably well were the 'Regimiento de Halcones'; the 'Hawks' withstood two cavalry charges (one directed by Bonaparte himself) and a heavy artillery bombardment atop their hill before withdrawing in good order once 'Lamarck' saw that they were running low on ammunition and that the battle could not be won no matter how hard they fought now, but even they lost half of their members in the chaos. 5,000 Rosistas were killed and 10,000 were captured, including all of their artillery, while the Unitarian casualties amounted to 600 dead and 1,100 wounded. Despite his defeat however, Rosas refused to resign from his leadership of the Argentine Confederation in direct violation of his oath with Lavalle, outraging both the Unitarians and his own supporters.

    Sindh becomes a province of British India after a decisive British victory over the Talpur Emirs at Hyderabad.

    1844: Prince Edward Island and Newfoundland gain statehood, the last Canadian states to do so.

    The Canadian states as of 1844


    Red - Canada
    Blue - Quebec
    Light green - New Brunswick
    Dark green - PEI
    Cyan - Nova Scotia
    Salmon - Newfoundland
    Purple - Unorganized 'Northern Territories'

    Note: As a holdover from their British days, the Canadian states insist on being formally called 'Provinces' instead. That doesn't stop people from calling them states in informal conversation any more than Virginia's full name of 'Commonwealth of Virginia' does, of course.

    In this year's presidential election, Manifest Destiny allows the Democrats to rise to victory by accusing the Federalists of alternately being too slow in expanding the USA or only being interested in acquiring free states, and the Whigs of not being able to unite around a platform of expansion (which was true, as they too were badly divided over the issue). To the enormous relief of the South's leaders, not even the brand-new Canadian free states could swing the election in favor of the Federalists (who captured literally every single said state) - at least this time, when they were able to secure the support of many of the Midwestern states and even Vermont over in New England with their promises of expansion.

    A great flood hits the Upper Mississippi. The state of Missouri is especially hard hit.

    The followers of William Miller, a Baptist preacher who predicted the Second Coming would happen on October 22 this year, are disappointed when the world does not, in fact, end on that exact date. Those among his flock who manage to retain their faith would go on to become the Seventh-Day Adventists.

    The Unitarians drive home in Argentina, bulldozing the increasingly disorganized and ill-motivated Rosista resistance at Devoto, Ataliva and Cululu within the first three months of the year. Santa Fe's Governor is deposed and executed in a coup by Rosista defectors, and his replacement immediately surrenders to Lavalle's advancing forces. At the fortified border town Cepeda between Santa Fe and Buenos Aires, 'Lamarck' successfully held off the 3,000-strong Unitarian vanguard under Gabriel Maria Solis with the Regimiento de Halcones in a grueling nine-hour battle, but the Hawks in turn were effectively destroyed as a fighting force with 757 casualties (222 of them expiring due to mortal injuries) out of their remaining 800 men; realizing that the fight was over in all but name, Watteau promptly fled with a few of his remaining expatriate French officers to Brazil, where they caught a cruise back to France and quietly resumed their old identities by the year's end. On July 18th, Rosas ordered the garrison of Buenos Aires to sally forth and make a last stand against the Unitarians at Caseros, which they did - while he surrendered to the British blockade of Buenos Aires in hopes of being allowed to live in exile, only to be handed over to the victorious Lavalle and executed after a five-minute trial for treason anyway.

    With the Rosistas finally defeated, Lavalle promptly declared the dissolution of Rosas' Argentine Confederation and its replacement with the 'Union of Argentina', with a(n almost immediately ignored) Constitution founded on Unitarian principles and imposed from the top down. His regime would be...almost identical to that of Rosas, with a few key differences: 1) he had a beard, and 2) he was slightly less egotistical and repressive than Rosas. While it was true that Lavalle did not demand people venerate his portraits in churches, that he invited the Jesuits back into Argentina, and that he definitely didn't require all Argentinian men to wear a beard like he does, the fact remained that criticism of his regime was illegal, the old Rosista red flags had vanished only to be replaced with Unitarian blue banners instead, the promised elections were definitely not forthcoming, and that the only difference between Rosas's time as its Governor and Lavalle's as the first President of Argentina under the new constitution regarding the central government at Buenos Aires is that now it's one in name as well as fact. When the Federalist governors of Entre Rios and Corrientes, who had stayed loyal to Rosas to the bitter end, continued to revolt against his dictatorship, Lavalle named Bonaparte and Solis the Unitarian Governors of the two states, respectively and sent them to subdue the rebels with 8,000 men apiece. While Solis gladly accepted his appointment, Bonaparte did so only because with the Winter King still alive and out for his blood, there was no way he could return to France at this time.

    Meet the new boss, (almost the) same as the old boss: A comparison of Argentina under Rosas and under Lavalle
    The Argentine Confederation of Juan Manuel de Rosas

    The Argentine Union of Juan Lavalle

    1845: Game start.

    Suffice to say that there is quite the big surprise for you guys in this last entry, something that will make unifying the entire continent under the Stars & Stripes a good deal easier I also need the Texan players' reaction to that Mexican raid in 1842 btw, historically it led to the Somervell/Mier Expedition.
    Last edited by Barry Goldwater; April 19, 2014 at 09:33 PM.

  9. #109
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    And now, the character ethnicities & religions.

    Ethnicities
    Yankee: You're an American of primarily English stock and come from the New England states of Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Maine, New Hampshire and Vermont. You're likely part of the progressive cutting edge in America, always on the forefront of any fight for social justice - whether it's the abolitionist crusade against slavery, temperance, women's suffrage, toleration for Catholics, etc. On the matter of abolitionism, you're likely to go a step further than most other abolitionists outside of New England and call for equal civil rights as well. That said, if you happen to belong to the business elite, few will expect you to support economic welfare for anyone beyond what's needed to secure their support for your other political programs; as far as your fellow Yankee plutocrats are concerned, that's the social version of making a good investment, but should well be the extent of their charity. You are especially likely to have been a merchant and/or naval officer; your political views are likely to stray towards the radical end of the spectrum, but favor centralization (ex. sweeping federal powers, a strong standing military in peacetime, taxes ranging from moderate to borderline oppressive, a national bank); and you are likely to be a Presbyterian, Congregationalist or some kind of Liberal Christian.

    Tuckahoe: You're an American of primarily English stock and come from the coastal (ie. suitable for plantations) areas of the Southern states of Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana. You are likely part of the conservative wing of American politics, looking down on the filthy masses of Yankee scum who threaten your Peculiar Institution and possibly even the 'white trash' from the backwoods of your states who are barely a step above the Negro in your eyes, unless you happen to be a populist (or not even then, if you're an insincere populist who just wants the votes of poor whites) and always out to look for opportunities to snap up more slave states to expand your power-bloc on the federal level. You are especially likely to have been a major planter prior to the war, the mirror image of the landed gentry across the Atlantic; your political views are likely to stray towards the conservative end of the spectrum, though you can favor centralization as long as it's clear the defense of slavery is going to be a key role of that central authority, and you're likely to favor expansion both West and South to extend the reach of Slave Power; and you are likely to be an Episcopalian or Southern Baptist.

    Cohee: You're an American of mixed Scottish and Irish heritage from the backwoods of Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana. You hate everyone who ain't one of your people - the eggheaded elitist Yankee bankers and industrialists of the Northeast, the arrogant planters who lord it over you like they're a bunch of kings, and the Negro slaves who are lower than dirt - and thus you - and who you can still safely look down on; the big question is, who do you hate least? Because that's the group you'll find your greatest allies in. You are likely to be a soldier, a yeoman farmer or if you've really lucked out, a planter; your political view is likely conservative, but with a good dose of populism and expansionism both to the West and the South; and you are especially likely to be a Southern Baptist.

    Middle American: You're an American of primarily English stock and come from the central states of New York, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Maryland and Delaware. You're the most versatile of your countrymen, politically speaking - you can be for or against slavery to any extent, for or against the integration of immigrants to any extent, for or against a Bank to any extent, whatever. When it comes to your job, likewise you can work as almost anything, except obvious no-gos like that of a Native Leader. If there's any real political fault that can be associated with your people, it's that they're kind of...bland compared to everyone else. You can be of any religion besides Native Spirituality, though Quakers are especially common in Pennsylvania for obvious reasons.

    Midwesterner: You're an American of primarily English stock and come from the Midwestern states of Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, oand Michigan. Yours is a people known for their extremes - you're either a hardcore abolitionist who believes blacks should be free from the chains of slavery (civil rights optional), or you're somebody who would get along very well with the planter barons of Dixie; you either adore the federal government or loathe it to bits; you're either a friend of the Catholic immigrants or a staunch nativist who would tremendously appreciate it if they crawled back to whatever hell they came from; and so on - there's very little middle ground in the ironically named Midwest. You are especially likely to have been a soldier or yeoman farmer before the war; your political views are likely to stray towards the radical ends of the spectrum, though the one thing you can agree on is that the US should expand out west to the Pacific; and you're likely to be any brand of Protestant.

    Irish-American: You're a recent Irish-American immigrant, likely driven here by the policies of the British government back on the Emerald Isle. The so-called 'native' Americans look down on you for your poor origins, foreignness and (most likely) Catholic faith, but in turn you're just waiting for the day when you can achieve the American dream and laugh in their faces. You're especially likely to be a Catholic of humble origins; your beliefs will tend towards the fiscally liberal and socially conservative ends of the spectrum; and you're likely to be a Federalist or Whig, depending on whether you're still stuck in the lower classes or managed to climb up to the middle class respectively - they are after all the only parties who don't inherently loathe your guts.

    German-American: You're a recent German immigrant. Maybe you fled political persecution for your liberal leanings back home, or you were just some poor nobody from a family of poor nobodies who just wanted to live a better life like the Irish. Also like the Irish, you're hated by an awful lot of the so-called 'native' Americans who call you 'Dutch' (a corruption of Deutsch), but you intend to show them all up one day. You're more likely to hail from the Northern or Mid-Atlantic states than the South and to have come from either middle-class (if you're a liberal intellectual) or poor (if you're not) origins; you trend economically and socially liberal; and you are equally likely to either be Catholic, or to belong to one of the many Protestant sects.

    Anglo-Canadian: You're a Canadian of primarily English, Irish or Scottish stock, likely to hail from the new states of Canada/New Brunswick/Nova Scotia/Newfoundland/PEI. Your ancestors might've fought for Britain, but when they were repaid with martial law and a shutdown of their traditional British liberties you decided maybe your distant American cousins were on to something after all. You are likely to be a yeoman farmer if poor, a rising business tycoon if you come from the bourgeoisie, or a gentleman if you're from a landowning family; you are likely to be an economic conservative, but are open to Catholics (hey, you've had to live with them for neighbors for almost 100 years now) and are probably staunchly abolitionist; and you are likely to be an Episcopalian, that is to say an Anglican with the serial numbers filed off, or else some kind of Protestant (including the Liberal Christian traditions).

    French-Canadian: You're a Canadian of French heritage, most likely coming from the new state of Quebec but also possibly from Canada or Nova Scotia (if you're a surviving Acadian). Turns out the British had no intention of giving up their oppressive policies, so you've decided that maybe the Americans to the south were right after all - and though a lot of them don't seem that friendly to Catholics, the 'Federalists' who reached out to your people sure are, and they don't seem to be some easily ignored minority either. You're likely to be either an urban-based businessman or a seigneur (hereditary landowner) from the countryside; you'll likely be a liberal progressive if you come from bourgeoisie roots or a stolid Catholic conservative if you hail from the seigneurial elite; and whether you agree with the Church's temporal power or not, you're almost certainly a Catholic like your forefathers, considering that Protestant immigration to Quebec was banned under French rule and few bothered to make the move except to set up new businesses under the British.

    Creole: You're a free fellow of wealth and power, likely to be of mixed race (even if it's just one black ancestor from over 100 years ago) and to hail from Louisiana. Your ancestors were mainly French and/or Spanish settlers, and you might well look lily-white, but it wouldn't surprise you if somewhere back in the family tree you had a black or Indian ancestor; while the Spanish and French governed Louisiana this wasn't a problem, but then the States made their Louisiana Purchase and brought their bizarre concepts of race and a so-called 'one-drop rule' into play. Irregardless of that however, you've managed to hold on to a measure of power in Louisiana with the help of your fellow Creoles, both the lily-whites and those of mixed race (gens du coeleur libres) alike. You're likely to either be an urban businessman or a planter; politically, you'll trend conservative and might well support slavery, but will likely support protection for Catholics; and you are most likely to be Catholic, Episcopalian or to belong to a Liberal Christian sect if you happen to oppose slavery especially fiercely.

    African-American: You're a free black man. Whether you were born free or became that way (legally or illegally), you've now become politically active. You may be descended from the Maroon community that came here from Jamaica, or you may simply come from 'native-born' African-American stock; you can hail from (or at least have fled/moved to) the North - it's not like the Southern states are going to let any free black man step up and speak his mind after all - but especially New England, the Canadian states or the Midwest, where anti-slavery sentiments are strongest (though it's also less safe to voice them in that last one); and you can follow any religion, though you're not at all likely to be an Atheist/Agnostic - if nothing else, your people are known for their fierce religious devotion even in the face of systematic oppression. You are especially unlikely to get along with any planters regardless of ethnicity or creed, and though you will heavily favor radical politics & can be of a centralist or anti-centralist tendency, the nationwide abolition of slavery in whatever country arises from this mess (enforced by gunpoint if necessary) is extremely likely to be your highest priority.

    Native American: You're a Native American from a tribe living in American borders, such as the Cherokee, Seminole, Comanche, etc. The Americans have had a mixed record when it comes to dealing with your people at the best of times, but for whatever reason you have decided that continuing to side with them is the best way forward for your people as a whole. You're especially likely to hail from the Western Frontier for obvious reasons; you're likely to follow one of the Protestant sects or your traditional Native Spirituality; and you will probably favor decentralization alongside radical or conservative politics. Whether you define yourself as a conservative or radical though, the settlement of new treaties forbidding further white migrations into your lands should be your highest long-term priority, for obvious reasons.

    Religions
    Episcopalian: You are an Episcopalian. Prior to the outbreak of the American Revolution/the Canadian Flip your forefathers were Anglicans of variable devotion, but since it's rather difficult to continue calling themselves that while they're also making war upon the British King, they opted to transfer their prayers and oaths to the cause of America while still preserving as much of the central hierarchy & traditions of the Anglican Communion as they could - and as a man of tradition you've followed in their footsteps. You are likely to be a moderate or conservative, and especially likely to be wealthy and/or Southern (or Canadian).

    Lutheran/Reformed: You're what one could call a 'normal' Protestant, or in other words, part of the religious majority of the United States - Lutherans, Presbyterians, (normal) Baptists, Congregationalists, what have you. You are likely to have come from a poor or middle-class background in contrast to the primarily upper-class Episcopalians, and to favor moderate or radical policies. You may believe that any future central government should be weak, as surely as your church does not rely on any intricate hierarchy, or you may not allow your faith to have any place in your politics at all; you are generally not likely to be as fanatical as your Calvinist cousins, to be sure.

    Calvinist: You are part of one of America's many Calvinist churches and sects. You are an heir to the Puritan tradition of the 16th and 17th centuries, the same zealously disciplined men and women who set up communities such as the ever-famous Plymouth. You are almost assuredly a zealous believer, perhaps even an outright fanatic who wants to see everyone else converted or destroyed, but one who favors the same decentralizing tendencies mirroring the lack of organized hierarchy in your faith. You're not at all likely to get along with those of other faiths, especially not the Papists you fully expect to sell the Revolution out to the Roman Antichrist or those supposed 'Episcopalians' who are in truth Anglicans.

    Southern Baptist: You belong to the Southern Baptist Convention, which has recently split from the Baptist Triennial Convention over the issue of slavery - specifically, the other Baptists weren't willing to outright endorse it, and instead contented themselves with a stance of neutrality. Don't those fools know that God hates those too weak to make a choice between good and evil just as much, if not more, than He surely hates those who actually are evil, like those damned abolitionists? Your church infuses pro-slavery rhetoric with fire-and-brimstone teachings, and it shows in your reactionary opinions on things besides slavery too. Southern Baptists obviously should come from the Southern states.

    Liberal Christian: You belong to one of the newer, more liberal Christian sects, such as the Society of Friends (Quakers), Unitarianism (which argues against a Trinitarian concept of God) or the Universalist Church that stresses universal reconciliation (the idea that all things, regardless of whatever sins they've committed, will eventually return to God's fold). These churches are most popular in the Northern and Western United States, as opposed to the Episcopalian hierarchical church or fire-and-brimstone sects that dominate in the South. Needless to say, as a follower of these liberal churches, you're likely to have liberal political beliefs yourself, chiefly the abolition of slavery in the United States.

    Catholic: You're a Catholic, a fast-growing minority in America at this time. In many states you are looked upon with suspicion at best, at worst the same crowd of so-called 'nativists' keep burning down your business, but in Canada and the cities of New England at least you can find acceptance; across the other Northeastern states, Maryland and the Midwest, your brothers and sisters in the Church have had to battle these 'natives' for acceptance, sometimes and hopefully always with the ballot box, but all too often with the bullet box. You may be an ordinary believer or a zealot, but either way you're likely to be Irish or French, to favor government protections for your faith and perhaps even for other religious minorities, and to have little love for those close-minded Calvinist and Southern Baptist fanatics, truly Cromwell and his Puritan boors reborn.

    Native Spirituality: You follow the spiritual traditions of your people, the same traditions they were practicing well before the strange white invaders came with their One God and His Son. You might be animists, or you might have tribal shamans, or what have you - it all really depends on which tribe you come from. Either way, you've got to be a Native American to have this religious background.

    Mormon: You're a Mormon! Congratulations, everyone else hates you. And for what reason? Sure, you follow a different creed than they, so different in fact that they say your people aren't even Christians at all, but then doesn't the First Amendment guarantee your freedom of religion? Unfortunately, intensive persecution and a lack of government response has forced you to relocate from state to state, and now this piece of probably-uninhabited land way out into the west your leaders are calling 'Deseret' is looking mighty fine indeed. You're likely to come from the Midwest or Far West.

    Atheist/Agnostic: You follow no creed, in truth an agnostic or outright atheist. How can you be expected to follow something you have no physical evidence for? God and the gods are for the superstitious commons to follow, not a man of reason like you, no - if there's anything you believe in, it's human reason & will, and (probably, unless you're an extreme skeptic) the physical universe around you. You're more likely to be a Northern Thinker than a Southern one, those weak-kneed fools who can't seem to live without the concept of any deity to cling to.

    Jobs...I haven't written them all up yet, but you can probably figure what they entail from their names: Business Tycoon, Gentleman (covering Quebecois seigneurs, Southern planters and big landowners in general for the purposes of game mechanics, particular your income), Preacher, Yeoman Farmer, Lawyer, Doctor, Scholar, Soldier, Workers' Leader.

    Edit: Oh, and issues. I forgot the issues. These are what I've got for now:

    Issues
    (Federalist positions are in orange, Whig positions are in brown, Democratic positions are in blue, multicolored positions can be held by multiple camps, red = an unpopular position that can nevertheless theoretically be held by anyone from any party)

    Central Government: Sweeping federal powers, commitment to fight slavery-->Sweeping federal powers, commitment to restrict slavery-->Balance of powers-->Weak federal gov't-->Weak federal gov't except to defend/expand slavery-->Sweeping federal powers, commitment to defend/expand slavery

    Religious relations: Harmonious religious mosaic-->Grudging tolerance of all other faiths-->Strict neutrality-->Establishment of a Protestant national church-->Active discrimination against non-Protestants

    Tariffs: High tariffs-->Moderate tariffs-->Low tariffs-->No tariffs

    Slavery: Total, uncompensated abolition-->Total, compensated abolition-->Free soil, no abolition-->Popular sovereignty-->No abolition-->Expansion of slavery to the Territories-->Expansion of slavery beyond territorial and racial bounds

    Immigration: Open immigration-->Lightly limited immigration-->Heavily restricted immigration-->Shut down immigration entirely

    Military: Strong standing military-->Mix of federal & volunteer forces/state militias-->Reliance on state militias & volunteers

    Social welfare: Socialist manifestos are the truth-->Limited welfare networks (ex. through political machines/churches) are acceptable-->All men must stand on their own feet

    National Bank: The Bank must survive-->The Bank must die

    Foreign relations: Peaceful coexistence-->Expansion for free states-->Realpolitik-->Expansion for Manifest Destiny's sake-->Expansion for slave states

    If anyone has anything they'd like to see added, go ahead and tell me.
    Last edited by Barry Goldwater; May 15, 2014 at 11:46 AM.

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    Agamemnon's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Would "Socialist manifestos are the truth" truly be a Whig position? I can see it being a Democratic position (albeit a purely Northeastern Democratic position), but I really can't imagine the heavily-free-soil, rich-industrialist-backed, soon-to-become-Republican-Party Whigs supporting that position. Really, for the 1840s US, it shouldn't even be on the spectrum yet.

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    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    Would "Socialist manifestos are the truth" truly be a Whig position? I can see it being a Democratic position (albeit a purely Northeastern Democratic position), but I really can't imagine the heavily-free-soil, rich-industrialist-backed, soon-to-become-Republican-Party Whigs supporting that position. Really, for the 1840s US, it shouldn't even be on the spectrum yet.
    Tbh, I don't really know if it has a specific place on this spectrum. The Federalists might be the party of liberal intellectuals, immigrants & blacks, but the ones who are really pulling their strings are the Northeastern plutocracy who, as a rule, aren't exactly going to be sympathetic to a welfare state; and the Democrats are the party of nativists and Southern slavocrats, who again are not likely to be particularly friendly to cries for state welfare. I picked the Whigs since as they're the party of everyone and 'everyone' is a category that can possibly include the proto-socialists of this time, but I can simply color this position in red and allow anyone from any party to take it even if it means you'll get dismissed as a loony by everyone else when it comes to economics (think everyone else's opinions regarding Mormons on theological matters) I'd imagine at this point socialist or proto-socialist manifestos would include stuff like 8-10 hour workdays, higher wages, safer working conditions etc. and that they'd be around since after all, Commonwealth v. Hunt still happened in 1842.

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    Agamemnon's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    I see. Eh, I doubt many players would be for it, but coloring it in red and allowing it for anyone (though I think perhaps it should be anyone in the Northeast or another heavy industry area) would be better than making it exclusively Whig.

    So, forgive me for not reading closely enough for this to be obvious, but the Federalists didn't die? So the Whigs aren't the Federalists? I'm really getting confused here as to who the Whigs of IRL are in this timeline, if the Federalists are still a thing.

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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Barry...can a Rondelle be the first U.S. governor of Quebec?

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    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Nope. To summarize:

    -The Federalists didn't die, they're still the big-city/New-England-based pro-centralism party. They're run by Yankee big-business barons who've been intelligent enough to scrap together an alliance of liberal intellectuals, immigrant workers and blacks (much harder than it sounds) around a platform of a strong central government, vague promises of welfare + actual pseudo-welfare dispensed through political machines (think a mix of Napoleon III's 'Extinction of Pauperism' + Boss Tweed), a hard line on abolition, opposition to expansionism/expanding only to make free states, and swearing to defend the religious and cultural rights of minorities. Historically immigrants and blacks were at each other's throats as they competed for jobs, but ITL the Federalists were around to bind both together with a mix of the aforementioned pseudo-welfare and rhetoric branding Southern slavocrats and nativists in general as their class enemies instead of ya know, the big plutocrats running the FP; their political machines help out the immigrants as machines like Tammany Hall did OTL, and blacks sometimes got a nice deal on land (based off of RL dealings by rich abolitionists, see the year 1836 here) that also conveniently get them out of the immigrants' way.

    Tl;dr they're the progressive party at every level, except economically (at the top anyway, what with being run by Yankee plutocrats just before the Gilded Age, the rank and file might also buy into economic progressivism). They're also considerably more progressive than a lot of RL abolitionists were, featuring a large contingent that believes in getting civil rights for blacks on top of emancipation - when I said race politics would become much more radical due to butterflies from the Maroon Question, I meant it'd cut both ways too after all.

    -The Whigs are the moderate party of compromises. They take in basically everyone from fiercely egalitarian abolitionists who don't like a strong central government, to moderate slavers who do like a strong central government, to pro-Bank Free Soilers, to anti-bank business moguls. Unfortunately this has the side effect of making it really easy for the Feds & Dems to paint them as a schizophrenic mess that doesn't really stand for anything, and trying to get their constituent elements to work together is like herding cats. At their best days you can say they're the party that stands for small business, small government, and an approach to slavery that probably won't rip the Union to shreds. At their worst, see what the Feds and Dems would say about it. I guess a good comparison would be the historical Constitutional Unionists, except broader, less extreme (since they're in a less extreme situation...for now) and less impotent.

    -The Democrats are the conservative party of farmers and slavery. Historically they had an edge in the big cities due to support from immigrants, but as I just explained the Federalists just took that away, so the Dems are stuck appealing to the exact opposite crowd - nativists. They're a coalition of nativists, rural Americans both large and small, extreme expansionists and ideological defenders of slavery. Thus far, only that third and to a lesser extent first group has allowed them to get any support outside of the South, they're becoming a sectional party even faster than the Feds are (farmers who don't like the Bank & other centralist measures but aren't obsessed about slavery can just go to the Whigs).

    EDIT: @Rose Probably not, Quebec just got integrated really recently (1842, so three years before the start of the game) so a Rondelle Governor would likely be still be sitting in that unplayable position as of game start, according to Wiki apparently Premiers can serve 'at Her Majesty's pleasure' but that's obviously not possible any longer so I've gone with the maximum five-year gaps between general elections as the term limit for Quebecois Governors. The Rondelles can become Governors of Quebec further down the timeline though, naturally.
    Last edited by Barry Goldwater; April 19, 2014 at 10:47 PM.

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    Agamemnon's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Also, my response would probably be to send out troops to stop the raiders, as you can't just invade people like that. I'd also try to ask the US at least for military aid since Mexico is being a dick, if not annexation.

    EDIT: With that explanation, it sounds like the "National Republican" faction of the DRs became the Whigs like IRL, and for some odd reason the Progressive Party took over the Federalists. So basically my char is a Whig who goes by Democrat because everyone in Texas is Southern. It's kinda like modern Detroit then.
    Last edited by Agamemnon; April 19, 2014 at 10:43 PM.

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    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Well, kind of. The Whigs are a merger of most of the Low Federalists & National Republicans who bolted after their respective parties started taking much harder lines on the question of slavery, the High Federalists + the fraction of loyal Low Federalists + politics shifting over the years = the progressive Federalists you now see before you. Apply the same formula, in the opposite direction, to the D-Rs and you get the hyperreactionary, nativist and racist Democrats.

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    Watercress's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    There's no mention of it in the timeline, but has the colonisation of Liberia precoded as OTL? I always had in mind the Lamberths continually pushing for 'repatriation' over the decades, possibly becoming major patrons of the American Colonisation Society.

    "Only Connect!...Only connect the prose and the passion, and both will be exalted, and human love will be seen at its height. Live in fragments no longer."

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    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Watercress View Post
    There's no mention of it in the timeline, but has the colonisation of Liberia precoded as OTL? I always had in mind the Lamberths continually pushing for 'repatriation' over the decades, possibly becoming major patrons of the American Colonisation Society.
    Actually, I was thinking it might've happened a bit earlier, say 1815 or '16 (under the post-1812 Federalist presidency) with Liberia declaring independence around 1830-40. That said, an earlier start also means the problems of colonization (too expensive, too many blacks to transport, lack of locations to actually put the transported blacks in Africa since local tribes generally didn't want anything to do with them, mounting opposition from basically everyone else from abolitionists & freedmen who believe blacks can be integrated into society + slavers who are willing to kill fellow Southerners to keep their property) will manifest themselves much more quickly, and combined with the rapid radicalization of race politics on both ends in WEF we could see the advocates of colonization shrinking to impotency on the edges of American politics by the start of the 1840s.

    Heck you could have a Lamberth actually become the President of the ACS in the timeline if you want Suggestions for dates to mark the progress of (or lack thereof) the colonization efforts would be most welcome as well.

    BTW, since you're keeping the Lamberths - any other Great Man positions you'd be up for running for in addition to the 2nd Presidency? You could even run to be Polk's replacement and thus POTUS when this game gets going in late May/June, give Perry some competition in that regard b/c right now he's the only other guy running for that seat
    Last edited by Barry Goldwater; April 20, 2014 at 05:07 PM.

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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Goldwater View Post
    Actually, I was thinking it might've happened a bit earlier, say 1815 or '16 (under the post-1812 Federalist presidency) with Liberia declaring independence around 1830-40. That said, an earlier start also means the problems of colonization (too expensive, too many blacks to transport, lack of locations to actually put the transported blacks in Africa since local tribes generally didn't want anything to do with them, mounting opposition from basically everyone else from abolitionists & freedmen who believe blacks can be integrated into society + slavers who are willing to kill fellow Southerners to keep their property) will manifest themselves much more quickly, and combined with the rapid radicalization of race politics on both ends in WEF we could see the advocates of colonization shrinking to impotency on the edges of American politics by the start of the 1840s.

    Heck you could have a Lamberth actually become the President of the ACS in the timeline if you want Suggestions for dates to mark the progress of (or lack thereof) the colonization efforts would be most welcome as well.

    BTW, since you're keeping the Lamberths - any other Great Man positions you'd be up for running for in addition to the 2nd Presidency? You could even run to be Polk's replacement and thus POTUS when this game gets going in late May/June, give Perry some competition in that regard b/c right now he's the only other guy running for that seat
    That could work. I can definitely see Lamberth I as a major figure in the Society, in addition to other, Jefferson-esque post-presidential projects, before dying in the 1810s or so.

    The general plan I had with the Lamberths was thus:

    Lamberth leaves behind James Lamberth, his only son, born in the 1771. He's a more conservative, southern figure, who would be a Federalist like his father, but would almost certainly defect to the Whigs as the Federalists become more abolitionist. Indeed, I imagine the Lamberths becoming something of a central pillar of the party, leading Southern Whigs. He could serve as President X8, as the author of the Missouri Compromise, and anything else he might be useful for. He would probably have passed away shortly before the game start.

    James would have two sons in the 1800s, a more moderate elder and more conservative younger. These would be my main characters at the game start. The elder could possibly serve as Daniel Webster, rejoining the Federalists but still committed to compromise, or simply standing as an aristocratic, strong-government Whig. The younger probably would have joined the Democrats, and may also serve as James Hammond, although he may not be best placed as a radical pro-slavery campaigner as a Virginian, and a member of the one most famously Federalist families in America. Polk would probably be more suitable, although he may be a bit young for the Presidency just yet.

    They too would have children, the moderate with two sons, the elder preparing for life in politics beginning at the local level in Virginia, the younger a rash, brash, and fiercely southern West Point graduate. The conservative would also have a son, probably a teen at game start.

    Marital links with other families, particularly the Wallaces and Rondelles, would also be welcome.
    Last edited by Watercress; April 20, 2014 at 06:20 PM.

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    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Watercress View Post
    That could work. I can definitely see Lamberth I as a major figure in the Society, in addition to other, Jefferson-esque post-presidential projects, before dying in the 1810s or so.

    The general plan I had with the Lamberths was thus:

    Lamberth leaves behind James Lamberth, his only son, born in the 1771. He's a more conservative, southern figure, who would be a Federalist like his father, but would almost certainly defect to the Whigs as the Federalists become more abolitionist. Indeed, I imagine the Lamberths becoming something of a central pillar of the party, leading Southern Whigs. He could serve as President X8, as the author of the Missouri Compromise, and anything else he might be useful for. He would probably have passed away shortly before the game start.

    James would have two sons in the 1800s, a more moderate elder and more conservative younger. These would be my main characters at the game start. The elder could possibly serve as Daniel Webster, rejoining the Federalists but still committed to compromise, or simply standing as an aristocratic, strong-government Whig. The younger probably would have joined the Democrats, and may also serve as James Hammond, although he may not be best placed as a radical pro-slavery campaigner as a Virginian, and a member of the one most famously Federalist families in America. Polk would probably be more suitable, although he may be a bit young for the Presidency just yet.

    They too would have children, the moderate with two sons, the elder preparing for life in politics beginning at the local level in Virginia, the younger a rash, brash, and fiercely southern West Point graduate. The conservative would also have a son, probably a teen at game start.

    Marital links with other families, particularly the Wallaces and Rondelles, would also be welcome.
    Alright, that works out. I've tacked on a 'Sweeping federal powers, commitment to defend/expand slavery' option to cover extreme Democrats who have no problems with say, the Fugitive Slave Act or carrying the future not-Dred Scott to its logical conclusion & forcing all states to permit slavery but in the time where race politics are just starting to radicalize (late 1810s to early 20s, until the 'Great Realignment' results in the Federalist/D-R system breaking down) I can see James Lamberth simply becoming a strong-government Whig instead of a full-blown Dem. While he probably can't be X8 - if there's a pro-slavery Federalist in the Presidential Mansion the abolitionist faction wouldn't have had the power & influence to take control of the party in the first place - he can definitely be the author of the Missouri Compromise (possibly jointly with Amsel-as-our-Clay, unless you want him to run for the position of Clay himself), following in his dad's footsteps as the broker of compromises.

    If you're going for a Polk character, the minimum age to become POTUS is 35, so as long as he was born in or before 1809 (making him 35 as of the 1844 election, and 36 as of the 1845 start) the Democratic brother is fit. Just a minor tidbit, but I've decided to move the USMA of WEF-America to Legionville, since thanks to our Whiskey Rebellion it's become much more important to the country while West Point isn't quite as notable, and its position near to the 1792 Frontier might help mend relations between east & west following a bloodier WR.

    If you're after NPC marital links to complement the PC ones, Virginia's divided between the Whig Drummonds and Democratic Shieldses. Both are powerful planter families, but the latter are anti-strong government pro-slavery types who nevertheless hold themselves to high standards of honor and treat even their slaves with a measure of courtesy, the latter are pro-strong government and extremely pro-slavery but are also your stereotypical slimy politicians hiding behind a mask of virtue x11 + Southern accents I'll post both at a later date, the next family on the docket are the South Carolina Rutledges, who are the polar opposites of the Bay State Sakers.

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